EAP drifts to the right when first engaged

[artsci]

With my new Model 3 i’m also new to EAP, so this may be lack of experience, but when I first engage EAP it immediately drifts to the right, which is disconcerting to say the least. When that happens I tend to correct for the drift, which most of the time shuts EAP down.

When I’m in a lane I tend to drive slightly to the left of the lane, so maybe it’s compensating to take me to the precise center of the lane. Should I be concerned? Experiences of EAP pros would be much appreciated.

 

[Nocturnal]

Mine feels like it drifts left, but I think I tend to just drive slightly to the right of the middle of the lane.

 

[Runt8]

I've seen the same thing, because I tend to drive near the left side of the lane (and I'm usually in the left lane). I've had to completely recalibrate my mental picture of what center is. Now I tend to manually center the vehicle before I turn on AP.

 

[suwaneedad]

FWIW, when I got my pilot's license my instructor trained me to think of my right foot as being on the centerline, which is about true given my eyes sit to the left of the right foot. I use this same logic now when tolerating EAP's tendency to drive precisely in the center of the lane, while my brain wishes it'd bias toward the left as I've done my whole life (as do you).

I suspect that with time, Tesla will adjust EAP to do just that particularly when traveling in the left lane. But for now, maintaining centerline is what EAP does, so that drift you're feeling when you activate it is just the car finding the center of the lane. Once EAP is better at identifying stationary objects (in the left emergency lane), a strong case can be made for having EAP bias toward the left a bit when traveling in the left lane.

 

[ewoodrick]

With my new Model 3 i’m also new to EAP, so this may be lack of experience, but when I first engage EAP it immediately drifts to the right, which is disconcerting to say the least. When that happens I tend to correct for the drift, which most of the time shuts EAP down.

When I’m in a lane I tend to drive slightly to the left of the lane, so maybe it’s compensating to take me to the precise center of the lane. Should I be concerned? Experiences of EAP pros would be much appreciated.

I believe that the correct statement is that it moves to the center. It seems like you must be driving on the left side of the lane.
Get someone in a car behind you to verify.

 

[cleveland97]

When I first got my M3 I felt like EAP was driving way too close to the lane to my right - and yes, whenever I engaged EAP it would move the car to the right immediately. I asked my passengers several times in the first couple weeks "does it feel to you like we're too close to that car/truck on the right?" Every time the answer was "not really".

I think a lot of us tend to drive favoring the left side of the lane more than we realize...

 

[Glamisduner]

EAP has all kinds of behavior I don't like. Like hugging the right side lane when your passing a semi truck. It's not smart enough to hug the left lane instead. Semi's (and other vehicles with large trailers) tend to cross over the lane lines often so I have to take control until I get past them in order to be safe. I also tend to drive on the left more than the right, as do drivers in the lanes next to me

 

[dlieu]

yeah. i don't like EAP either. Got the 30 day trial. I actually expected to love it and buy, but as i keep going on with the trial, to my surprise i am more and more convinced that not buying it now was a correct decision. This thing has more bugs and uncertainties than my chinese-made android.

I am finding it missing the correct speed limits (a lot and usually to the slower side which is super annoying, like showing 35 in 45 on a 1.5 mile stretch next to where i live, or limiting to 45 on 55 limited 4-mile stretch).

It twice tried to to overtake a semi right before its lane merges into mine on freeway in the same spot (just doesn't see it), basically attempting to speed me up and drive me in between of two semis in one case.

I also observed excessively sticking to both right and left dividers to the degree it starts riding over divider buttons.

The collision warning goes off absolutely without fail every time with parked cars on the right curving residential road. Even with the latest warning possible.

Worst of all are the phantom breaks. Happens very often when there's a car approaching (even slowly and clearly seeing the traffic) off a driveway. This is probably one of the worst issues.

Some intersections simply do not work (e.g., a couple of places where there are 3 lanes after the light but only 2 before it -- basically takes two at the same time and starts veering left and right like a madman scaring everyone, me including, in the process).

Maybe i am not supposed ever to use AP at intersections, but i haven't seen anything specifically saying it is for freeway-only. If that's the case, then realistically it is useless for anything except freeway driving -- even with suburban environment. Residential roads with parked cars, yes, it's a problem for it, i get it. It would not even engage there. But then again, if it is freeway-only, it tried to kill me twice on a perfectly free flowing freeway in the matter of couple of weeks too... I don't know how i am supposed to be relaxed if I always have to expect a near-fatal jerk or turn or picking a wrong lane...

That said, i do use and like the adaptive cruise control (ACC) on the pachy... there's no steering, but it is far more predictable (and correct!) in terms of phantom stops and early warnings... strange.

hm...

