Drove Audi e-tron Today

[Curious George]

This is some of the wildest misinformation I've ever heard on this form. Where are you getting this? First of all in Norway the model 3 is the largest selling car, not the largest selling electric car but the largest selling model of any car. Tesla sold more cars in Norway than Toyota, more than VW and more than BMW. Audi wasn't even in the top five. That's just Norway. So the notion that the Audi e-tron is "killing it" and out selling Tesla in Norway and Netherlands is just pure fiction.

I meant "so far this year". But we know, there will be a surge in Tesla deliveries soon.
You can check it at eu-evs.com.

 

[nativewolf]

Look, I am a big Tesla fan but I think this is overstating their advantage.
VW has spectacular resources. Yes, they have been egregiously deceptive with their emissions (which is why I'll never buy a VW), but even if they are stupid and arrogant (which I don't think are reasonable descriptors) their ability to ride out the Tesla storm and come back strong is tremendous. I'm not saying at all that they will trounce Tesla (I hope Tesla gets massive!), but don't underestimate them. Or Mercedes, Toyota etc.

Had to disagree with you. First, they have two anchors holding them down. Workers Councils & local govt. VW exist to create jobs...they happen to provide a modest dividend. They are half the size (market cap) of Toyota and now a third less than Tesla. VW has no ability to be agile and everything about Tesla is a threat to the mission of VW-jobs for Germans. In fact, Tesla, could dramatically shrink the employment in Automotive so much that VW would be forced into a drastic bankruptcy within 7 years. The tipping point will come faster than people anticipate because they misunderstand how rapidly industries get destroyed (horse carriages for autos, phones for cell phones, type writers for computers, encyclopedias book sets for CDs, and smart phones replacing cell phones) It is almost never the case that the old industry leaders are meaningful after the disruption and don't count on the big 30 to remain meaningful. If Tesla grows at 50% than the automakers are destroyed in 10 years. Period.

 

[dfwatt]

I meant "so far this year". But we know, there will be a surge in Tesla deliveries soon.
You can check it at eu-evs.com.

So do you think that might be really misleading information though? Do you think that the total number of Audis delivered in 2020 in Norway for example will be more or less than 1/3 the number of Teslas? i'd wager less.

 

[dfwatt]

Had to disagree with you. First, they have two anchors holding them down. Workers Councils & local govt. VW exist to create jobs...they happen to provide a modest dividend. They are half the size (market cap) of Toyota and now a third less than Tesla. VW has no ability to be agile and everything about Tesla is a threat to the mission of VW-jobs for Germans. In fact, Tesla, could dramatically shrink the employment in Automotive so much that VW would be forced into a drastic bankruptcy within 7 years. The tipping point will come faster than people anticipate because they misunderstand how rapidly industries get destroyed (horse carriages for autos, phones for cell phones, type writers for computers, encyclopedias book sets for CDs, and smart phones replacing cell phones) It is almost never the case that the old industry leaders are meaningful after the disruption and don't count on the big 30 to remain meaningful. If Tesla grows at 50% than the automakers are destroyed in 10 years. Period.

I agree with your analysis. One critical issue that may determine how quickly the end comes for ICE vehicles is whether or not model C or its equivalent comes to Market in the United States and Europe, and if it comes, when. This is the model that Tesla is designing with the Chinese to hit a substantially lower price point and of course it will be smaller and probably have somewhat less range. But it will compete in price with entry-level vehicles. It's positioned to take the low end of the market. In the United States it may be the model Y that is the death blow to ICE vehicles. If they can bring a Model Y to market with decent range for around 30 to $35,000, it will be the death knell for traditional internal combustion technology. Right now that's not a hittable number but give Tesla time. As autonomy and ride-sharing cut heavily into the traditional reasons for people to buy vehicles the market for anything other than an autonomous electric vehicle may simply crater in a matter of five to ten years.

 

[Curious George]

So do you think that might be really misleading information though? Do you think that the total number of Audis delivered in 2020 in Norway for example will be more or less than 1/3 the number of Teslas? i'd wager less.

No, I don't. My statement was very clear. Even the ev-blog has a title "Audi e-Tron starts in the lead" for January.
EV Sales: Norway

Is it misleading when some article is titled "Tesla Model 3 is best selling car in Norway for month of xyz" and next month it is not even in the top 10? Case in point: Model 3 in December 019 in Norway vs. Jan 2020).

