Elon: "Feature complete for full self driving this year"

[NerdUno]

The customers here at TMC are interested in cars they can buy. How do cars that we can buy from other automakers compare to Tesla’s cars?

For openers, they don't swerve into exit ramp dividers. That's a feature worth having when you buy any car.

 

[diplomat33]

For openers, they don't swerve into exit ramp dividers. That's a feature worth having when you buy any car.

My Model 3 has never once tried to swerve into a divider in the 8 months I have owned it.

 

[rnortman]

My Model 3 has never once tried to swerve into a divider in the 8 months I have owned it.

Well then it sounds like the "march of the 9's" is complete! We can all rest easy.

I really don't understand this. My Model S has tried to murder me many times since I've owned it. Now admittedly when I got it, AP2 was still pretty new and AP2.5 was hot off the presses (mine was among the first HW2.5's). The software back then was terrible. There was one spot on my morning commute where it would routinely swerve toward a concrete barrier every single time without fail. It has gotten a lot better -- in particular it no longer dives for that particular barrier. But it still occasionally swerves toward things it should not.

I also don't understand all the positive reports about NOA. I am still on 2018.50.6 but supposedly that version was already a lot better than the initial release. And it still has been completely useless to me, and often downright dangerous.

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

I see. I have had no such problems (other than on my very first couple drives as I learned the system) but obviously the resulting comfort would depend on how the driver is used to holding the wheel.

Well then it sounds like the "march of the 9's" is complete! We can all rest easy.

I really don't understand this. My Model S has tried to murder me many times since I've owned it. Now admittedly when I got it, AP2 was still pretty new and AP2.5 was hot off the presses (mine was among the first HW2.5's). The software back then was terrible. There was one spot on my morning commute where it would routinely swerve toward a concrete barrier every single time without fail. It has gotten a lot better -- in particular it no longer dives for that particular barrier. But it still occasionally swerves toward things it should not.

I also don't understand all the positive reports about NOA. I am still on 2018.50.6 but supposedly that version was already a lot better than the initial release. And it still has been completely useless to me, and often downright dangerous.

Are you still on 2018.50.6 by choice? That's so far back that you missed the horrific 2019.8.3

The positive reports about NoA mostly seem to be in California on 2019.8.5. I think they have an advantage because it's been reported that they have more detailed maps. Not the maps we see, but internal maps that NoA uses. They probably do a much better job testing things in California so there are likely less issues there.

In fact I'm hoping to do a road trip this spring or summer to see for myself how much better it is in Cali overall. Specifically the area near the Tesla factory.

I can't say my Model 3 has tried to kill me directly, but it certainly tries to annoy me to death. Things like slowing during a lane change or random acts of timidness about a car in front, but in the other lane. Even as going as far as tracking it for no particularly apparent reason. The worst is being in the right lane, and the car reentering itself anytime there is a merging lane coming in.

Those are the mild annoyances, but a major one is the maps make it unusable as it has no idea what lanes are okay to be in. So it does excessive lane changes even with speed based changes off.

Having better maps would fix it so I'd actually use it, but then those other things would be bigger items.

I haven't heard of 2019.8.5 (what I have now) fixing any of the mild issues. but I'm going to take it for a spin later today. I don't expect to see much correction in the things I find annoying, but hopefully at the very least it fixes all the things 2019.8.3 broke. So far it has in features unrelated to NoA.

 

[diplomat33]

I really don't understand this. My Model S has tried to murder me many times since I've owned it. Now admittedly when I got it, AP2 was still pretty new and AP2.5 was hot off the presses (mine was among the first HW2.5's). The software back then was terrible. There was one spot on my morning commute where it would routinely swerve toward a concrete barrier every single time without fail. It has gotten a lot better -- in particular it no longer dives for that particular barrier. But it still occasionally swerves toward things it should not.

There is nothing to understand really. Software improves over time. When you had your car, the EAP software was more primitive and had issues that have since been solved. I am fortunate that I got my car later than you, with AP2.5, when EAP was already pretty good and most of the previous issues were already solved. I never experienced the early birth pangs of AP2. It also explains the difference in perspective. I've always had a positive experience with AP since it was always pretty good when I got it so I am more likely to have a positive and optimistic attitude moving forward. You might have a more pessimistic attitude because your first experience with EAP was not as good and it took longer for you to see significant improvements. It also explains why folks like me are bullish on FSD whereas you are not. My positive experience with EAP makes me optimistic that Tesla really can do FSD whereas your negative experiences with early EAP make you doubtful that Tesla has what it takes for FSD.

I also don't understand all the positive reports about NOA. I am still on 2018.50.6 but supposedly that version was already a lot better than the initial release. And it still has been completely useless to me, and often downright dangerous.

What's there to understand? Some people are having very positive experiences with the new NOA. Just because you have had some bad experiences with a previous version, does not mean that others can't have better experiences, especially with newer software versions. Also, different roads, different traffic conditions and different driver expectations will affect how people will judge the feature. So one person may think NOA is great because it works great on the roads they have and meets their standards but someone else may think it is "useless" because it does not meet their driving standards on the roads they use it on. For example, I've seen plenty of posters on this forum talk about how NOA is "useless" to them because it can't handle the aggressive LA or NY drivers that they deal with on their daily commute. But someone like me who lives in Indiana, deals with much different type of drivers. As a result, I may have a different experience with NOA that makes me view it more favorable.

