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Estimate The Horsepower of the P75DL

Discussion in 'Model 3' started by juanmedina, Apr 19, 2017.

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Model 3 P75DL Horsepower

  1. 400-450hp

    21 vote(s)
    24.7%
  2. 450-500hp

    23 vote(s)
    27.1%
  3. 500-550hp

    27 vote(s)
    31.8%
  4. 550-600hp

    7 vote(s)
    8.2%
  5. 600-650hp

    2 vote(s)
    2.4%
  6. 650-700hp

    2 vote(s)
    2.4%
  7. 700hp+

    3 vote(s)
    3.5%
  1. juanmedina

    juanmedina Member

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    Independent testing of the Model S P100DL have shown that the car makes around 567KW or 760HP.


    What horsepower you guys think the Model 3 P75DL will make?
     
  2. xmetal

    xmetal Member

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    Elon has recently made it pretty clear that the Model 3 will be a great car, but no where near the Model S, so I do not anticipate even the top version of the 3 being able to touch the S in terms of power or speed. The tweets and blog posts about the S being the pinnacle of tech and speed seem to be clearly setting an expectation.
     
  3. juanmedina

    juanmedina Member

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    For reference a P85D made 540hp and a P85DL 610hp
     
  4. Topher

    Topher Energy Curmudgeon

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    Math would therefore put a battery limited P75DL Model 3 at roughly 525 HP.

    I can't imagine Elon Musk motor (or otherwise) limiting the Model 3 when he can price limit it instead.

    Thank you kindly.
     
  5. EXOTIC1

    EXOTIC1 Member

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    P75DL will be a 3.2-3.3 second car 0-60 and should run very hi 11's
     
  6. R.S

    R.S Member

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    But therefore the cells would need to be the same as used in the P100D today. I could definitely see the Model 3 being motor limited, as well. Especially if those new cells increase power density more, than energy density. Which seems likely, since Tesla wants to reduce charging times.
     
  7. Topher

    Topher Energy Curmudgeon

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    Why would Tesla do that? They could put a motor in which matches the power output of the battery pack, and charge a higher price for the increased performance.

    Any evidence that the new batteries have higher power density?

    Thank you kindly.
     
  8. R.S

    R.S Member

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    Well there are three ways this could go.

    1) More motor power than battery power. This way Tesla spends too much on the motor, without gaining anything.
    2) More battery power than motor power. That would be like with most Teslas, besides the S and X PD models. It would be the lowest cost option to reach a certain performance level.
    3) They match motor and battery output perfectly. This would be the hardest to achieve, if they keep using regular motors, used in the more mainstream models, for the performance models.

    So to me it seems that option 2 seems at least as likely as 1 and 3.

    No real evidence, but it seems likely. The power increase from 85 to 90 was higher than the range increase. And it seems they want to charge those new cells more quickly, which should also have an effect on how quickly those can discharge.

    Tesla 2170 Battery Cells: Greater Power At Comparable Cost

    This article mentions a 2 fold increase in power, while only increasing 50% in size. But to me it seems they just confused power with energy again. (3000mA, seems way too low for Teslas current cells, 15A seems more likely)
     
  9. Topher

    Topher Energy Curmudgeon

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    This is precisely what they do on the Model S. Performance models get higher Horsepower motors (in both RWD and AWD models). I expect them to do the same in the Model 3. They do have a few engineers working there...

    Thank you kindly.
     
  10. wallet.dat

    wallet.dat Member

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    I could live with that.
     
  11. SabrToothSqrl

    SabrToothSqrl Active Member

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    I just think it's funny we are measuring an electric car against living things... you know... like... a horse? :)
     
    • Funny x 1
  12. Swampgator

    Swampgator Member

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    Well,

    We already know that Tesla has an invertor capable of delivering over 300 kw to a single motor on the model 3
    Tesla Model 3 exclusive leaked specs: 300kW+ inverter architecture putting its power capacity near Model S

    If they use a smaller motor on the P75D up front as on Model S you still could have 500kw total. Also, we have reason to believe 2170 batteries will offer higher C rates than 18650s.

    Tesla 2170 Battery Cells: Greater Power At Comparable Cost

    So I see no reason to believe you can't get 500kw which = 670hp.
    That should put a 3800 lb P75D 0-60 in about 3 seconds flat.
    That's my best guess and still makes it comfortably slower than the P100D Model S
     
    • Like x 3
  13. juanmedina

    juanmedina Member

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    500kw would be amazing :). I hope you are right
     
  14. Watts 4 Me

    Watts 4 Me Member

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    Mid to high 11 sec is good for me.
     
  15. Garlan Garner

    Garlan Garner Well-Known Member

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    I just wondering what the high end discharge rate is for the 2170 batteries. If the batteries can discharge faster than the previous 1680's then I'm not sure why the capacity of the batteries matters.

    In other words.....give me the launch capabilities of the MS P100D.....in the P75D car. Why not? Its just a matter of being able to execute "x" fewer launches with the P75D.
     
  16. JeffK

    JeffK Well-Known Member

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    Even if they only discharge at the same C rate as the P100D you'd be talking about 75 * 5.67 C = 425 kW and if the vehicle is really 20% lighter for each given capacity then it might be able to have performance around what the older P90DL was capable of.

    It wouldn't be as fast as a P100D but it'd be slower by only a few tenths of a second one would think. I could be way off.
     
  17. Garlan Garner

    Garlan Garner Well-Known Member

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    That would be 100% acceptable to me.
     
    • Like x 1
  18. R.S

    R.S Member

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    They actually get the same motors. The ones used in the regular cars are software limited, the motor is the same in a P85, as in a 60 (I am not sure if the inverter is different, though)

    That might be the best option for the Model S, which was originally planned to sell 20k times a year, but not really for the Model 3, where the cost of the motor will have a much larger percentual impact on the cost of the car, than it did with the Model S.

    I would say that is actually very possible. The main question is if they even want to go that high, with the performance Model 3, because of cost and competition reasons. 3 seconds would still beat any competition and if they can still achieve a price of less than 70k, that would make more sense than go even higher, but having to ask more for it. If they had to design special lower volume "performance motors/inverters", for example.

    I don't think the Model S will be any factor in that decision. Just because the battery is a third larger, they can just put in an even crazier amount of power, even if they might need to go for a 3 motor setup, to sit comfortably on top of the more plebeian Model 3 P75D.
     
  19. juanmedina

    juanmedina Member

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    Isn't the coefficient of drag supposed to be better than the Model S?
     
  20. Gen3Joe

    Gen3Joe Member

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    Yes. Model S is 0.24 and Model 3 is supposed to be close to 0.21
     

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