Dragy GPS Times

[SD_Engnr]

Did you weigh the 20" sport or did you get these numbers somewhare?

I weighed the 20s, and they came in at 54.5lbs on my scale. I can't vouch for the accuracy of the scale, but wasn't too concerned. I was mostly using it to compare the delta between the stock wheels and my aftermarket wheels.

I'm a little surprised you didn't see improvement with the wider backs. I'd be very curious to see this setup on 1/4 mile as that has been where the P seems lacking (P and AWD are only 1s diff on 1/4, which shouldn't be the case).

As much as I'd love my P to be much faster than the AWD, the fact is they both have the same motors, and same batteries. The one second delta in the 1/4 mile is most likely due to the one second 0-60 delta. After that, it all seems to be equal.

I'd be curious to see if there's any acceleration differences in the 5-60, 30-60, 60-90 etc.

 

[Krash]

The one second delta in the 1/4 mile is most likely due to the one second 0-60 delta. After that, it all seems to be equal...

If that turns out to be true then the torque is set differently on the P but max power is set the same. I would be surprised that max power isn't lower on the non P.

 

[jrmnet]

About 15lbs total, including the wider wheels and tires.

View attachment 327254

Are those weights for the V-FF wheels in your chart reversed? The 9.5 is showing as 1 pound less.
I'm liking those wheels. Do you have a picture of your 3 with those wheels on?

 

[Daniel in SD]

If that turns out to be true then the torque is set differently on the P but max power is set the same. I would be surprised that max power isn't lower on the non P.

Tesla does report to the EPA that both front motors are 147kw but the rear on the P is 211kw vs. 188kw on the AWD so there is a slight difference. LR is 192kw so I guess that means the AWD is probably getting the reject motors. I'd be interested to see 60-90 times too.

 

[MP3Mike]

LR is 192kw

2017 Model 3 LR is 192kW the 2018 Model 3 LR is rated at 211 kW, just like the Model 3 Performance.

 

[FlyNavy01]

Did you weigh the 20" sport or did you get these numbers somewhere?

Tsportline list aeros 21.6lbs

No recorded measurement of the 20" sport that I know of but based off the 19" 27.5-28 lbs is about right.

Michelin website list PrimacyMXM4 as 24.9lbs and Pilot Sport 4S at 22.6lbs

Aeros are 23lbs with the aero covers. All the other weights are what I measured in real life.

I wouldn't trust websites as I've seen different weights on Tirerack, Discount Tire, and Michelin all for the same tire. I also don't think Michelin includes the acoustic foam that the stock Tesla tires have installed, which is 1-2 lbs extra.

 

[Knightshade]

Tesla does report to the EPA that both front motors are 147kw but the rear on the P is 211kw vs. 188kw on the AWD so there is a slight difference. LR is 192kw so I guess that means the AWD is probably getting the reject motors. I'd be interested to see 60-90 times too.

As noted the RWD has since been revised to match the P rear.

The AWD lower rear rating is almost certainly just a software limit to differ it more from the P- it makes no sense they'd have so many 'reject' motors that perform that badly from stock specs after almost a year of producing RWD cars without that issue.

Not to mention the D and P have the same VIN # for motors- which far as I know is only possible if they come with the same actual motors in them (just with different SW)

 

[FlyNavy01]

Are those weights for the V-FF wheels in your chart reversed? The 9.5 is showing as 1 pound less.
I'm liking those wheels. Do you have a picture of your 3 with those wheels on?

No, the wider wheels are lighter. That's common for aftermarket wheels as the fronts have a thicker backpad to clear larger front brake calipers. The rears just use increased concavity to achieve the same effect.

Here are some quick, low-quality photos I took soon after install in poor lighting. Ignore the chrome mirrors, I was still finishing up the graphite gray chrome delete.

 

[jrmnet]

No, the wider wheels are lighter. That's common for aftermarket wheels as the fronts have a thicker backpad to clear larger front brake calipers. The rears just use increased concavity to achieve the same effect.

Here are some quick, low-quality photos I took soon after install in poor lighting. Ignore the chrome mirrors, I was still finishing up the graphite gray chrome delete.

View attachment 327286 View attachment 327287 View attachment 327289 View attachment 327290 View attachment 327291

Wow, I learned something new and thanks for the pics. Does that mean if one went with 19 x 8.5 in those wheels all around that it would weigh more than the staggered look? Or would there be a different set of 19 x 8.5s for the rear without the thicker backpad? I know my question sounds a bit ridiculous, but I actually want to know.

 

[FlyNavy01]

Wow, I learned something new and thanks for the pics. Does that mean if one went with 19 x 8.5 in those wheels all around that it would weigh more than the staggered look? Or would there be a different set of 19 x 8.5s for the rear without the thicker backpad? I know my question sounds a bit ridiculous, but I actually want to know.

19x8.5 all around would weigh less because the wider wheels still require wider (heavier) tires. See my earlier post for total weights.

 

[D3xDt3Reaction]

19x8.5 all around would weigh less because the wider wheels still require wider (heavier) tires. See my earlier post for total weights.

Still, seems like your times should have dropped rather than increased, all things being equal. I can’t imagine you lost any traction. Maybe the previous wheels and tires had a better moment of inertia (mass concentrated toward the center)? It seems possible, although somewhat unlikely, that heavier wheels with a more favorable moment of inertia could have a lower equivalent mass.

