But it's supposed to come with floor mats, so, sadly, we have to ignore the effect the coefficient of drag has on horsepower.
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Estimate The Horsepower of the P75DL
- Thread starter juanmedina
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But it's supposed to come with floor mats, so, sadly, we have to ignore the effect the coefficient of drag has on horsepower.
Xenoilphobe
Well-Known Member
Xenoilphobe
Well-Known Member
That would erode sales of the S. We might see that in a couple of years, Elon is being measured on volume not diversity, once sales of the 3 slows, they might offer a D and later a PxD.
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JeffK
Well-Known Member
Xenoilphobe
Well-Known Member
Summary from the SEC Filing.
Musk earns one tenth of the options every time Tesla hits a pair of goals — one tied to its market value and another to the company’s operations. He has already achieved seven targets tied to the growth of Tesla’s market capitalization. He has only achieved five of the operational targets, however. Still, that entitles him to half of the options, or 2.64 million shares of stock. At the end of the trading day last Friday, those shares would be worth $589 million.
Musk has already guided the company to the introduction of the Model S and Model X. The Model 3 is scheduled to go on sale in late 2017. More than 400,000 people have reserved one to date. Tesla has also begun selling its Powerwall and Powerpack energy storage batteries to residential and commercial customers.
What does Musk have to do to qualify for all the options? Before 2022, he needs to boost Tesla’s value another 28% to $43.2 billion. He also has to maintain a 30% gross profit margin for four quarters, bring the company’s total production to 300,000 vehicles and bring the Model 3 to market. This month, six analysts set 12 month price targets for Tesla stock of $325 or more. At that price, the company’s total valuation would exceed the minimum target established in the option agreement.
Further he openly stated no AWD option for the 3 until 2018 at the earliest. This will help him meet the production goals by keeping the car simple to produce and streamlining their limited production capacity. Tesla Model 3 will not be available with all-wheel-drive dual motors at launch, says Elon Musk
What gets measured gets done. Volume is key, followed closely by margin. Once margin erodes we will see a model 3 PxD to increase profits.
Does that make sense? By then the model S could have a dual motor (theoretical) 1000 HP car with the new battery and enhanced inverters and create separation in performance between the top end S and top end 3.
Either way the PxD 3 will be a nice pocket rocket in 2018++.
Musk earns one tenth of the options every time Tesla hits a pair of goals — one tied to its market value and another to the company’s operations. He has already achieved seven targets tied to the growth of Tesla’s market capitalization. He has only achieved five of the operational targets, however. Still, that entitles him to half of the options, or 2.64 million shares of stock. At the end of the trading day last Friday, those shares would be worth $589 million.
Musk has already guided the company to the introduction of the Model S and Model X. The Model 3 is scheduled to go on sale in late 2017. More than 400,000 people have reserved one to date. Tesla has also begun selling its Powerwall and Powerpack energy storage batteries to residential and commercial customers.
What does Musk have to do to qualify for all the options? Before 2022, he needs to boost Tesla’s value another 28% to $43.2 billion. He also has to maintain a 30% gross profit margin for four quarters, bring the company’s total production to 300,000 vehicles and bring the Model 3 to market. This month, six analysts set 12 month price targets for Tesla stock of $325 or more. At that price, the company’s total valuation would exceed the minimum target established in the option agreement.
Further he openly stated no AWD option for the 3 until 2018 at the earliest. This will help him meet the production goals by keeping the car simple to produce and streamlining their limited production capacity. Tesla Model 3 will not be available with all-wheel-drive dual motors at launch, says Elon Musk
What gets measured gets done. Volume is key, followed closely by margin. Once margin erodes we will see a model 3 PxD to increase profits.
Does that make sense? By then the model S could have a dual motor (theoretical) 1000 HP car with the new battery and enhanced inverters and create separation in performance between the top end S and top end 3.
Either way the PxD 3 will be a nice pocket rocket in 2018++.
JeffK
Well-Known Member
Small problem with that theory .... Elon has never "confirmed" AWD will be next year. That was an assumption made about his tweet.
Here's a more recent tweet for you to read:
Elon Musk on Twitter
The performance version though, he did confirm to be next year.
If you're thinking about acceleration, torque is what you want to know. Off the line, torque is all that matters. For top speed, power (kW) is all that matters. Power comes into play as speed increases, overcoming aerodynamic drag and internal resistance (tires, etc.). Power gradually starts to become important, say, above 50 mph.
Xenoilphobe
Well-Known Member
Weird that they would offer The D without the PxD first. Remember how the offered the P100D then slow rolled the 100D once demand cooled on the P.
I'll never figure out their marketing strategy.
I'll never figure out their marketing strategy.
JeffK
Well-Known Member
This one is probably not about marketing strategy as there's no issue with that (see number of pre-orders). The decision to go in this order is likely due to manufacturing complexity and part sourcing.
As you mentioned the goal is to get the most Model 3s out the door as soon as possible.