I keep saying the best driver is not the one that drives best, but the one that can predict dumb drivers before they do something dumb. The EAP is exactly opposite of that.

 

[Zoglog]

EAP has one fantastic use.

Commuting in traffic. The only negative is how it handles lanesplitting bikes. It confuses the system

 

[Knightshade]

I am finding it missing the correct speed limits (a lot and usually to the slower side which is super annoying, like showing 35 in 45 on a 1.5 mile stretch next to where i live, or limiting to 45 on 55 limited 4-mile stretch).

This is nothing at all to do with EAP. The Nav database is where speed limit info comes from.

I also observed excessively sticking to both right and left dividers to the degree it starts riding over divider buttons.

It sticks to the middle be design, I've never had it get overly close to either side except in a pretty sharp curve

The collision warning goes off absolutely without fail every time with parked cars on the right curving residential road. Even with the latest warning possible.

Possibly because it's explicitly not intended for use on residential roads and tells you so when you engage it.

Worst of all are the phantom breaks. Happens very often when there's a car approaching (even slowly and clearly seeing the traffic) off a driveway. This is probably one of the worst issues.

See above. This is entirely user error for engaging EAP in situations it's expressly not intended to be used in.

Some intersections simply do not work (e.g., a couple of places where there are 3 lanes after the light but only 2 before it -- basically takes two at the same time and starts veering left and right like a madman scaring everyone, me including, in the process).

Maybe i am not supposed ever to use AP at intersections, but i haven't seen anything specifically saying it is for freeway-only

Yes, you have. You just didn't bother to read it.

If that's the case, then realistically it is useless for anything except freeway driving

Yes.

That is literally the only time you are supposed to use it

It says so when you turn it on in the first place and agree you read and understood both that, and the fact it's in beta (and in the manual for that matter- repeatedly).

 

[animorph]

I've only had AP2.0 drive off-center once, after a FW update. Probably after a recalibration period it was back to normal.

It used to really jerk to the center with early FW's. I had to be careful with car placement when turning Autosteer on. It seems to handle initial repositioning pretty nicely now.

Yeah, it would be nice to be able to offset the lane position to gain some distance from trucks close to the lane edge of possible lane splitters. But I'm pretty comfortable staying in the middle of my lane as long as the trucks are staying in theirs and aren't weaving too badly.

 

[dlieu]

Possibly because it's explicitly not intended for use on residential roads and tells you so when you engage it.

i did read it. "city roads" are not advised for autosteer feature only. Phantom stops are feature of TACC which does not have such restriction, in fact it explicitly suggests wide range of its use as follows:

"To use Traffic-Aware Cruise Control, you must be driving at least 18 mph (30 km/h), unless a vehicle is detected ahead of you. If a vehicle is detected ahead of you, you can use TrafficAware Cruise Control at any speed, even when stationary [...]. source : https://www.tesla.com/content/dam/tesla/Ownership/Own/Model 3 Owners Manual.pdf

nothing about freeway use exclusively. Any speed. any environment. Certainly in an environment where some other car is slowly driving across a gas station (not in front on you and not on the road) in order to enter the road with proper right-of-way intent

his is nothing at all to do with EAP. The Nav database is where speed limit info comes from.

If something doesn't work, i do not particularly care where it comes from. If it's unusable, in am inclined not to use it.

As for the autosteer on a freeway, like i said, driving me under a truck two times in two weeks is plenty enough for me. Beta, you say. That's exactly my point, feels very much so. Not sure why i need to be paying for opportunity to test a beta.

As for the collision warning, it would seem you are suggesting i need to be flipping its settings every time i change driving environment. If so, again, it is useless. If there's no setting for it that works everywhere, there's no point digging in menu and turning it on. My wife was almost screaming at me to switch it off so that it doesn't go off at every parked car on our street.

Yes.

That is literally the only time you are supposed to use it

Again. You are mistaking EAP for autosteer. If you want to be meticulous and send me reading manuals (which i did), you would be nice to understand that EAP is a set of features and they have different limitations, not one single for them all.

 

[Knightshade]

i did read it. "city roads" are not advised for autosteer feature only. Phantom stops are feature of TACC which does not have such restriction, in fact it explicitly suggests wide range of its use as follows:

"To use Traffic-Aware Cruise Control, you must be driving at least 18 mph (30 km/h), unless a vehicle is detected ahead of you. If a vehicle is detected ahead of you, you can use TrafficAware Cruise Control at any speed, even when stationary [...]. source : https://www.tesla.com/content/dam/tesla/Ownership/Own/Model 3 Owners Manual.pdf

nothing about freeway use exclusively.

