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Elon ducking behind bogus "regulation" for $10K Level 5 bet this year

Bet TSLA

Active Member
Dec 8, 2014
2,807
10,249
Cupertino, CA
Oh I've made it my mission to talk as many people out of buying FSD as I can. They've definitely lost more money because of me than they got out of me at this point.
That's pretty funny. Anybody who actually would have bought FSD will instead end up buying it later, when it costs more. For some, this might be a reasonable and preferable approach. For others, well, they'll be thinking of you when they part with the extra cash.

Of course the truly smart ones will have put the money in TSLA, and when they pull it out will have made enough profit to buy an entire car with what they would have originally spent on FSD.
 

DanCar

Active Member
Oct 2, 2013
1,676
1,394
SF Bay Area
Oh I've made it my mission to talk as many people out of buying FSD as I can. They've definitely lost more money because of me than they got out of me at this point.
Too many people with money burning a hole in their pocket in my neck of the woods for me to do that. If we collected data who buys FSD, we would see a strong correlation with amount of disposable income.
 

Bet TSLA

Active Member
Dec 8, 2014
2,807
10,249
Cupertino, CA
Too many people with money burning a hole in their pocket in my neck of the woods for me to do that. If we collected data who buys FSD, we would see a strong correlation with amount of disposable income.
That would also cover people buying Teslas, so I'm not sure there would be any information content in that.
 

mycroftxxx

Member
Jun 14, 2020
100
46
Left Coast
Here is the actual definition of L5 with notes and an example. I think it is very clear. I find the example to very clear. I am not sure where the confusion is.

p 25-26:

5.6 LEVEL or CATEGORY 5 - FULL DRIVING AUTOMATION

Definition: The sustained and unconditional (i.e., not ODD-specific) performance by an ADS of the entire DDT and DDT fallback without any expectation that a user will respond to a request to intervene.

NOTE 1: “Unconditional/not ODD-specific” means that the ADS can operate the vehicle under all driver-manageable road conditions within its region of the world. This means, for example, that there are no design-based weather, time-of-day, or geographical restrictions on where and when the ADS can operate the vehicle. However, there may be conditions not manageable by a driver in which the ADS would also be unable to complete a given trip (e.g., white-out snow storm, flooded roads, glare ice, etc.) until or unless the adverse conditions clear. At the onset of such unmanageable conditions the ADS would perform the DDT fall back to achieve a minimal risk condition (e.g., by pulling over to the side of the road and waiting for the conditions to change).

NOTE 2: In the event of a DDT performance-relevant system failure (of an ADS or the vehicle), a level 5 ADS automatically performs the DDT fallback and achieves a minimal risk condition.

NOTE 3: The user does not need to supervise a level 5 ADS, nor be receptive to a request to intervene while it is engaged.

EXAMPLE: A vehicle with an ADS that, once programmed with a destination, is capable of operating the vehicle throughout complete trips on public roadways, regardless of the starting and end points or intervening road, traffic, and weather conditions.
I agree this is pretty good for what it is. My expertise is the aircraft world, and things like airworthiness specs are written the same way, although at a much lower lever. I could see SAE eventually working with governments and industry to come up with a much more detailed set of specs that defined specific low level tasks in much more detail; e.g., what was expected of a compliant system in lane keeping accuracy, including allowable failure rates.
 
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diplomat33

Well-Known Member
Aug 3, 2017
6,873
7,861
Terre Haute, IN USA
I agree this is pretty good for what it is. My expertise is the aircraft world, and things like airworthiness specs are written the same way, although at a much lower lever. I could see SAE eventually working with governments and industry to come up with a much more detailed set of specs that defined specific low level tasks in much more detail; e.g., what was expected of a compliant system in lane keeping accuracy, including allowable failure rates.

Thanks.

FYI, the "Safety first for Automated Driving" white paper does go into more specifics on the standards.

https://www.daimler.com/documents/innovation/other/safety-first-for-automated-driving.pdf
 

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