Whistle2Whine
Member
Depends on the inverter used, I'd think. Electrical Engineering folks, please correct me if any of this is wrong but: I'm going to guestimate somewhere in the low to mid 500HP range. This is assuming they use the same motors they have in the 90 and 100 D models, which are capable of delivering around 550. Based on the work done by wk057 and those numbers, it seems the limitation with Tesla's motors is inverter-based. Therefore, I'm assuming if the Inconel-based inverters used in the P90 and P100D's are utilized, even with the smaller motors and a 75kwh battery, said motors would be able to deliver their max power.
What's nice is that this would easily put Tesla ahead of most of their mid-size super sedan peers: Cadillac's ATS-V and BMW's M3/M4 are in the mid-400s, with the new Alfa Giulia Q4 and MB C63AMG being just over 500. So if Tesla can keep the weight down to at or under 4500 lbs, with ~500 hp, that'll be a winner, and W2W's next car
What's nice is that this would easily put Tesla ahead of most of their mid-size super sedan peers: Cadillac's ATS-V and BMW's M3/M4 are in the mid-400s, with the new Alfa Giulia Q4 and MB C63AMG being just over 500. So if Tesla can keep the weight down to at or under 4500 lbs, with ~500 hp, that'll be a winner, and W2W's next car
JeffK
Well-Known Member
Tesla Model 3 exclusive leaked specs: 300kW+ inverter architecture putting its power capacity near Model SDepends on the inverter used, I'd think. Electrical Engineering folks, please correct me if any of this is wrong but: I'm going to guestimate somewhere in the low to mid 500HP range. This is assuming they use the same motors they have in the 90 and 100 D models, which are capable of delivering around 550. Based on the work done by wk057 and those numbers, it seems the limitation with Tesla's motors is inverter-based. Therefore, I'm assuming if the Inconel-based inverters used in the P90 and P100D's are utilized, even with the smaller motors and a 75kwh battery, said motors would be able to deliver their max power.
What's nice is that this would easily put Tesla ahead of most of their mid-size super sedan peers: Cadillac's ATS-V and BMW's M3/M4 are in the mid-400s, with the new Alfa Giulia Q4 and MB C63AMG being just over 500. So if Tesla can keep the weight down to at or under 4500 lbs, with ~500 hp, that'll be a winner, and W2W's next car
Now P100D+ ratings are near 580 kW or around 5.8 C from the battery. If the Model 3 can pull 435 kW what do you think it'd be capable of if there was a 20% weight reduction?
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Yeah I don't get either. I hope to get my P75D in the first quarter of next year and I am fine with that. I put my reservation online on the reveal day.
Xenoilphobe
Well-Known Member
Swampgator
Active Member
Tesla will NOT use the same motor as in the S and X.
Why would they? The Model 3 will be 20% lighter than the S, so a smaller motor will give plenty of go power along with the required efficiency.
There is also a report of a third party vendor stating they are making permanent magnet motors for the M3. SO if true this will be a major departure for Tesla. But one thing for sure is that Tesla is not afraid to challenge the current orthodoxy...even when it is their own.
Some think they will be using a new, hybrid type motor than is more efficient than a given induction or PM motor of the same size.
This is the fun stuff we get to see at the next reveal.
Why would they? The Model 3 will be 20% lighter than the S, so a smaller motor will give plenty of go power along with the required efficiency.
There is also a report of a third party vendor stating they are making permanent magnet motors for the M3. SO if true this will be a major departure for Tesla. But one thing for sure is that Tesla is not afraid to challenge the current orthodoxy...even when it is their own.
Some think they will be using a new, hybrid type motor than is more efficient than a given induction or PM motor of the same size.
This is the fun stuff we get to see at the next reveal.
Xenoilphobe
Well-Known Member
Tesla will NOT use the same motor as in the S and X.
Why would they? The Model 3 will be 20% lighter than the S, so a smaller motor will give plenty of go power along with the required efficiency.
There is also a report of a third party vendor stating they are making permanent magnet motors for the M3. SO if true this will be a major departure for Tesla. But one thing for sure is that Tesla is not afraid to challenge the current orthodoxy...even when it is their own.
Some think they will be using a new, hybrid type motor than is more efficient than a given induction or PM motor of the same size.
This is the fun stuff we get to see at the next reveal.
I believe you are absolutely right - a vaguely remember reading about a vendor working a solution. Zero Motorcycles went with a similar design using the Permanent Magnet Motor design for durability against heat - allowing them to increase the HP. Imagine 4 of these on an M3 -
Going Electric Technology || ZERO MOTORCYCLES - 280 HP and 470 FT/LBS of torque. Also someone above stated torque is king for acceleration - I can't keep the front wheel of my Zero MC on the road - and the acceleration is blistering fast... an IPM motor would be huge...
One of the reasons I like Tesla is that they don't behave like a car company - Toyota would have raided the current parts bin to develop the M3.... Tesla not so much... I think the M3 is going to be a big hit - the fact that they announced doubling Supercharger capacity by the end of 2017 also is an indicator that they know they have a great product tee'd up... going to be a fun year... personally, I am waiting for the truck/suv RAV4 like model..
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JeffK
Well-Known Member
Xenoilphobe
Well-Known Member
The old design "glued" the magnets to the wall of the motor - the newer IPM motor -does not. Once the old motor overheated you risked having the the glue melt, which heat limited how hard you could push the motor.
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