Wrong.

https://www.tesla.com/content/dam/tesla/Ownership/Own/Model 3 Owners Manual.pdf

Page 67

Traffic-Aware Cruise Control is primarily intended for driving on dry, straight roads, such as highways and freeways. It should not be used on city streets

(bold added)

As for the collision warning, it would seem you are suggesting i need to be flipping its settings every time i change driving environment.

No, I'm suggesting you need to stop using it in places the manual explicitly tells you not to use it

User Error.

Again. You are mistaking EAP for autosteer. If you want to be meticulous and send me reading manuals (which i did), you would be nice to understand that EAP is a set of features and they have different limitations, not one single for them all.

Again, you are wrong.

Neither Autosteer NOR TACC are intended for use on residential or city streets.

I even quoted you the page this time showing you're wrong since you can't be bothered to read more than a single page apparently.

 

[dlieu]

No, I'm suggesting you need to stop using it in places the manual explicitly tells you not to use it

User Error.

er... "stop using it" implies disabling it in the settings... Which i am not going to do when i am driving from one enviornment to another. Is there any way to prevent warnings to go off?? "not use them" by plugging my ears when it screams? I am respectfully saying this is ridiculous use case to suggest (even if that's what they suggest to do, which i don't think they do).

If TACC cannot be used anywhere but freeways (and every other car i have can use their adaptive controls without false, rapid deceleration in pretty clear situation) then it's not for me either.

One more critical note btw that annoys me about EAP.

Again, every other car i have or know that has ACC and regular cruise, allows to engage either at will. Before EAP, i actually used regular cruise control quite a bit on 25+ mph streets. Simply because normal (non-chill) mode makes it very easy to go over speed limit without noticing. With EAP, it looks like there's no more way to engage cruise control, only the TACC, which as you say i can't use anywhere but freeways. Which would be a huge loss compared to other cars which don't have that "feature".

Well, look, i am not saying this is useless thing for someone who is willing to learn all its quirks. I am just saying it's just not for me -- and even less so for my wife who is even less inclined to get into details than me. This is just an observation that applies to me.

But i am not that unusual. And i am not particularly non-STEM type. I do math for living.

And i've been using ACC for some years now, before i got Tesla, and owning BEVs (including one with 400lb torque) for at least 5 years before i got Tesla. Nothing particularly strikes me as something fundamentally new here, except perhaps for autosteer to certain degree, and NoA. Everything else the other cars did as well, except Tesla does it a bit faster, and a bit more suggestive (but it's the more suggestive part that fails).

Even speed limit reading happens literally without reproach in my other car. If it doesn't know, it just doesn't tell me (but usually does), and if it does, it is the correct one.

 

[Knightshade]

er... "stop using it" implies disabling it in the settings...

No, it really does not.

It implies not using it

Like, don't move the stick down to turn it on if you're not driving someplace it's not meant to be used.

Much like when the rules of the road say "Don't shine your brights at oncoming cars" it doesn't mean disable the ability to activate brights when driving with oncoming traffic.

It just means don't hit the switch to activate them then.

Same thing.

Which i am not going to do when i am driving from one enviornment to another. Is there any way to prevent warnings to go off?? I respectfully saying this is ridiculous use case (even if that's what they suggest to do).

The only thing ridiculous is your continued misreading of what the manual actually says.

If TACC cannot be used anywhere but freeways (and every other car i have can use their adaptive controls without false, rapid deceleration in pretty clear situation) then it's not for me either.

uh... ok.

I've never had false rapid deceleration when using it on highways, but YMMV I suppose.

It's also worked significantly better (and in many more situations) than adaptive cruise I've used on Lexus, Toyota, Infiniti, GM, and Ford vehicles too. Most of those for example won't even work below 25-30 mph so it's total crap in stop and go traffic... (a few of the very newest models finally have an offering that handles this, but still not all, and still not nearly as well)

One more critical note btw that annoys me about EAP.

Again, every other car i have or know that has ACC and regular cruise, allows to engage either at will. Before EAP, i actually used regular cruise control quite a bit on 25+ mph streets. Simply because normal (non-chill) mode makes it very easy to go over speed limit without noticing. With EAP, it looks like there's no more way to engage cruise control, only the TACC, which as you say i can't use anywhere but freeways.

Right because, again, it explicitly states it is only for use on freeways

 

[dlieu]

It implies not using it

Like, don't move the stick down to turn it on if you're not driving someplace it's not meant to be used.

I was referring to collision warnings. Thery are either on and scream, or off (and then always silent).

