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Does anyone NOT drive with regen braking? What about creep mode?

Discussion in 'Australia & New Zealand' started by ZTrekus, Jun 5, 2015.

  1. ZTrekus

    ZTrekus Member

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    #1 ZTrekus, Jun 5, 2015
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2015
    My first electric car was a Prius. They seemed to go to great lengths to make it simulate an ICE car and so the regen braking with foot off the pedals was extremely light. The Prius actually regenerates the battery when you actually apply the brake lightly. It also has a gear stick that you can put in B mode (for braking) which simulates low gear - useful for going down hills.

    Then I got the i3, and the regen braking is extremely severe. There is no regen braking when you apply the brake, that just makes you stop quicker (and you never use it). The regen braking is so severe when you take your foot off the accelerator that it will actually bring the car to a complete stop very quickly. And there is no creep mode on the i3. When the car comes to a complete stop by itself (no foot on any pedal) - it stays stopped unless of course it is on a steep hill which naturally overcomes the strength of the regen braking - and even then it moves slowly.

    I test-drove a Tesla twice. The regen braking is also severe but not as severe as the i3. I put that down simply to the fact that the Tesla weighs 2.5 tonnes but the i3 is as light as a feather (made out of plastic).

    Anyway, Tesla (being the first) has introduced a whole new way of driving - some people call it one pedal driving. So you never use the brakes. Just press to accelerate, hold to cruise and lift to brake. This whole new way is extremely easy to adapt to and I believe is the preferred method of driving. So much so actually that when people start driving an ICE car after they have been driving their EV for a while, they really miss the fact that the car doesn't slow down when foot is off the accelerator. It almost feels dangerous. (You have to hand it to EVs - they not only speed up quickly, they slow down just as fast! That is a terrific advantage I believe).

    However, unlike the i3, the Tesla gives you the option of actually turning off the regen braking. So my question here is, "Does anyone actually turn off the regen braking?"

    If so, why? Is there ever a reason to turn it off and on according to circumstances? What circumstances are those? I am prepared to bet that most people would actually prefer that the regen braking was even more severe. Any takers on that one?

    For that matter, does anyone drive with creep mode on or off and why? I have come to like the no creep mode on the i3. It leaves you perfectly in control of the car. Yes even for reverse parking. I am intending to leave creep off on the Tesla. But that is all subject of course to real life experimentation. What have you folks found?
     
  2. MDK

    MDK Aussie Member

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    You can't turn regen off completely, but you can reduce it (by setting it to "low")
    Except when you charge your battery to 100% (which I've only done once) - there's nowhere for the energy to go so there's no regen for the first 10-15km. No fun at all!

    I love the regen, and would happily take more if it was available.

    I've never used creep mode and I love the way I can inch along as slow as I want with a light touch of the pedal.
     
  3. TheDane

    TheDane Member

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    I love regen.

    As for creep. I tried it for a few days. Didn't like it. Never owned an automatic car, so I didn't felt home using it. I prefer accelerator pedal for accelerating (in either direction), and brake pedal for braking, not for braking and creeping. But each to his own, so it's good we have the options.
     
  4. Dborn

    Dborn Confirmed

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    Started with creep mode on. Turned it off about a month in and it is off now. I old prefer stronger regen. There are times when the regen is maximum, the car is still going pretty fast like down hill when you have recently been accelerating That I find myself using the friction brakes quite hard.
     
  5. MartinAustin

    MartinAustin Active Member

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    I love regen! Would never want to drive without it (even if the Tesla Model S could be configured to work without it... which it can't)

    Driving without using regen costs you money in two places:
    a) you have to put more energy into the car because you're never generating any yourself
    b) you wear your brake parts down faster, and hence you bring forward the time at which you need to pay for more

    Driving without regen lowers the comfort of your ride. The Tesla Model S has a near-seamless change between regen and powered driving. (I used to think it was seamless until after I'd been driving it 18 months after which I could detect a tiny abberation through the pedal as you switch back and forth) Skilled drivers can prevent passengers from knowing what mode the car is in. If you're deliberately moving your foot back and forth between accelerator and brake pedals, there is no way to avoid the increased g-forces associated with the changeovers.

    I have gone back and forth with Creep Mode... sometimes I drive with it on for a few weeks, then I do a few weeks with it off. The problem for me is ramps and roadways that aren't perfectly level (in the direction the car is pointing). If you stop the car, say, at a traffic light or stop sign, and the roadway isn't perfectly level, the car starts to roll forward or backward once you take your foot off the brake. Basically you have to hold your foot on the brake, and at that point, Creep Mode on/off is irrelevant. For areas where you can stop on perfectly level ground, I'd agree that disabling Creep Mode gives you a silky-smooth stops and starts that you can control yourself.

