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Elon Musk the next Bernie madoff?

Discussion in 'Tesla' started by Chopr147, Nov 16, 2016.

  1. Chopr147

    Chopr147 Active Member

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  2. Krypto Kat

    Krypto Kat Member

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    "crony capitalism" is a problem, but it's woven into the fabric of the world that it can't be removed without tearing up the cloth.

    Did you just question Elon the great:eek:? On this forum:mad:? You will have to watch your back:rolleyes:.
     
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  3. Chopr147

    Chopr147 Active Member

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    I know on this forum it could get me evicted. :) I love Elon and not really sure how accurate it is but there is no denying Solarcity has received a ton of subsidies. I know, I know oil companies have as well and even more billions have gone that way. Trillions are wasted on propping up "friends of uncle" but that does not make it right for Solar City who cannot seem to make a profit as the largest solar co. in the U.S.
     
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  4. Ovulation

    Ovulation Member

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    David Williams

    David Williams is president of Taxpayers Protection Alliance, a Washington-based nonprofit and nonpartisan organization that researches, and educates the public about, the government’s effects on the economy.


    It'd interesting that a Taxpayers Protection advocate goes after Musk and clean tech when everyone knows that the much bigger welfare queens are the fossil fuel industry or defense contractors ^^
     
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  5. Xenius

    Xenius Member

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    So, this guys is on a "non-partisan" organization, but two of the linked "sources" in this opinion piece are Redstate.com and Politico?

    This article is trash and I feel bad that I may have given them revenue by clicking on it.

    Yes, SolarCity has gotten a lot of subsidies, new technologies take time and effort. Can't wait until oil has died and green energy has taken over so we can properly deride the articles of the dinosaurs like this one.
     
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  6. lklundin

    lklundin Member

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    The government subsidies for Solar City was awarded because that company was determined in an open and a priori known process to be carrying out the decided policies of the government.

    That is exactly how taxes and subsidies are used, as tools to promote one behavior over another.

    There nothing wrong with that. To the extent that the just completed election was democratic, then the expected change of what the government will reward from now on shows that the system is working, in the sense that it carries out what the voters wished for.

    So this is just another hit-piece from someone whose business model is being made obsolete by Elon Musk.
     
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  7. djplong

    djplong Member

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    Puh-leeze. The Daily Signal, at the bottom of the article, asks for donations to support it's conservative views. That should tell you all you need to know.
     
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  8. gnxs

    gnxs Member

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    Ever since I watched the "Merchants of Doubt" DVD I've been naturally suspicious every time I see an organization that has one of these consumer oriented, benign looking names (i.e. Taxpayers Protection Alliance).

    I found this on the web:

    Taxpayer Protection Alliance Attacks on Renewable Energy

    Not sure of its validity, but it certainly raises some questions.
     
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  9. Xenius

    Xenius Member

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  10. Chopr147

    Chopr147 Active Member

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    Gov't subsidies are a great thing. I believe in them and they have been a good jump-start to businesses like solar and renewable energies. Until there not :) Remember Mitt Romney said a few years ago that "We pick all the losers" when it came to gov't investment. He included Tesla in that statement and history has proved him wrong at least in one case
     
  11. bh1783

    bh1783 Member

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    Solar City executive compensation 2015: $152 million
    SCTY SolarCity Corp Executive Compensation
    TSLA executive compensation in comparison:
    TSLA Tesla Motors Inc Executive Compensation
    AAPL executive compensation:
    AAPL Apple Inc Executive Compensation
     
  12. 3PHASE

    3PHASE 3PHASE

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    So, here we are today, a little over 100 years ago, when electric cars fell to motorized vehicles. Could we see this happen again? Are there no more innovations in engine efficiency? Could a 100 mpg gas engine and abundant oil kill electrics?

    Permian’s Wolfcamp formation called biggest shale oil field in U.S.

    Permian’s Wolfcamp formation called biggest shale oil field in U.S.
     
  13. bh1783

    bh1783 Member

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  14. Waiting4M3

    Waiting4M3 Active Member

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    First of all, low oil price or better gas mileage does not equate to a low ICE car price. Engines, transmissions, and gas related car parts will not become cheaper just because oil can be cheaper or run more miles in a car. If/when battery becomes cheaper than engine/transmission, it's game over for ICE cars.

    Also, oil may get cheaper, but solar/wind will too. Oil is an 100+ year old industry, the others are just getting started. Which ones do you think have more room to grow in terms of pricing and economy of scale?
     
  15. Chopr147

    Chopr147 Active Member

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    Everyone! needs to drive electric vehicles to see how much better they are. As we Tesla owners know and often say "no way will I ever go back to an ICE"
     
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  16. Vitold

    Vitold Active Member

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    #16 Vitold, Nov 16, 2016
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2016
    This article is obvious FUD, concoction of old and new, unfounded, accusations.
    Only subsidies Republicans don't like are those that do not go to their coffers.

    USA is lagging behind and it looks like it's going to get worse under Republican government. Back to the 20th century we go.
     
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  17. davecolene0606

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    No, and the proof lies in the fact that the ICE companies already are whining about EPA mileage requirements. Additionally, thaynhave demonstrated the only way they have gotten as far as they have with milieage has been to cheat with software.:confused:
     
  18. Chopr147

    Chopr147 Active Member

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    Because the Democrats care about the environment and the American people? Hey, i'm not defending Republican's but this "only the other guys are crooked" mentality is how each side can keep their heads in the sand.
    Of course i'm a racist, sexist, misogynist so what do I know? :)
     
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  19. kort677

    kort677 Active Member

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    you left out deplorable;)
     
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  20. kort677

    kort677 Active Member

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    and forcing people to accept your views on how things should be is the way to go? SMH!
    how about letting the market for EVs evolve to a point where owning an EV is a viable choice?
    currently an EV for the masses does not exist yet.
    forcing people to accept change rarely works well.
     
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