TMC is an independent, primarily volunteer organization that relies on ad revenue to cover its operating costs. Please consider whitelisting TMC on your ad blocker or making a Paypal contribution here: paypal.me/SupportTMC

dual charger thoughts

Discussion in 'Model S: Ordering, Production, Delivery' started by David99, Jun 10, 2014.

  1. David99

    David99 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2014
    Messages:
    2,066
    Location:
    Brea, Orange County
    Just a few thoughts on single charger vs dual charger. I was pretty confident about all the other options and never really questioned my choices, except the dual charger option. I decided against it when I ordered, then called to have it added and the Tesla rep explained why it was really not worth it. I ended up not adding it. In the first few days I was a little torn. Adding it later is so much more expensive.

    After 10k miles I can say I never missed the dual charger a single time. There has never been a moment where charging at 60 miles/h would have made any difference compared to 30 miles/h. There was one station that had a Tesla HPWC but I stopped there only to check out the place. Nowhere else could I find a charger capable of more than 10 kW. Every time I use a public charger at a mall or store or park or Disneyland or similar I'm not in a rush to drive anywhere so charge speed is not an issue at all anyways. Again none of them support more than 7 kW anyways.

    When I'm on road trips I use Superchargers. Nothing else cuts it. Even at 20 kW it takes way too long to charge when your goal is to keep moving.

    Overnight charging, which is the most common way to charge is well covered with a single charger. Worst case scenario would be coming home with a totally empty battery and then needing a range charge for the next day. It takes about 9 hours to do that on a single charger. No problem. My daily drive is a little over 100 miles so in my case I'm more than fine with the single charger in any case. I need about 3 hours to be covered.

    Yes, one can always come up with a scenario where a single charger wouldn't cut it. Just as much as one can come up with a scenario where a dual charger wouldn't be enough. My point is that even in heavy use like I do with 100 miles of daily driving, the 10 kW single charger is more than fast enough. For road trips the dual charger is way too slow, that's why there are Superchargers. The moments where the extra 10 kW are available and make a significant difference are not common. I'm not missing it at all. I will gladly spend the money on a CHADeMo adapter. I think that will help me out more as it will allow me to add a significant amount of charge quickly and those quickchargers are way more common than 80 amp capable L2 chargers. So the likelihood if being able to make use the CHaDeMo adapter vs dual charger are much higher.

    JM2C
     
  2. romac

    romac Member

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2014
    Messages:
    54
    Location:
    Scottsdale, AZ
    Thank you for your post. When we ordered our Model S last week, the dual charger was the one option we were unsure about. Both the product specialist at the gallery and the owner advisor we talked to when we ordered said based on our driving habits, the dual was not necessary. Your post helps confirm that for us.

    BTW, where are the public chargers at Disneyland and what kind are they? We are frequent visitors.
     
  3. jerry33

    jerry33 S85 - VIN:P05130 - 3/2/13

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2012
    Messages:
    12,766
    Location:
    Texas
    That works in So. Cal. but having twin chargers cut four hours off of my last trip. Superchargers are few and far between and ChaDeMo chargers are just not available except in large cities throughout most of the country. I don't regret getting them.
     
  4. djp

    djp Roadster 2.0 VIN939

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2011
    Messages:
    1,108
    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    The opposite is true in Canada where we have no Superchargers, but 70/80 amp L2 stations are everywhere. Most Canadian owners get the dual chargers.
     
  5. muleferg

    muleferg Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2013
    Messages:
    751
    Location:
    North Wilkesboro, NC
    I have not regretted not buying the dual charger. I will purchase the CHADeMO adapt. Driving from NC to Nashville or Chattanooga, TN is apiece of cake, with all the CHADeMO's at Cracker Barrel's.



    West Wilkes EV students filling up at Burlington, NC.

    IMG_1673.JPG
     
  6. Pilot_51

    Pilot_51 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2014
    Messages:
    534
    Location:
    Metro Detroit, MI
    Dual chargers is the one thing I removed from my initial order, thanks to TMC advice. I was also torn about the cost of adding it later, but it didn't take me long to understand how unnecessary it is and to feel comfortable with my decision. Chances are, the only time I would need to charge away from home is if I'm taking a trip, in which case I should have no problem planning a route with sufficient DC chargers.
     
  7. JakeP

    JakeP S P4996 / X P6028

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2012
    Messages:
    1,816
    Location:
    Wexford, PA
    I have the Dual Chargers, and they will be very useful for my trip from Pittsburgh to Syracuse in July, which has not a single SuperCharger on the entire route (yet). But I am staying at the Best Western in Syracuse, with its Suncountry C90 charger, and am thankful for my dual chargers!
     
  8. Chas F

    Chas F Model S 60kWh #P6396

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2012
    Messages:
    219
    Location:
    Orlando, FL
    Since you are staying overnight, wouldn't a single charger be enough then? Unless you only sleep for 4 hours, overnight should be plenty of time to charge up.
     
