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The Blue Owl
Endangerous Herbivore
I also find this surprising. Granted, my knowledge of Denmark comes from Borgen and other assorted TV series, but the image I got about the place was that of a very advanced, progressive society, in which the political process for the most part works for the good of the country. Is that image mistaken?
RobStark
Well-Known Member
As Audi and Mercedes owners keep telling us Model S is not luxurious.
Quality of materials, interior specs, fit and finish is not up to German standards of luxury.
I keep hearing interior is comparable to Toyota Camry but not even as good as a VW Passat.
Tesla is a premium priced alternative fuel vehicle.
I have heard Europeans say Tesla is an American Muscle Car just with electric motors instead of V8's but comparable interiors.
Anyway, these decisions just prove there is stupid everywhere. Even in Scandinavia.
Quality of materials, interior specs, fit and finish is not up to German standards of luxury.
I keep hearing interior is comparable to Toyota Camry but not even as good as a VW Passat.
Tesla is a premium priced alternative fuel vehicle.
I have heard Europeans say Tesla is an American Muscle Car just with electric motors instead of V8's but comparable interiors.
Anyway, these decisions just prove there is stupid everywhere. Even in Scandinavia.
Johan
Ex got M3 in the divorce, waiting for EU Model Y!
Everyone can be bought and paid for. And it doesn't help that for some reason the Danish electorate has elected the equivalent of rednecks to govern the country, a populist, racist party for the uneducated, french fries eating, soft drink drinking, alcoholic, cigarette smoking masses. (The life expectancy of the Danes is pretty appalling compared to Swedes and Norwegians, considered we're the same genetically. Never mind the Finns and their poor genes and high cholesterol. Life expectancy — Nordic cooperation)
Benz
Active Member
Such parties are on the rise in a few more countries in Europe as well. In The Netherlands there is this PVV party, it's also a populist and racist party. Although they are getting more and more popular every year, I still hope that they will never win the elections here in The Netherlands.
Both the Camry and the Passat are considered luxury cars in Denmark. They mostly buy new mini-cars like the Kia Picanto. For Toyota the Auris is probably the most selling car and for VW it's probably the Up!.
SebastianR
Active Member
Alright folks, I think we need to put things in perspective: I'm not a Dane - I'm just a guest in this country. So I do think Denmark & the Danes are - overall - a fantastic country and great people. Many many many things work beautifully well and if every country was like Denmark, this world would be a much much better place (I'm saying this having personally lived or worked in some 30+ different countries from the US, to Scandinavia to the Pacific, Asia, Africa and Latin America).
Having said this, every country has its blind spots. This legislation is pretty bad for Denmark and is likely to throw the country back with regards to its sustainability efforts. There seem to be other blind spots emerging lately which includes the way the country deals with the refugee situation etc. But let's not get into politics now.
Tesla's position in the country was quite unique to date: this year Tesla will likely sell as many cars in DK as Audi sells A6 cars. Tesla's become a common and frequent sight at least in Copenhagen and people that would otherwise buy A4/3 Series / C-Class are buying quite a few Teslas. What you can see here is what will happen when Model 3 will come and start to compete with the "upper middle class" cars: A friend of mine who was proudly driving a German engineered Mercedes C-Class sat in a Tesla once and decided to get the car - even if that costs more money. He certainly didn't care about electric cars, he just sat in the car, said "this is cool, I gotta have one" and bought the car.
I hate the current move of the legislation: I think it is too early and it removes the incentives for Audi, Mercedes & Co. to have compelling cars for DK. But I'm grateful that we could have seen what will happen the moment electric cars are just a wheee bit better: They will kill the establishment.
Having said this, every country has its blind spots. This legislation is pretty bad for Denmark and is likely to throw the country back with regards to its sustainability efforts. There seem to be other blind spots emerging lately which includes the way the country deals with the refugee situation etc. But let's not get into politics now.
Tesla's position in the country was quite unique to date: this year Tesla will likely sell as many cars in DK as Audi sells A6 cars. Tesla's become a common and frequent sight at least in Copenhagen and people that would otherwise buy A4/3 Series / C-Class are buying quite a few Teslas. What you can see here is what will happen when Model 3 will come and start to compete with the "upper middle class" cars: A friend of mine who was proudly driving a German engineered Mercedes C-Class sat in a Tesla once and decided to get the car - even if that costs more money. He certainly didn't care about electric cars, he just sat in the car, said "this is cool, I gotta have one" and bought the car.
I hate the current move of the legislation: I think it is too early and it removes the incentives for Audi, Mercedes & Co. to have compelling cars for DK. But I'm grateful that we could have seen what will happen the moment electric cars are just a wheee bit better: They will kill the establishment.
Benz
Active Member
"Tesla to fight Denmark's new tax on electric cars"
Link: http://www.thelocal.dk/20151012/tesla-to-fight-denmarks-tax-on-electric-cars
Link: http://www.thelocal.dk/20151012/tesla-to-fight-denmarks-tax-on-electric-cars
AustinPowers
Total Smeghead
I don't want to delve too deep into politics either, but I guess if the refugee crisis continues to grow the way it currently does, I predict that in a few years right wing and racist parties will again be sitting in many parliaments across Europe. Let's just hope the whole situation can be resolved in a peaceful and fair manner before the abovementioned tendencies get too much footing. Because, apart from all the other risks, I am sure that fostering sustainable transport is not the highest priority of those populist and racist parties.
