Driver Monitoring in 10.5

[Ruffles]

I got my second strike tonight. I'm going to have to turn off the beta because it's not useable like this. I get constant pay attention warnings. After 6 (I believe) I got the red steering wheel and FSD quit. I noticed that even while the pay attention alert is on, putting torque on the wheel does not cancel it.

 

[tdiggity]

I’ve mentioned it in another thread - in daytime, use sunglasses if you have them. It really cuts down on the nags. Keep your head straight but move your eyes to look at the screen, the indoor cam can’t tell where your eyes are really looking.

According to Slashdot the camera can determine these things: BLINDED; DARK; EYES_CLOSED; EYES_DOWN; EYES_NOMINAL; EYES_UP; HEAD_DOWN; HEAD_TRUNC; LOOKING_LEFT; LOOKING_RIGHT; PHONE_USE; SUNGLASSES_EYES_LIKELY_NOMINAL; and SUNGLASSES_LIKELY_EYES_DOWN.

 

[momo3605]

I’m ok with the added nags when using FSD beta, as I’m always alert with foot near the brake and hands hovering or on the wheel at all times, but the added pay attention nags on AP are super annoying. I used to be able to relax, look at the screen, turn my head and talk to someone…but now it’s so good at nagging lol. Ugh

 

[nvx1977]

never had any cabin nags while wearing sunglasses. However I've also never gotten nags without sunglasses or at night.

Seems like a cabin camera calibration issue. I would email fsdbeta and see if they can review the footage of your cabin camera and see what's going on.

 

[Vines]

I have yet to get any strikes, but then again I do not use my phone on the road much if at all. I pay very close attention and have a hand on the wheel unless stopped.

I do notice that if I break that rule briefly it immediately nags me, and I go back to paying attention. My wife is on her phone constantly but it has never nagged me about her phone usage.

 

[Ruffles]

Let me be clear - these are not the normal nag sequence. Normally, you get a little text that says please hold the wheel (no sound). Next, you get some blue flashing at the top of the screen. After that, you get some beeps. Then they get louder. All during this time, tugs on the wheel make them go away. This is NOT what I'm getting.

What happens to me is that I go from nothing to Red Please Pay Attention alerts with blue on the screen and loud beeping. I think this is the new alert they introduced when they turned on the camera for driver monitoring. Its what you see if you try to use your phone. During these alerts, tugging on the wheel does not cancel it unless you tug hard enough to take over from FSD. I did notice that hitting the record button cancels it (go figure). I get these every 5-10 min and after ~6 or so, I get a big red steering wheel saying FSD is not available for the rest of the drive and in the settings under FSD beta, it says I now have 2 strikes and the beta will cease to function if I get 3.

Next time I go to the office, I'm going to set up a camera to record the whole drive so I have proof and can appeal to Tesla.

 

[Bill Foster]

Let me be clear - these are not the normal nag sequence. Normally, you get a little text that says please hold the wheel (no sound). Next, you get some blue flashing at the top of the screen. After that, you get some beeps. Then they get louder. All during this time, tugs on the wheel make them go away. This is NOT what I'm getting.

What happens to me is that I go from nothing to Red Please Pay Attention alerts with blue on the screen and loud beeping. I think this is the new alert they introduced when they turned on the camera for driver monitoring. Its what you see if you try to use your phone. During these alerts, tugging on the wheel does not cancel it unless you tug hard enough to take over from FSD. I did notice that hitting the record button cancels it (go figure). I get these every 5-10 min and after ~6 or so, I get a big red steering wheel saying FSD is not available for the rest of the drive and in the settings under FSD beta, it says I now have 2 strikes and the beta will cease to function if I get 3.

Next time I go to the office, I'm going to set up a camera to record the whole drive so I have proof and can appeal to Tesla.

Do you ever get a warning about the cabin camera not available?

 

[Ruffles]

I have yet to get any strikes, but then again I do not use my phone on the road much if at all. I pay very close attention and have a hand on the wheel unless stopped.

I do notice that if I break that rule briefly it immediately nags me, and I go back to paying attention. My wife is on her phone constantly but it has never nagged me about her phone usage.

Same here. I NEVER touch my phone or let go of the wheel. I keep torque on the wheel at all times. I always keep focus on the road and avoid looking away from straight ahead. It's to the point where I'm afraid to look at the nav or event glance at the screen at all. I literally can't pay any more attention to the road than I'm doing now and I'm still getting strikes.

 

[Ruffles]

Do you ever get a warning about the cabin camera not available?

No. I cleaned the camera to make sure and moved my seat forward to help it see me better. When I opened a service ticket, Tesla said they looked at the logs for my camera and it appeared to be working properly. Then they said there was nothing more they could do because my concern was about beta software.

 

[Vines]

Same here. I NEVER touch my phone or let go of the wheel. I keep torque on the wheel at all times. I always keep focus on the road and avoid looking away from straight ahead. It's to the point where I'm afraid to look at the nav or event glance at the screen at all. I literally can't pay any more attention to the road than I'm doing now and I'm still getting strikes.

That is very unfortunate. I have been experimenting with using my sun visor to obscure the camera and see how it responds.

