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Elon confirms NO FSD transfer will be offered :(

Discussion in 'Autopilot & Autonomous/FSD' started by McFlurri, Jan 27, 2021.

  1. Robotpedlr

    Robotpedlr Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2017
    Messages:
    320
    Location:
    Seattle
    If someone else on here has a 2017 MS 100D with about 30k miles and all options including EAP, but NOT full self driving, we can compare numbers to see how mine (with FSD) compares to yours without.

    I tried that with a random VIN I found online, and there was a big gap (mine was about 7k more, but I dont know if the other one had comparable options).

    Mine was a late (Dec 2017) delivery..so if there is a Twin out there without FSD lets see...
     
    • Love x 1
  2. stopcrazypp

    stopcrazypp Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2007
    Messages:
    9,830
    Probably people should start a dedicated thread for trade-in values (if there isn't already) so a bigger group of people can see and post it in. It's going to be hard to do something like this with everything scattered in various different threads.
     
    • Like x 1
  3. Robotpedlr

    Robotpedlr Supporting Member

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    Location:
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    Maybe, but I was just curious about getting one data point at this stage.
     
  4. CapeOne

    CapeOne Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2016
    Messages:
    719
    Location:
    New England
    Unless Tesla is willing to provide a detailed line by line trade evaluation e.g., 21" wheels adds $X, FSD adds $X, miles adds or deducts $X, condition adds or deducts $X, etc. there is no way to know for sure what Tesla values FSD. It's only speculations and theories.

    If Tesla wants/needs a particular trade for inventory, they will pay (closer to) fair market. If they don't, they won't. Just because they can add FSD for "free" doesn't necessarily mean they won't offer something for it in trade in order to lock in a sale, get a used car to resell for profit, etc.

    Tesla's trade values can be wide ranging even for similar cars and have also been known to change notably after the 30 day offer expires.
     
  5. S4WRXTTCS

    S4WRXTTCS Well-Known Member

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    The interesting thing about visualization is they were added to HW2.5 well after they were in HW3 so HW3 still got the initial attention. I expect them to keep doing that until they simply can't fit/rework a neural network for HW2.5. Supposedly the camera processing also happens more slowly in HW2.5 so it can't compete with HW3 in terms of frame rate with the same resolution.

    So it really comes down to what can be added to HW2.5 given resource constraints (both with HW2.5, and with Engineers to do the work).

    We also know that Tesla intends on having standard AP run the FSD code because Elon has tweeted so.
    https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1353665950290235394?lang=en

    If I was an EAP/HW2.5 owner my biggest concerns would be:

    Pot Hole detection
    Ability to navigate through a construction zone on the freeway
    Ability to properly detect whether a semi is in the lane next to me or the lane next to that one. It tends to get confused, but only on Semi's. I assume its because it doesn't have the 4D view from all the cameras yet.
    Ability to process the interior camera so it can see my head looking at the road, and not nag me.
    Being smart enough not to get tricked by the lane widening on merge points while going down the right lane on a freeway (this is specific to states that don't use dashed lines for them).
     
  6. paaltio

    paaltio Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2019
    Messages:
    47
    Location:
    Finland
    Also just simply the basic lane keeping, especially in tighter bends. I was always confused by the "without FSD it doesn't make any difference if you got HW3 or not" comments I saw in 2019, because just cornering speeds alone get more accurate when they can trust the neural nets and not rely on guesses based on map data.
     
    • Like x 1
  7. S4WRXTTCS

    S4WRXTTCS Well-Known Member

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    I give Tesla a hard time about a lot of things, but one thing I have to admit about the company is they really try to do right safety wise.

    In this case lets say there is some animal in the road, and it has a 99.9% chance of being detected with FSD code running on HW3. But, only a 40% chance of being detect with old code running on HW3. Now I just pulled those numbers randomly, but I think its a perfectly reasonable to assume HW3 would have better detection rates that were easier (due to higher resolution).

    To stay true to Tesla's mission they have to allow FSD code to run on HW3 even when the customer didn't pay for FSD.

    And, the mission of safety is exactly what Elon intends to do.

    The problem with EAP/HW2.5 people is its a bit of who caves first. Tesla is going to want EAP people to move to HW3 to unify the SW, but EAP/HW2.5 people are going to be like "Nah, you said this was going to work so make it work".

    If I was a EAP/HW2.5 owner I'd be pretty stubborn about it.

    So my belief is EAP/HW2.5 should put up a good fight to where Tesla has to upgrade them for free to EAP.

    I've heard of Model S/X people with EAP getting HW3 when they upgrade to MCU2. But, I only one or two. I haven't paid much attention to the Model S/X threads.
     
  8. SSonnentag

    SSonnentag Rocket Scientist

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2017
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    1,709
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    Arizona
    Are you confusing HW3 with FSD 3 computer? I wasn't aware of any significant differences in sensor hardware from late 2017 until today.
     
    • Like x 1
  9. momo3605

    momo3605 Member

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    Mar 18, 2019
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    117
    Location:
    Bay Area
    HW 3 IS the FSD computer. HW2.5 uses an older computer.
     
    • Like x 2
  10. S4WRXTTCS

    S4WRXTTCS Well-Known Member

    Joined:
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    5,305
    Location:
    Snohomish, WA
    When a customer gets upgraded from HW2.5 to HW3 the only thing that gets upgraded is the computer. There are no sensor differences. I'm not sure what part of my post is causing confusion. Maybe the resolution part, but that's processing resolution and not sensor resolution.

    Anyways that post is full of typos, and its readability is admittedly poor. At 1:55AM I really should be in bed. :p

    For example:
    "So my belief is EAP/HW2.5 should put up a good fight to where Tesla has to upgrade them for free to EAP."

    That should read "So my belief is EAP/HW2.5 people should put up a good fight where Tesla has to upgrade them for free to HW3"
     
  11. designrs

    designrs Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2020
    Messages:
    101
    Location:
    Jacksonville, FL
    I just want lane change added to my base AP. Hope it will be a subscription feature soon. Tons of Tesla owners would add this feature for a modest monthly subscription.
     
    • Love x 1

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