    I actually wish that the "brake hold" feature could be implemented to work all the time - especially when Creep Mode is disabled. This would allow the car to be held on the brake all the time when you're stopped.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Consider this - some have asked for more regen, and I can understand that. However, regen is applied to the battery through the built-in power electronics, which take the AC power generated and turn it back to DC to charge the battery. The "chargers" you connect to your home wall socket can each take 10KW. Two of them allow for 20KW charging. Have you ever looked at the dashboard display during regen? You can put up to 60KW into the battery. This is three times what the HPWC can supply. Pretty strong. Superchargers put a maximum of 120-135KW in there. So the regen is actually pretty strong... not sure it would be technically possible, or financially attractive to buyers, to put in the electronics to allow stronger regen.
     
  6. doctorwho

    doctorwho Member

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    +1 for brake hold
     
  7. ZTrekus

    ZTrekus Member

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    I agree with your comments AM about how powerful regen braking is. I do believe it would take a lot more than a mere software upgrade to increase it.

    I think everyone agrees that the regen braking plays a major role in the pleasant driving experience of the Tesla. That is why I was challenging anyone to come forward and say why they would not have it set to high. Most newbies may appreciate the quick acceleration of a Tesla. But I say it is the quick deceleration due to regen braking that really and truly makes the difference. It's what makes the car more responsive, less dangerous, and feels more safe too being able to speed up and slow down in such short distances - all without using the brake.

    In an ice car, no one likes burning off at lights only to have to slam on the brakes for the next set of lights. No trouble for the Tesla. The speeding up and slowing down is all the one manoeuvre and without the use of any brakes.
     
  8. scaesare

    scaesare Active Member

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    I convinced my buddy to buy a Model S. I found out he was driving around on low-regen so the feel wouldn't be too different from his other car ( hw was worried about depending on the regen braking in his ICE and potentially getting to an accident).

    I convinced of the error of his ways, and now he loves the one-pedal driving experience...
     
  9. CatB

    CatB Member

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    Love regen :) I miss it so much when I have to drive the Prius.
    And I have creep on because backing into garage (over 2 concrete lips) without it is inconvenient. I wonder if standing still (at stoplights) would be more efficient if it were off.
     
  10. mknox

    mknox Well-Known Member

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    One of the "problems" with regen is that you get used to it. It has been mentioned that it is reduced when at 100% SOC, but it also gets reduced, in stages, with colder temperatures. I've left work in the winter with regen completely disabled and it can be downright scary. Because there isn't even the amount of friction you'd get with your foot off the gas in an ICE, the Model S feels almost like it's still under power when you take your foot off the accelerator with no regen.
     
  11. lonewolf313

    lonewolf313 Member

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    Hi All,

    I have seen most of the videos on Youtube from KmanAuto and Bjorn Nyland and with both these men driving in heavy snow during the winter months, I remember some videos saying they needed to change the regen settings to low because traction control is somehow affected if you drive with the standard regen setting on the car
     
  12. lonewolf313

    lonewolf313 Member

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  13. ZTrekus

    ZTrekus Member

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    #13 ZTrekus, Jun 5, 2015
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2015
    Thanks for that lonewolf313. He turned regen off because he said it was so strong that it caused him to skid in the snow, and almost through a couple of intersections.

    I noticed that with both the Prius and the i3, when you go over a bump, the regen cuts out for just a short time in order for the ABS breaking to work. Does this happen in the Tesla? It actually feels like the car accelerates, it zooms off by itself, kind of like a slipping feeling, but that is not really what is happening. Just that ABS and regen braking can't really work at the same time. So regen cuts out automatically. I remember in the early days the Prius had to be recalled in order for a software update to implement that feature.

    Now speaking of creep mode: my guess is that 50% of people have it on and the other half off. But I wonder how many people actually turn it on for some things and turn it off for others. I bet it is a personal preference for most people to have it set one way all the time. Ironically with creep mode on, when you are parking you are driving one peddle with the brake in an opposite fashion to one pedal driving with the accelerator. Ie, raise to move, press to stop. So natural, the brain has no confusion between the two. But I think I would prefer to keep creep mode off even when parking.

    How about a quick poll:

    ZTrekus: Regen On, Creep Off.
     
  14. raynewman

    raynewman Member

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    raynewman: ditto
     
  15. TesAus

    TesAus Member

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    Regen On, Creep On
     
  16. TES-E

    TES-E Member

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    Regen on... creep off.
     
  17. Dborn

    Dborn Confirmed

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    No creeps at my my place. Regen standard.
     
  18. doctorwho

    doctorwho Member

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    yes to regain, I've never driven an automatic car so creep was just scary
     
  19. Miggy

    Miggy Member

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    The best regen on the market is in the Outlander PHEV with paddle shifters that allow you to switch between five different regen settings.
     
  20. bhzmark

    bhzmark Active Member

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    tesla has a sort of paddle shift to turn regen off and coast. Slip the gear shift to neutral for no regen coasting. A paddle shift to simply turn off regen while still being in drive wld be better though. Modulating regen when you want it with the accel is better than paddle shifters I think.
     

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