The nags seem to be less when I do, but I don't really have a reason o besides this thread and curiosity. I know Beta has been issued to cars without an interior camera, so maybe just using a cover for the camera is an answer, though that may end up being worse nagging. I know I have read reports of people still using beta, even when the camera is covered by a back seat child mirror.

 

[PDX-Y]

Next time I go to the office, I'm going to set up a camera to record the whole drive so I have proof and can appeal to Tesla.

Be sure to record your own face at the same time.

Are you absolutely, positively, 100% sure that you aren't (1) looking down into the cabin for more than a second or two OR (2) holding something in your hand that looks enough like a phone to fool the AI? Because that's what it's looking for, not steering input.

I honestly tend to wonder if what's happening with this warning is that, indeed, a lot of people (I know a bunch in my real existence) are just really, really, really bad at distracted driving.

But AI tuning is a possibility. I had an episode a few months back (on production AP) where it kept beeping at me because I was holding a snack in my hand. I'm guessing it looked like a phone.

 

[Bill Foster]

No. I cleaned the camera to make sure and moved my seat forward to help it see me better. When I opened a service ticket, Tesla said they looked at the logs for my camera and it appeared to be working properly. Then they said there was nothing more they could do because my concern was about beta software.

Just asking because I've started to randomly get that error on 10.4 and 10.5 but Tesla service says its fine

 

[Ruffles]

Be sure to record your own face at the same time.

Are you absolutely, positively, 100% sure that you aren't (1) looking down into the cabin for more than a second or two OR (2) holding something in your hand that looks enough like a phone to fool the AI? Because that's what it's looking for, not steering input.

I honestly tend to wonder if what's happening with this warning is that, indeed, a lot of people (I know a bunch in my real existence) are just really, really, really bad at distracted driving.

But AI tuning is a possibility. I had an episode a few months back (on production AP) where it kept beeping at me because I was holding a snack in my hand. I'm guessing it looked like a phone.

It sounds lame I know but I swear this isn't the case. My kids have always teased me because I bought a performance Y but they say I drive like a grandma. I had no problem getting my 100 score to get into the beta. I literally never let go of the wheel and have had Teslas since 2016 so I'm very familiar with the torque sensing method they use. My phone stays in my hip holster and there is nothing else in the car that could be falsely interpreted as a phone. I've never gotten an AP or FSD strike in all my years of having a Tesla and in the time since getting v10.5, I've now got 2.

At this point, I'm torn on what I should do. Should I set up all the camera gear and set up to record my final strike so I'm sure to capture footage of it? My fear is if I don't, it will happen on some drive when I'm not prepared, and I'll miss gathering the proof I need. I've got an Insta360 so I can capture what I was looking at when they happen.

 

[generalmilk]

I ran into similar situation during a morning drive. I wear glasses. The sun was low and directly faced my eyes. I assumed the reflection on my glasses has confused the camera. I put down the vizor to block the sun to my eyeglasses, and the beep stopped. Otherwise I would have got strike.

My suggestion is to try the vizor. If it does not work, disengage immediately

 

[Phlier]

Gents, I apologize if this has already been mentioned, but I didn't read the entire thread....

There have been some reports of guys getting the "Pay Attention" cabin camera induced alert if a cell phone is visible to the cabin camera, regardless of whether or not the driver was actually using it.

If you're getting "Pay Attention" alerts and don't know why, make sure the cabin camera can't see your phone.

 

[EVNow]

I got my second strike tonight. I'm going to have to turn off the beta because it's not useable like this. I get constant pay attention warnings. After 6 (I believe) I got the red steering wheel and FSD quit. I noticed that even while the pay attention alert is on, putting torque on the wheel does not cancel it.

Send a mail to fsdbeta and also log a service ticket. May be you do have some kind of hardware issue ...

 

[Massive Attack]

I did try this once when I hit 80mph and got into autopilot jail. I tried to do the 2 button reset to see if it would give me AP back, but I was still jailed even after the reset. So seems like it remembers

On Turkey Day this happened to me. First time ever getting kicked off Autopilot. I was on the highway doing 79 in a 70. Was passing 3 tractor trailers when a HUGE pickup truck flew up on my bumper. While I should have disabled Autopilot, I just got it up to 83 to hurry up and get out of the way, and "BEEP BEEP BEEP BEEP BEEP!" No more Autopilot for you!

Fortunately the wife wanted to hit an upcoming Rest Stop, so I was able to put the car in Park, and when we resumed the trip I was out of Autopilot Jail. Seriously, I always try to read all of the manuals and release notes, but I didn't know 80 was a barrier. I do now.

 

[clydeiii]

Just email the fsdbeta account this thread, let them stew on these issues. It's clearly their fault, not yours.

 

[PDX-Y]

Just email the fsdbeta account this thread, let them stew on these issues. It's clearly their fault, not yours.

That's... exactly backwards. The point to beta software (and yes, driver monitoring is new software under test too) is to put it in the hands of testers willing to try it and work around its foibles. It's not a product to be "supported" "for" the users, the users are supposed to be finding flaws, and shouldn't be surprised when they do. If you don't want to do that, the beta isn't for you.

 

[EVNow]

It's not a product to be "supported" "for" the users,

What ?!?

Beta users should expect & get white glove support. Thats how it worked in every product I've worked on.