 

[diplomat33]

 

[diplomat33]

Tesla seems to be rolling out new updates pretty quickly recently.

 

[Randy7fx]

Elon also said this would be out in approximately 6 weeks...back in November.

 

[diplomat33]

Getting back to the original topic of this thread, which was Musk tweeting that FSD will be feature complete this year, Tesla does seem to be pushing hard to make it happen. We've already gotten 2 FSD features pushed out recently (traffic light detection and NOA with no confirmation) and a third on its way (Enhanced Summon). Additionally, the AP3 computer is going into production and Tesla is going to showcase their FSD progress on April 22. So those are some good signs that Tesla is certainly gunning hard for FSD.

 

[Bladerskb]

Getting back to the original topic of this thread, which was Musk tweeting that FSD will be feature complete this year, Tesla does seem to be pushing hard to make it happen. We've already gotten 2 FSD features pushed out recently (traffic light detection and NOA with no confirmation) and a third on its way (Enhanced Summon). Additionally, the AP3 computer is going into production and Tesla is going to showcase their FSD progress on April 22. So those are some good signs that Tesla is certainly gunning hard for FSD.

Both of these are EAP features. Why are you trying to rewrite history...why?

 

[diplomat33]

Both of these are EAP features. Why are you trying to rewrite history...why?

I am not rewriting history. Tesla moved them over to the FSD column. Yes, I know they used to be EAP. But now they are considered FSD so it is accurate to say Tesla released FSD features since that is what they are labeled as NOW. After all, we have to go with how Tesla lists them NOW since that is how Tesla looks at the features NOW. Going with old labels that Tesla does not use anymore does not make any sense.

I still think it was wrong for Tesla to make them EAP features to begin with. They always should have been FSD from the start but that's just my personal opinion.

 

[mhan00]

I found a pretty good video of the new NOA. You can see the car does all the highway driving without any additional input other than than the standard AP nag. The car is also clearly tracking other cars in adjacent lanes as we see it wait until the lane is clear before making the lane change.

I don’t particularly like vids like this where it’s clear the driver is holding their phone and doing camera shots instead of concentrating on driving. Chances are low that something happens, but if something then not only does the split attention slow possible response time, so does the possible need to decide if you’re going to drop the phone to use your other hand to grab the wheel too.

 

[diplomat33]

I don’t particularly like vids like this where it’s clear the driver is holding their phone and doing camera shots instead of concentrating on driving. Chances are low that something happens, but if something then not only does the split attention slow possible response time, so does the possible need to decide if you’re going to drop the phone to use your other hand to grab the wheel too.

yeah, I agree. The capability of NOA in the video is nice but the driver should be more responsible.

 

[mhan00]

Tesla seems to be rolling out new updates pretty quickly recently.

Building up hype before the event later this month? Hopefully this is a sign that the event will only be slightly related to these already released features and will be concentrating on the more advanced stuff.

 

[diplomat33]

Building up hype before the event later this month? Hopefully this is a sign that the event will only be slightly related to these already released features and will be concentrating on the more advanced stuff.

Yes, I hope so. I also think the new updates is a sign that Tesla is making progress on these features.

 

[Bladerskb]

I am not rewriting history. Tesla moved them over to the FSD column. Yes, I know they used to be EAP. But now they are considered FSD so it is accurate to say Tesla released FSD features since that is what they are labeled as NOW. After all, we have to go with how Tesla lists them NOW since that is how Tesla looks at the features NOW. Going with old labels that Tesla does not use anymore does not make any sense.

I still think it was wrong for Tesla to make them EAP features to begin with. They always should have been FSD from the start but that's just my personal opinion.

No they are EAP features, just because its been rebranded for sales purposes and created a clusterfck doesn't make them FSD. Tesla has yet to release a FSD feature period.

 

[iTech]

I am not rewriting history. Tesla moved them over to the FSD column. Yes, I know they used to be EAP. But now they are considered FSD so it is accurate to say Tesla released FSD features since that is what they are labeled as NOW. After all, we have to go with how Tesla lists them NOW since that is how Tesla looks at the features NOW. Going with old labels that Tesla does not use anymore does not make any sense.

I still think it was wrong for Tesla to make them EAP features to begin with. They always should have been FSD from the start but that's just my personal opinion.

Uhhh, Tesla sold it as EAP regardless of what they sell it as now. There hasn't been a true FSD feature release that fits in the old and new definition of FSD.

 

[diplomat33]

There hasn't been a true FSD feature release that fits in the old and new definition of FSD.

Well traffic light detection is now added in our cars and it was never a EAP feature. By any definition, it's a FSD feature.

 

[Randy7fx]

Well traffic light detection is now added in our cars and it was never a EAP feature. By any definition, it's a FSD feature.

Pretty sure traffic light detection doesn't do anything right now....would hardly call that a feature that has been rolled out.

I am super excited about the 22nd though!

 

[favo]

Pretty sure traffic light detection doesn't do anything right now....would hardly call that a feature that has been rolled out.

It only gives a warning when it thinks you are on the verge of running a red light, similar to Forward Collision Warning (FCW) alerting if it thinks you about to hit something. It's not supposed to alert you to every red light as you approach. And they specifically say it will not detect every light, currently. Basically, it's a Bad Driver Warning (BDW). If you get the warning, you did something wrong. I wouldn't be surprised if it gives a false positive sometimes, though, since FCW does. (However, FW 8.5 seems better in that regard for me so far--no false warnings in 3 days.)