Switzerland reports 157 Tesla Model S sales in September 2015 (up 500% compared to September `14). Thereby Switzerland comes in as 2nd best market in Europe in Q3 (511 Model S sold), right behind Norway (569 Model S sold). Just to put that into perspective:
Population U.S.: 320 million / MS sold ytd: ~16.000 / = 50 MS per million people
Population Norway: 5.2 million / MS sold ytd: ~3.300 / = 634 MS per million people
Population Switzerland: 8.2 million / MS sold ytd: ~1.200 / =146 MS per million people
Some interesting observations from the Swiss auto sales statistics:
-> With 1.149 Model S sold ytd, Tesla is now outselling all direct rivals in the luxury sedan segment including the MB S-Class (641).
-> More astonishing, in the direct neighbourhood of German premium car factories (it's just a two-hour drive across the border to Stuttgart, the very heartland of Porsche and Mercedes-Benz), the Model S is selling better ytd than e.g. the Porsche 911 [take this, VW-Mueller!], Porsche Panamera, Porsche Cayenne, MB CLS-Class, MB ML-/GLE-Class, MB V-Class, BMW X4, BMW X6, Audi Q7, Audi TT, Audi A7, Audi A5.
-> It's even outselling cars like the Ford Fusion(Mondeo) or Honda Jazz.
-> MS is only some 70 cars behind the MB E-Class and might end up selling better than the E-Class by the end of the year.
Population U.S.: 320 million / MS sold ytd: ~16.000 / = 50 MS per million people
Population Norway: 5.2 million / MS sold ytd: ~3.300 / = 634 MS per million people
Population Switzerland: 8.2 million / MS sold ytd: ~1.200 / =146 MS per million people
Some interesting observations from the Swiss auto sales statistics:
-> With 1.149 Model S sold ytd, Tesla is now outselling all direct rivals in the luxury sedan segment including the MB S-Class (641).
-> More astonishing, in the direct neighbourhood of German premium car factories (it's just a two-hour drive across the border to Stuttgart, the very heartland of Porsche and Mercedes-Benz), the Model S is selling better ytd than e.g. the Porsche 911 [take this, VW-Mueller!], Porsche Panamera, Porsche Cayenne, MB CLS-Class, MB ML-/GLE-Class, MB V-Class, BMW X4, BMW X6, Audi Q7, Audi TT, Audi A7, Audi A5.
-> It's even outselling cars like the Ford Fusion(Mondeo) or Honda Jazz.
-> MS is only some 70 cars behind the MB E-Class and might end up selling better than the E-Class by the end of the year.
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Good question. Looking at the statistics, it clearly looks like Tesla has been eating into the sales of German premium cars like the MB S-Class MB CLS-Class, Porsche Panamera, but also lower-priced cars like the E-Class and BMW 5-series.
There's not much special incentives for EVs either. The kwh is a bit cheaper in Switzerland than in Germany and the import tax seems to be lowered for EVs but that's it. Well, there may also be some effects based on some obvious mistakes with pricing Germany brands seem to be making in Switzerland. To put it simply, since the Swiss are about 20-40% richer than the average German, MB, BMW and Porsche thought that they could earn more on their cars in Switzerland. Thus, the luxury sedans are much more expensive than the Tesla Model S. Kudos to Elon Musk who said from the start, that Tesla cars will be priced almost equally throughout the world, accounting for transport and duty costs. Obviously, the Swiss are tired of the German luxury brand rip-off...
There's not much special incentives for EVs either. The kwh is a bit cheaper in Switzerland than in Germany and the import tax seems to be lowered for EVs but that's it. Well, there may also be some effects based on some obvious mistakes with pricing Germany brands seem to be making in Switzerland. To put it simply, since the Swiss are about 20-40% richer than the average German, MB, BMW and Porsche thought that they could earn more on their cars in Switzerland. Thus, the luxury sedans are much more expensive than the Tesla Model S. Kudos to Elon Musk who said from the start, that Tesla cars will be priced almost equally throughout the world, accounting for transport and duty costs. Obviously, the Swiss are tired of the German luxury brand rip-off...
Benz
Active Member
Correct
But there is a geographical advantage as well. Switzerland is in the heart of Europe. Lots of Superchargers in Switzerland and also in the surrounding countries. And more Supercharger stations are coming in Europe (on average +/- 100 per year?).
Tesla Switzerland added several service centers,
distances are generally short,
motorway speeds are limited to 120 km/h
No home industry bias.
Tesla Switzerland is well managed and
secured across the board, right from the start with the Roadster, well qualified staff.
Switzerland is often regarded as a Test Market for cars. That bodes well also for future sales elsewhere.
distances are generally short,
motorway speeds are limited to 120 km/h
No home industry bias.
Tesla Switzerland is well managed and
secured across the board, right from the start with the Roadster, well qualified staff.
Switzerland is often regarded as a Test Market for cars. That bodes well also for future sales elsewhere.
Maybe just a technicality - they are up year over year, but that is not new, has been like that for most of 2015. Surge sounds more short-term. Monthly numbers since January 2015:
30-19-149-117-70-253-199-155-157 (see our wiki table here).
The quarterly numbers are interesting. The following graph demonstrates the change best. You can see Switzerland was not doing so well in Q1 but then in Q2 and Q3 it outperformed Germany.
I hope you guys enjoy the new graphs. I think the wiki team did an excellent job switching to Google sheets.
I hope you guys enjoy the new graphs. I think the wiki team did an excellent job switching to Google sheets.
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RobStark
Well-Known Member
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