Right because, again, it explicitly states it is only for use on freeways

not my point. my point is EAP makes regular cruise control unavailable. With EAP, stalk down is now reserved for TACC and there's no way to enable regular cruise control which is available without EAP (not sure if you had the car without EAP -- it works as a regular cruise whihc is not reserved for freeways, and if it is, it's ridiculous since every other car is happy to auto-cruise at 25+ since... i think... at least early 2000s)

 

[dlieu]

Most of those for example won't even work below 25-30 mph so it's total crap in stop and go traffic...

as i mentioned, my pachy's ACC (they call it adaptive cruise control) works at any speed and up to full stop without false reactions to cars that are not even on the road.

Granted, their advanced safety tech packages are pretty recent (no more than couple years for pacifica and perhaps not much farther back for other models)

perhaps my Tesla copy needs a calibration or something. I dont know. but it clearly reacts to cars slowly moving in perpendicular direction which are not even on the road and are not going to enter the road in front of me.

 

[Knightshade]

perhaps my Tesla copy needs a calibration or something. I dont know. but it clearly reacts to cars slowly moving in perpendicular direction which are not even on the road and are not going to enter the road in front of me.

or perhaps you need to actually read the manual

because again, TACC is not intended for use on roads with cross traffic


You continuing to engage in user error and then blaming the car notwithstanding.

 

[derotam]

er... "stop using it" implies disabling it in the settings... Which i am not going to do when i am driving from one enviornment to another. Is there any way to prevent warnings to go off?? "not use them" by plugging my ears when it screams? I am respectfully saying this is ridiculous use case to suggest (even if that's what they suggest to do, which i don't think they do).

etc, etc, etc.

I'll attempt to not be condescending by I can't promise anything.

Your car is working as intended with all implied limitations as per the manual. Yes you can actually engage some of the features while not on a highway but the manual warns against it. TACC is a BETA feature as per the manual which means that it is not a fully developed technology in the Model 3. This also means that in ANY situation you DECIDE to use it, you must be aware that it might not act appropriately.

If you don't like that way the features work, then don't use them, this does not mean you have to disable them, just don't engage them by pulling the stalk down. I use TACC, and full EAP all the time on city streets and intersections, but I am always, ALWAYS fully prepared to take over, and I maintain my foot on the accelerator to if there is a sudden deceleration for no reason, my foot will override it.

TACC is not EAP, Auto Steer is NOT EAP, TACC AND Autosteer is EAP.

Any emergency alerts(when it highlights a vehicle on the display red because it thinks you may hit it), would be due to the scenario. If you are on city streets and there are parked cars on the side while you go around a curve, it is going to alert. You can change the sensitivity of the alerts, Controls>Autopilot>Forward Collision Warning...page 86 in the manual.

Even the Auto windshield wipers are a BETA feature.

Yes there is a bit of conflicting information about using TACC in the manual...it looks like they will eventually "allow" using TACC on city streets, but not yet as per the manual.

 

[dlieu]

etc, etc, etc.

I'll attempt to not be condescending by I can't promise anything.

Your car is working as intended with all implied limitations as per the manual. Yes you can actually engage some of the features while not on a highway but the manual warns against it. TACC is a BETA feature as per the manual which means that it is not a fully developed technology in the Model 3. This also means that in ANY situation you DECIDE to use it, you must be aware that it might not act appropriately.

If you don't like that way the features work, then don't use them, this does not mean you have to disable them, just don't engage them by pulling the stalk down. I use TACC, and full EAP all the time on city streets and intersections, but I am always, ALWAYS fully prepared to take over, and I maintain my foot on the accelerator to if there is a sudden deceleration for no reason, my foot will override it.

TACC is not EAP, Auto Steer is NOT EAP, TACC AND Autosteer is EAP.

Any emergency alerts(when it highlights a vehicle on the display red because it thinks you may hit it), would be due to the scenario. If you are on city streets and there are parked cars on the side while you go around a curve, it is going to alert. You can change the sensitivity of the alerts, Controls>Autopilot>Forward Collision Warning...page 86 in the manual.

Even the Auto windshield wipers are a BETA feature.

Yes there is a bit of conflicting information about using TACC in the manual...it looks like they will eventually "allow" using TACC on city streets, but not yet as per the manual.

You answering past the issue quoted. The particular issue of collision warnings going off in benign situations which has nothing to do with TACC. Technically it is not even part of eap, but it tangential to phantom breaking b c they probably use the same or similar prediction models.

Issue related to TACC is that it overrides use of non-TACC that can be used, and was extensively used by me at 25±mph before EAP was enabled. There is now no way to turn on non TACC in the car with EAP.

Like I said, it's far from novel. My other car can engage TACC equivalent or non TACC equivalent at will. Either of them. Two different buttons. Also, it never missed on collision warning and auto energency breaking yet. Either false negatively or positively.