 

[PhaseWhite]

Tesla does report to the EPA that both front motors are 147kw but the rear on the P is 211kw vs. 188kw on the AWD so there is a slight difference. LR is 192kw so I guess that means the AWD is probably getting the reject motors. I'd be interested to see 60-90 times too.

These power numbers for the rear motor don't line up with dyno results. I dont think we know how Tesla came up with those specs but i think they are suspect.

The LR Model 3 has dynoed at 330 hp at the wheels. Thats about 244KW, which is close to data @Krash has in his metrics thread:
Upgraded performance Metrics Summary

 

[FlyNavy01]

Still, seems like your times should have dropped rather than increased, all things being equal. I can’t imagine you lost any traction. Maybe the previous wheels and tires had a better moment of inertia (mass concentrated toward the center)? It seems possible, although somewhat unlikely, that heavier wheels with a more favorable moment of inertia could have a lower equivalent mass.

A difference of <0.1 seconds could've easily been influenced by external factors like temp, slope, battery state, and a dozen others. I'd hardly say my times "increased" seeing how consistent they all are. The fastest time I got on the 20's was immediately after supercharging (warm battery, cold inverters... i.e the ideal scenario) so maybe I will try to recreate that and test again.

 

[FlyNavy01]

These power numbers for the rear motor don't line up with dyno results. I dont think we know how Tesla came up with those specs but i think they are suspect.

The LR Model 3 has dynoed at 330 hp at the wheels. Thats about 244KW, which is close to data @Krash has in his metrics thread:
Upgraded performance Metrics Summary

It's been speculated that Tesla advertises the "average" power output over the entire power curve versus the peak numbers to keep them conservative.

 

[D3xDt3Reaction]

A difference of <0.1 seconds could've easily been influenced by external factors like temp, slope, battery state, and a dozen others. I'd hardly say my times "increased" seeing how consistent they all are. The fastest time I got on the 20's was immediately after supercharging (warm battery, cold inverters... i.e the ideal scenario) so maybe I will try to recreate that and test again.

Absolutely agree if conditions weren’t exactly the same. The difference may not be significant yet, and those were some good runs before. Let us know what you find out!

 

[Johnabis]

A difference of <0.1 seconds could've easily been influenced by external factors like temp, slope, battery state, and a dozen others. I'd hardly say my times "increased" seeing how consistent they all are. The fastest time I got on the 20's was immediately after supercharging (warm battery, cold inverters... i.e the ideal scenario) so maybe I will try to recreate that and test again.

Did you get a chance to retest? The whole reason I'm not going with the performance Model 3 but now the P+ package was I figured i'd just throw snow tires on the 18's and then buy a staggered setup as well 19x8.5 and 19x10. But if times are pretty much exactly the same then maybe I should go squared after all or just get the P+ package and buy the 2k Aero wheel snow tire package.

 

[FlyNavy01]

Did you get a chance to retest? The whole reason I'm not going with the performance Model 3 but now the P+ package was I figured i'd just throw snow tires on the 18's and then buy a staggered setup as well 19x8.5 and 19x10. But if times are pretty much exactly the same then maybe I should go squared after all or just get the P+ package and buy the 2k Aero wheel snow tire package.

Yes, I retested after supercharging to 95% and got 3.44s, 3.45s, and 3.47s. Given the consistency, I would not be surprised if Tesla uses software designed to achieve those times right now. Of course I could be wrong, but I'm satisfied with the current performance of my car for the value.

If they find a way to "uncork" more performance later after they have more miles on the P3D fleet and decide it's safe to do so in terms of vehicle warranty, then that would just be an extra bonus!

 

[Mayhem]

Yes, I retested after supercharging to 95% and got 3.44s, 3.45s, and 3.47s. Given the consistency, I would not be surprised if Tesla uses software designed to achieve those times right now. Of course I could be wrong, but I'm satisfied with the current performance of my car for the value.

If they find a way to "uncork" more performance later after they have more miles on the P3D fleet and decide it's safe to do so in terms of vehicle warranty, then that would just be an extra bonus!

That would be really nice. I have no idea why there is no proper Ludicrous acceleration mode (along with Chill, Sport) and/or Luda launch mode.

BTW: made 2 or 3 more runs the other day. Reproduced my 3.42s but didn't get quicker.

 

[bluhorshue]

That would be really nice. I have no idea why there is no proper Ludicrous acceleration mode (along with Chill, Sport) and/or Luda launch mode.

BTW: made 2 or 3 more runs the other day. Reproduced my 3.42s but didn't get quicker.

View attachment 340043

Mayhem,
Can I ask which wheels you were using?

Wanted to know what difference the 19's made compared to the 18's for the AWD non-P cars.

 

[Mayhem]

Mayhem,
Can I ask which wheels you were using?

Wanted to know what difference the 19's made compared to the 18's for the AWD non-P cars.

The wheels are the stock 20" that come with the Performance upgrades option. There really is not much of a difference at all in the 18 vs 20 IRL. Of the fastest 5 M3P runs on dragy leaderboards, 3 are with the 20", 2 are with the 18"..... so not much difference.