  9. GoBlue88

    GoBlue88 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2014
    Messages:
    638
    Location:
    San Diego area
    Meh. The $1500 cost to add dual chargers up front seemed very nominal compared to the overall price of the car, especially when you compare that to the cost of 21" wheels or the air suspension. I figured with the low cost that even if I only needed them 1-2 times a year, I would be thankful that I went for the the dual chargers.
     
  10. RandyS

    RandyS Fan of Elon

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2012
    Messages:
    360
    Location:
    San Diego
    I've used my second charger about 6-8 times in the year I've owned the car, mainly on road trips...If you're okay with AC Level 2 charging of no more than 40 amps, then you probably don't need to get the second charger option...But for those of us who are always trying to push the charging envelope, I'm glad I ordered it...
     
  11. JakeP

    JakeP S P4996 / X P6028

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2012
    Messages:
    1,816
    Location:
    Wexford, PA
    Not if I want to do anything on the day I arrive with close to an empty tank. And good luck finding another hotel in the area with ANY charging, much less 90A charging.
     
  12. stevezzzz

    stevezzzz R;SigS;P85D;SigX

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2009
    Messages:
    6,062
    Location:
    Colorado
    The Sigs came with dual chargers. It was 18 months after I took delivery before I had occasion to use my second charger, during a mid-day stop at the home of another S owner with an HPWC. That's when I discovered my second charger was defunct; being limited to 40A put a real crimp in my travel plans.
     
  13. JakeP

    JakeP S P4996 / X P6028

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2012
    Messages:
    1,816
    Location:
    Wexford, PA
    That is horrible, Stevezzz. I was just imagining what trouble I could be in if we arrived at my destination, and my J1772 adapter somehow failed.
     
  14. ecarfan

    ecarfan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2013
    Messages:
    10,402
    Location:
    San Mateo, CA
    I have an HPWC and dual chargers. For me that was the right choice based on my driving habits. And I think that over time high amp L2 chargers (and even HPWCs) will become more common at destinations so to me dual chargers are worthwhile
     
  15. andrewket

    andrewket 2014 S P85DL, 2016 X P90DL (soon 100)

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2012
    Messages:
    5,047
    I have dual chargers and for me it was well forth the $1500 from the factory. I use it almost every day at home. The ultra low rate from my utility is only 4 hours long. Without 80A charging I can't fully charge the battery in that window (assuming the battery is at low SOC). I've also used it a few times midday when my travel plans changed, and with public HPWCs.

    Another way to look at it- Assuming my time is worth $300/hour, it pays for itself if I have to wait 5 cumulative additional hours to charge over the life of the car.

    A
     
  16. Pilot_51

    Pilot_51 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2014
    Messages:
    534
    Location:
    Metro Detroit, MI
    Looking at it that way, it would be around 38 hours for me. Much more questionable, especially since DC chargers would probably be everywhere long before I hit that. I think if you aren't stretching to afford Model S, go for it even if you might not use it, otherwise it should be carefully considered.
     
  17. ckessel

    ckessel Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2011
    Messages:
    4,266
    Like the OP, I've never missed having dual chargers and figured I'd never care, so that's why I skipped them. I either need an SC or I'm good with 40 amp. There are obviously folks that would benefit either due to their lifestyle or location, but I think it's a very low return on investment for most people. I know there are older threads that have debated this topic heavily.

    Daaaamnnn! I wish I was worth $300/hour. But, if your time is worth that much, dual chargers makes sense. Though if your time is worth that much and it's that critical to you, seems like you'd hire a limo driver and work while you are transported.
     
  18. golfski

    golfski Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2014
    Messages:
    178
    Location:
    Seattle, WA
    I think it all depends on where you live and what car you have. When I ordered my 60, I went back and forth on this option and decided not to get it. However, the more I thought about it, a 60 with dual chargers and SC is quite the road warrior. In Pacific NW, there are lots of haL2 charging stations that are placed on routes that do not have SC capability. I tried to add it before delivery but it was too late :(. However, if the CHaDeMo adapter is ever released, that will provide much more flexibility than the dual chargers.
     
  19. dsm363

    dsm363 Roadster + Sig Model S

    Joined:
    May 17, 2009
    Messages:
    18,235
    Location:
    Las Vegas, NV
    It really depends on where you live. I've taken a day trip where that wouldn't have been possible with single charger. A donated 70A J1772 station was very helpful. You are right though 90+% of time if doesn't make a difference. All depends on how often you'll encounter them. Of course if CHAdeMO adapter comes then that might make the need for dual charging even less for some.
     
  20. mknox

    mknox Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2012
    Messages:
    8,570
    Location:
    Toronto, ON
    Yep. I'll never have more than a 50 amp outlet at home, but just about every public station I use is at least a 90 amp (72 amps continuous). We're installing 2 - 100 amp units right now in our employee/visitor lot.
     

Share This Page