Early Access Program (overflow from 2018.39 4a3910f thread)

[SongjinDK]

If I signed a waiver saying Tesla could never be at fault for beta software, I'd be happy with any new garbage they were willing to try. I'm a big boy and have had my fair share of the alpha/beta software world, including my own code, and test existing autopilot in ridiculous conditions it was never meant for and would never blame software for not performing there. Extreme vigilance and treating every single autopilot engagement as a challenge would be perfectly fine for me. If they really offered a "check for updates" button that Elon pseudo-promised, along with the ability to test "dangerous code, use at own risk", I'd still use it. I'm not so scared that I can't simply have my hands on the steering wheel and my foot hovering over the pedals in case it decided to drive me off a cliff - I acknowledge that defeats the whole purpose of autopilot, but I also understand that's what's required. What we really need is the option, rather than be treated as little children that don't know what's best for them. I'd happily take an update 2 or 3 times a week of the code and do ridiculous testing for it while others (allegedly) refuse to even activate autopilot until Tesla declares it stable! Given autosteer is still "beta" even 18 months after its first AP2 inception, they could be waiting a very very long time. I respect their position but feel to be the opposite end of the spectrum. What Tesla needs to do is acknowledge this discrepancy in its customers and offer only stable releases as a default, with others consciously opting in to beta, or even alpha, releases rather than randomly sending out offers to some random few individuals who may or may not be suited to prerelease testing.

Agree. I think it is far more effective and safer for volunteers who are more willing and ready to test new releases. If they pick someone not ready, it could be dangerous. What they could do is to list multiple releases (stable, beta, alpha, etc.) and we can choose which one to install and test. That way, people can choose to only use stable version while some of us can help test alpha. Can we make this suggestion to Tesla?

 

[shukenmg]

Agree. I think it is far more effective and safer for volunteers who are more willing and ready to test new releases. If they pick someone not ready, it could be dangerous. What they could do is to list multiple releases (stable, beta, alpha, etc.) and we can choose which one to install and test. That way, people can choose to only use stable version while some of us can help test alpha. Can we make this suggestion to Tesla?

Like Windows insider builds with the Fast, Slow and Release Preview rings.

 

[conman]

Agree. I think it is far more effective and safer for volunteers who are more willing and ready to test new releases. If they pick someone not ready, it could be dangerous. What they could do is to list multiple releases (stable, beta, alpha, etc.) and we can choose which one to install and test. That way, people can choose to only use stable version while some of us can help test alpha. Can we make this suggestion to Tesla?

I've made lots of suggestions to Tesla. None of them have ever been heard, or there has been no sign of them hearing them at least. All direct channels of communication from users to Tesla (like the old email bug reports, support, feedback etc.) were abandoned once Tesla became huge. They're not a company that can cope with direct feedback any more, alas.

 

[iTech]

I've made lots of suggestions to Tesla. None of them have ever been heard, or there has been no sign of them hearing them at least. All direct channels of communication from users to Tesla (like the old email bug reports, support, feedback etc.) were abandoned once Tesla became huge. They're not a company that can cope with direct feedback any more, alas.

I've had bug reports answered and followed up when reporting them via the Tesla TS number, but it helps that you don't just leave a simple report and provide as much detail and steps to reproduce as possible.

 

[pilotSteve]

I've made lots of suggestions to Tesla. None of them have ever been heard, or there has been no sign of them hearing them at least. All direct channels of communication from users to Tesla (like the old email bug reports, support, feedback etc.) were abandoned once Tesla became huge. They're not a company that can cope with direct feedback any more, alas.

sounds like they need machine learning to sort thru customer feedback and autonomously send a tweet to Elon every monday morning.

 

[conman]

sounds like they need machine learning to sort thru customer feedback and autonomously send a tweet to Elon every monday morning.

But maybe they'll just replace Elon with a neural network if we do that for too long?

 

[thecloud]

I think you might be surprised.

Source: once received a phone call from someone at Tesla after posting here about an issue.

Now I want to know what you posted.

A few years back, there was an issue with the brake booster which was new to the Model S in AP1 builds; it was making a ticking noise at regular intervals. The gist of the call was, "saw your post about this issue, please bring your car to the service center so we can look at it." In my posting history and signature line, I had mentioned information including my delivery date, so I'm sure it wasn't difficult for them to narrow down the list to one particular owner and get my telephone number.

Many large tech companies employ a person (or team!) whose job is to comb through forum posts and blogs to see what problems users are encountering in the wild, and what trends are emerging. Customers may not always report a problem directly to the company, but will happily complain about it online.

 

[TT97]

Many large tech companies employ a person (or team!) whose job is to comb through forum posts and blogs to see what problems users are encountering in the wild, and what trends are emerging. Customers may not always report a problem directly to the company, but will happily complain about it online.

So, they possibly know about phone as a key issue?

 

[Mobster]

I've made lots of suggestions to Tesla. None of them have ever been heard, or there has been no sign of them hearing them at least. All direct channels of communication from users to Tesla (like the old email bug reports, support, feedback etc.) were abandoned once Tesla became huge. They're not a company that can cope with direct feedback any more, alas.

True. Very true.

The suggestions posted here are excellent. The current "Early Adopters" special class and privileges will continue to be horrid and offensive.

