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Dual Charger setup and Charging outdoor

jcanoe

Active Member
Oct 2, 2020
3,272
3,247
Maryland
Thanks for this information, I was not aware this J1772 adapter was needed with the hcs-d50, that is another $200 added to overall cost.

The cost to run the conduit is not as much of a problem as the location of where the conduit has to be ran in the garage. Right now with the way my Sub panel is setup I can connect the conduit whip from the clippercreek directly into the panel or even a junction box right below it without much hassle.

I just don't have enough experience with the clippercreek but so far your feedback and another user is very good information. I don't want to buy something and have to replace it a few years later b/c it broke. I do like the fact it is a dumb charger in a sense as there is less which can break and go wrong.

I was hoping to find an alternative but there really isn't much out there for residential in terms of dual charging.
I think if you decide to purchase the HCS-D50 or any ClipperCreek EVSE it will give you very long service. The ClipperCreek EVSE are built to last but perhaps not the most attractive EVSE with none of the bells and whistles. (In comparison, the Tesla Wall Connector has a glass front plate. This looks great on the cover of Architectural Digest etc. but whomever designed the Tesla Wall Connector has never owned a house with a typical garage where there are ladders, tools etc. that can accidentally impact the EVSE housing. (Back in the real world, ClipperCreek has a video on their web site that demonstrates ClipperCreek employees swinging a wooden bat at the HCS EVSE housing (the bat splintered.) 😆
 
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af88

Member
Sep 28, 2019
257
37
Cali
Thanks for the feedback, I plan to mount this outside so it is good to know it is built to last. I just want a reliable charger at the end of the day. Sounds like this should fit the bill.
 

af88

Member
Sep 28, 2019
257
37
Cali
I agree, it should cover my needs, I'm a big proponent of taking care of your battery, would not want to charge at 48A even if I could. These batteries are not cheap to replace and degradation is a known issue with this cell chemistry. The cost is more for the charger but it saves a lot of time installing it in my scenario.

Correct me if I'm wrong but as of right now you can only schedule charging in the car, not on the app. And in the car you can set the current limit, the app will only allow you to set the charge capacity(%) and that is it, right?
 

jcanoe

Active Member
Oct 2, 2020
3,272
3,247
Maryland
Thanks for the feedback, I plan to mount this outside so it is good to know it is built to last. I just want a reliable charger at the end of the day. Sounds like this should fit the bill.
For outdoor use definitely get the hard wired version of the HCS-D50. Once installed the EVSE will be fully sealed for use in all weather conditions.
 
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af88

Member
Sep 28, 2019
257
37
Cali
Agree, I think i got lucky due to where my sub panel is located and the wall I want to mount the HPWC.

I asked this in another thread and I'll ask it here too:

Correct me if I'm wrong but as of right now you can only schedule charging in the car, not on the app. And in the car you can set the current limit, the app will only allow you to set the charge capacity(%) and that is it, right?
 

ATPMSD

Member
Mar 12, 2021
286
284
Atlanta, GA
I agree, it should cover my needs, I'm a big proponent of taking care of your battery, would not want to charge at 48A even if I could.
48A is just 11.5 kWh (240v * 48A) , which is not really that much especially when you consider 40A is 9.6 kWh. DC charging seems to start around 50 kWh with SuperChargers running up to 250 kWh. There are loads of Gen 3 chargers and HPWC units out there and I have not heard of any issues.
 

jcanoe

Active Member
Oct 2, 2020
3,272
3,247
Maryland
Agree, I think i got lucky due to where my sub panel is located and the wall I want to mount the HPWC.

I asked this in another thread and I'll ask it here too:

Correct me if I'm wrong but as of right now you can only schedule charging in the car, not on the app. And in the car you can set the current limit, the app will only allow you to set the charge capacity(%) and that is it, right?
Correct; currently Schedule Charging (also Schedule Departure) settings are only accessible from the Tesla vehicle Charging Screen not from the Tesla App.