For this year, looking at how it is going, my WAG is Audi etron models will be half of all Tesla sales in Norway.
But the total etron production appears limited to 40k for this year. So there is some doubt how many Audi will allocate for Norway.

 

[dfwatt]

No, I don't. My statement was very clear. Even the ev-blog has a title "Audi e-Tron starts in the lead" for January.
EV Sales: Norway

Is it misleading when some article is titled "Tesla Model 3 is best selling car in Norway for month of xyz" and next month it is not even in the top 10? Case in point: Model 3 in December 019 in Norway vs. Jan 2020).

For this year, looking at how it is going, my WAG is Audi etron models will be half of all Tesla sales in Norway.
But the total etron production appears limited to 40k for this year. So there is some doubt how many Audi will allocate for Norway.

If that's your best wager you're giving away money. And sorry it is misleading to talk about month-to-month sales when the real issue is year-to-year sales.

 

[daktari]

Sales numbers, all years combined for EVs in Norway here:
Registreringer av nye elbiler i Norge
e-tron: 7056 (since winter 2019)
X: 13206
S: 20608 (since 2013)
3: 15880 (since winter 2019)

Statistics for all cars (in Norwegian): Registreringsstatistikken – Opplysningsrådet for veitrafikken

 

[SMAlset]

Don't know how many E-trons are going to be built in 2020, but this article isn't very promising as the battery supply issue for them is confirmed:

Production of Audi's electric e-Tron SUV is on pause due to a battery shortage — and it shows why Tesla and GM are spending billions on battery factories

Given the mention of using LG Chem for batteries in the E-tron, I saw this Reuters story today that LG Chem will be exclusively supplying EV batteries to Lucid Motors starting second half of 2020 through 2023:

LG Chem to exclusively supply EV batteries to U.S.-based Lucid Motors

Some deal Lucid cut for that supply and wonder where that leaves Audi's e-tron.

 

[polyphonic54]

Anyone here own an E-Tron? I've planned many trips in A Better Route Planner and find that it's not too far behind time-wise. The price with tax credit is very reasonable IMO. Thinking about jumping ship due to my Model 3 being so damn loud on the highway.

 

[Lozza12]

Anyone here own an E-Tron? I've planned many trips in A Better Route Planner and find that it's not too far behind time-wise. The price with tax credit is very reasonable IMO. Thinking about jumping ship due to my Model 3 being so damn loud on the highway.

Personally I wouldn’t. I was parked next to an etron recently and it’s a big silly boat of a thing. Etron is a dead-end platform and Audi recently had to upgrade it because the car was so far behind its own 2015 specs as well as those of the competition in particular Model 3.

Obviously if you feel highway noise is an insurmountable issue then you need to ensure you still enjoy driving. Maybe test drive a Model Y? I would also wait for Tesla’s battery day in April to see if they’ve got something that will further eclipse the legacy auto makers.

 

[daktari]

Anyone here own an E-Tron? I've planned many trips in A Better Route Planner and find that it's not too far behind time-wise. The price with tax credit is very reasonable IMO. Thinking about jumping ship due to my Model 3 being so damn loud on the highway.

I do. Nice comfort, quiet car. Not without quirks though. It is a much bigger car than a 3.
TeslaBjørn made a 1000 km test; high charging speeds make up for the higher consumption compared to an X (before v3 SuC), so in the end, travel time is pretty close.
Summary table at around 40 minutes out

 

[cucubits]

I do. Nice comfort, quiet car. Not without quirks though. It is a much bigger car than a 3.
TeslaBjørn made a 1000 km test; high charging speeds make up for the higher consumption compared to an X (before v3 SuC), so in the end, travel time is pretty close.
Summary table at around 40 minutes out

I can't wait for the smaller e-trons. I get giddy just thinking about an EV which is actually smooth quiet and well put together.

 

[daktari]

I can't wait for the smaller e-trons. I get giddy just thinking about an EV which is actually smooth quiet and well put together.

The Q4 e-tron concept looks promising, still a big car. They need to sort out some software bugs in todays e-trons though.
Audi Q4 e-tron concept | audi.com