Tesla HAS built a wall around itself for outside process improvement suggestions. My experience anyway. I am sure some of us are trying channels into Tesla that have worked for us before. We will see if it provides any ray of hope on this subject.

 

[Mobster]

Like Windows insider builds with the Fast, Slow and Release Preview rings.

This is an excellent example of "managing" the free help! I think that probably many of us here are in the "Windows Insider" group. That sounds like a very exclusive club however it is relatively easy to join. And...they value FREE labor. They manage it and understand that any processes and MS personnel assigned to manage us mad scientists pays off for them in a ROI. This is exactly how Tesla should grab us up as free labor while setting parameters as suggested here. The current "Early Adopters" is a mess and turns out to be a perk / clique that is nonsense.

 

[NewTMSMan]

True. Very true.

The suggestions posted here are excellent. The current "Early Adopters" special class and privileges will continue to be horrid and offensive.

Tesla HAS built a wall around itself for outside process improvement suggestions. My experience anyway. I am sure some of us are trying channels into Tesla that have worked for us before. We will see if it provides any ray of hope on this subject.

So I am assuming if you got included in EAP tomorrow you would reject it then, as you find the whole idea of the special class and privileges so horrid and offensive? Hmmmm

 

[Mobster]

So I am assuming if you got included in EAP tomorrow you would reject it then, as you find the whole idea of the special class and privileges so horrid and offensive? Hmmmm

hahaha....no, one cannot be a part of a revolt (and the whole idea is revolting) from inside the palace.

I guess in your inquisition (which is disingenuous as you assume the answer before it is given..... with the sarcasm ) , might be aimed at everyone that proposed alternate suggestions. It does not matter if we all or any could be "bought". If it is the wrong thing to do ...it is wrong. It is not about you or me. It is about the process. Hope you agree and not focus on the personalities.

 

[bigdaddie]

Like Windows insider builds with the Fast, Slow and Release Preview rings.

Yea I'm a Fast Preview release ring for Windows 10. It's cool getting the new features,only to have some pulled back in the next release. I've also had to re-install my OS several times..... Sound familiar?

Reminds me, time to back up my computer.

BD

 

[Mobster]

Yea I'm a Fast Preview release ring for Windows 10. It's cool getting the new features,only to have some pulled back in the next release. I've also had to re-install my OS several times..... Sound familiar?

Reminds me, time to back up my computer.

BD

Installing OS often has been a price to pay for being an "Insider" for MS. They get free slave labor (yeah, I am part of that program too) and we get to look at "possible" features. You are very correct that something which may look great to us gets "pulled back". Part of the deal. The "Early Adopter" could work the same way if open to all that apply. It appears that parts of V9 have already been modified from the versions shown to us by car hackers who were able to get it. Overall, the owner community has been pretty flexible and forgiving (FSD promises as an example) and should be welcomed into more of the BETA experience that is on much of what we use today.

 

[bigdaddie]

Installing OS often has been a price to pay for being an "Insider" for MS. They get free slave labor (yeah, I am part of that program too) and we get to look at "possible" features. You are very correct that something which may look great to us gets "pulled back". Part of the deal. The "Early Adopter" could work the same way if open to all that apply. It appears that parts of V9 have already been modified from the versions shown to us by car hackers who were able to get it. Overall, the owner community has been pretty flexible and forgiving (FSD promises as an example) and should be welcomed into more of the BETA experience that is on much of what we use today.

Agreed. I would also sign a release of liability to be able to "Alpha" test some of the new EAP features. Much like we do with MS except the only casualty in that case is our data without said agreement.

 

[Mobster]

Agreed. I would also sign a release of liability to be able to "Alpha" test some of the new EAP features. Much like we do with MS except the only casualty in that case is our data without said agreement.

Exactly. Tesla has a ton of "slave labor" out here not only willing, but anxious to help who would sign waivers, NDAs, agreement to follow detailed instructions, agreement to be excluded if found to not follow program, etc etc. The current situation is very obviously nonsense "separate elite class of owners".

 

[eml2]

I wasn't sure if you were joking or serious. If serious and you cancelled TeslaFi, then it was unnecessary. Just turn off the polling of it to the car for awhile.

I got an invite even though I have been using TeslaFi. I don't think using TeslaFi (or any other 3rd party logger) will preclude you from the Early Access Program invitation.

However, I prefer to continuing my TeslaFi service so I am not going to accept the invite.

 

[P_K_G]

I got an invite even though I have been using TeslaFi. I don't think using TeslaFi (or any other 3rd party logger) will preclude you from the Early Access Program invitation.

However, I prefer to continuing my TeslaFi service so I am not going to accept the invite.

Do they have any clause in contract that prohibit you to continuing with 3rd party like Tesla-Fi and continuing with them?

 

[eml2]

Do they have any clause in contract that prohibit you to continuing with 3rd party like Tesla-Fi and continuing with them?

Yes, they do. One of the rules is not using any 3rd party logger, such as TeslaFi.

 

[APotatoGod]

I got an invite even though I have been using TeslaFi. I don't think using TeslaFi (or any other 3rd party logger) will preclude you from the Early Access Program invitation.

However, I prefer to continuing my TeslaFi service so I am not going to accept the invite.

I’ll take your invite for you!
It’d be funny if they ended up never officially “releasing” v9, but instead just gradually added everyone to the early access program where they can use v9