You can set the maximum charging amperage (must be set each time you charge, this should work with Scheduled Charging but I am not certain.) Normally you just let the Tesla Mobile Connector, Wall Connector or any 3rd party EVSE and the Tesla vehicle do their thing and they negotiate the maximum amperage for the charging session. The Tesla would detect 240V and request 48 amps (the maximum for the Model Y), the HCS-D50 would respond (depending on whether only one or both charging cords will be in use) and specify either 40 amps or 20 amps as the maximum amperage for the charging session. The Tesla will then set the maximum amperage accordingly.
 

af88

Member
Sep 28, 2019
257
37
Cali
Slow charging any Li cell chemistry prolongs the battery health, at this point there is enough published data, but each their own. I don't want to digress and go off track on this topic.

Back to my question:

Correct me if I'm wrong but as of right now you can only schedule charging in the car, not on the app. And in the car you can set the current limit, the app will only allow you to set the charge capacity(%) and that is it, right?
 

Rocky_H

Well-Known Member
Feb 19, 2015
6,660
7,955
Boise, ID
Most of the things in this comment just don't make sense.
you could run a 100A circuit to two Gen 2 Wall Chargers (or two 60A circuits). You then set each charger to 50A, which gives you 40A charging per car (80A total which is 80% of the 100A circuit). When Tesla enables sharing you reset them to [...]
This doesn't make sense. The Gen 2 units already do have circuit sharing. But then you're talking about "when Tesla enables sharing", which isn't some future thing we're waiting on from the Gen2 units. If someone buys to Gen2 wall connectors, they already have sharing, and this is sorted already.
If you can get around that you could run a 100A circuit to two Gen 2 Wall Chargers (or two 60A circuits). You then set each charger to 50A, which gives you 40A charging per car (80A total which is 80% of the 100A circuit). When Tesla enables sharing you reset them to 60A and enable sharing, which is still 40A per car when both are in use and 48A when just one car is charging.
But that's not how you set up sharing with the Gen2 wall connectors anyway. You don't set the current on each one. You have to designate one as "master" and one (or more) as "slave". The "master" one is where you set the current for the whole circuit, like the 100A you gave in this example. And then the current setting for all of the others is where it is just set marked as slave units. The master one then makes the decisions of allocating current based on detecting whether cars are connected to the others or not.
I agree, it should cover my needs, I'm a big proponent of taking care of your battery, would not want to charge at 48A even if I could. These batteries are not cheap to replace and degradation is a known issue with this cell chemistry.
This concern of taking care of your battery is irrelevant related to home charging speeds. ALL home charging rates are extremely low power from the battery's perspective. This is a system that can take over 200kW of power, and you are talking about quibbling over whether to use something like 7 or 11 kW. That is all so low the battery won't care in the least.
48A is just 11.5 kWh (240v * 48A) , which is not really that much especially when you consider 40A is 9.6 kWh. DC charging seems to start around 50 kWh with SuperChargers running up to 250 kWh. There are loads of Gen 3 chargers and HPWC units out there and I have not heard of any issues.
kWh is the unit for amounts of energy, by the way. Charging power (speed of energy delivery) is in kW.
 

af88

Member
Sep 28, 2019
257
37
Cali
Thanks, I think from what I saw on some videos you can set the charging current but it can only be done in the car. And there was a mention based on GPS it remembers if I recall the schedule and charging current you set. I could be wrong as my memory is a bit fuzzy from all the information I've had to soak in preparation for going all electric.
 

jcanoe

Active Member
Oct 2, 2020
3,272
3,247
Maryland
Thanks, I think from what I saw on some videos you can set the charging current but it can only be done in the car. And there was a mention based on GPS it remembers if I recall the schedule and charging current you set. I could be wrong as my memory is a bit fuzzy from all the information I've had to soak in preparation for going all electric.
Scheduled Charging, Scheduled Departure only apply to the home location. (You set the home location in the Tesla Navigation system.) My experience with my Model Y and setting the maximum charging amperage is that it must be reset every time you charge if you want other than the maximum charging amperage of the circuit as limited by the EVSE. If you plug in to charge at any other location then Scheduled Charging or Scheduled Departure do not apply to charging at work (for example.)

The ClipperCreek HCS-D50 is almost a one of a kind EVSE. If you plug in one of the charging cords the Tesla will start charging at a maximum of 40 amps. If you later plug in the second charging cord the charging amperage of each charging cord will drop to a maximum of 20 amps. The HCS-D50 should work correctly with Tesla vehicles and Scheduled Charging and Scheduled Departure. You might want to contact ClipperCreek's sales support and ask the question. In my experience ClipperCreek has excellent technical support for their products.
 

Lashlee

Member
Feb 19, 2021
39
34
Knoxville, TN
@Lashlee
Thanks for the feedback, it sounds like you have had good luck with the clippercreek product and it is working out. I'm looking at the hcs-d50 which will put out 20A per vehicle so in theory it should charge faster and will be enough to cover my daily commute to work while allowing the wifes car to charge too.
It has worked out great, and has for about 3 years. It was sometime around October of 2018 when they were installed and we have one that's grumpy on occasion but other than that they've been trouble free. When they were installed I had a Leaf, there were two Chevy Bolt's and three Model 3's, but thankfully not all of us are on the same schedule. Now there are 8 Model 3's, 3 Model S's an E-Tron, the FCX Clarity and an Ioniq (I think that's what it is!!). It does help that we are a power utility where the electricity is free!!
 
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ATPMSD

Member
Mar 12, 2021
286
284
Atlanta, GA
Sorry and thank you, @Rocky_H, I keep typing Gen “2” when I mean Gen “3”! Yes the Gen 2 includes sharing via direct connect wiring while the Gen 3 will, at some point offer sharing via WiFi.
 
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af88

Member
Sep 28, 2019
257
37
Cali
It has worked out great, and has for about 3 years. It was sometime around October of 2018 when they were installed and we have one that's grumpy on occasion but other than that they've been trouble free. When they were installed I had a Leaf, there were two Chevy Bolt's and three Model 3's, but thankfully not all of us are on the same schedule. Now there are 8 Model 3's, 3 Model S's an E-Tron, the FCX Clarity and an Ioniq (I think that's what it is!!). It does help that we are a power utility where the electricity is free!!

that is fantastic to hear it has been trouble free for that long. I know the warranty they offer is good for 3 years, hopefully it lasts a good 10 years. From what I read they used to offer a 5 year warranty on earlier models.
 
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Rocky_H

Well-Known Member
Feb 19, 2015
6,660
7,955
Boise, ID
Sorry and thank you, @Rocky_H, I keep typing Gen “2” when I mean Gen “3”! Yes the Gen 2 includes sharing via direct connect wiring while the Gen 3 will, at some point offer sharing via WiFi.
OK, good. Sorry for sounding harsh then. I just didn't want that misleading someone. If people can actually get Gen2's, this is totally easy and doesn't require any weird workarounds, which is what makes me so irritated that Tesla screwed up Gen3 so badly in replacing it. The Gen2 was a fantastic product.
 

af88

Member
Sep 28, 2019
257
37
Cali
This concern of taking care of your battery is irrelevant related to home charging speeds. ALL home charging rates are extremely low power from the battery's perspective. This is a system that can take over 200kW of power, and you are talking about quibbling over whether to use something like 7 or 11 kW. That is all so low the battery won't care in the least.

I disagree, I also don't want to turn this into a battery debate, but I'm far more familiar with Li cell chemistry no offense. I've written a white paper about this for Defense use and have first hand experience.

Let's agree to disagree and move on.
 

Rocky_H

Well-Known Member
Feb 19, 2015
6,660
7,955
Boise, ID
This concern of taking care of your battery is irrelevant related to home charging speeds. ALL home charging rates are extremely low power from the battery's perspective. This is a system that can take over 200kW of power, and you are talking about quibbling over whether to use something like 7 or 11 kW. That is all so low the battery won't care in the least.
I disagree, I also don't want to turn this into a battery debate, but I'm far more familiar with Li cell chemistry no offense. I've written a white paper about this for Defense use and have first hand experience.

Let's agree to disagree and move on.
I sincerely hope you are kidding. Let's put this in some numbers perspective.
1C is considered a pretty reasonable level for charging batteries. For a 75 kWh battery capacity, that would be 75 kW. As I mentioned, people are actually worried about damaging their batteries from home charging and are talking about turning down their home charging speed from 11 kW to something less, like 6 or 7 kW. That is charging coefficients of about 0.09 C to 0.14 C. That's splitting hairs between "extremely low" or "incredibly low".

Sure, technically they are not exactly the same. But you are saying you think that is going to make a significant, measurable difference in the lifetime or degradation rates of the batteries?
 
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