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Discussion in 'Charging Standards and Infrastructure' started by smartypnz, May 19, 2015.
So a $450 CHAdeMO adapter equates to how many tanks of gas?
A CHAdeMO equates to multiple hours saved over using a L2 charger.
CHAdeMO equates to about 120 miles of charge per hour.
L2 charger equates to between 17 to 29 miles of charge per hour.
And as a last ditch charging Option, L3 charger (110V outlet) equates to between 3 to 4 miles of charge per hour.
NO, CHAdeMO charging is not as fast as a Supercharger (170 miles of charge in 30 min.) but then again, NOTHING else is [as fast].
Just a note -- you have your L-numbers reversed:
- L1 EVSEs are 110VAC i.e. wall-outlet-style
- L2 EVSEs are 208-240VAC i.e. Tesla's UMC with NEMA 14-50 or 10-30 adapters, or the HPWC
- L3 EVSEs are DC fast-chargers i.e. CHAdeMO, J1772 DC, and Tesla Superchargers
But all of your miles of charge per hour estimates are spot-on.
Thanks for catching my error rabar10.
(Well at least I got L2 charger correct, lol.)
L3 is always Supercharger or CHAdeMO (both DC).
I recently got a CHAdeMO adapter, have not had a chance to charge with it yet.
The J1772 (I am sure it was AC) I have used were actually slower than a 14-50 outlet in an RV Park, only about 17-19 miles of charge per hour, thus I gave up and moved on to faster charging meadows/methods.
I wasn't aware there are and I haven't encountered a J1772 DC charger yet.
Ah, the J1772 DC fast chargers are called CCS or the "Combined Charging System": SAE J1772 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
It's basically the existing J1772 (AC) plug with two big fat pins underneath it for making the high-current DC connection.
L2 can supply up to 80 amps @240V and charge up to 60mph.
I think this is still wrong!
J1772 (2012 edition) defines:
AC Level 1: Charging from a domestic 120V outlet (NEMA 5-15R or NEMA 5-20R, 12A or 16A)
AC Level 2: Charging from 208-240V AC at up to 80A.
AC Level 3: Charging from AC at up to 96kW (noted in the spec as 'historical information, has never been implemented')
DC Level 1: Charging from 200-500V DC at up to 80A (using the same connector as for AC)
DC Level 2: Charging from 200-500V DC at up to 200A (this uses the "CCS" connector).
Given the problems folks seem to have with the CHAdeMO connector, and the fact that many/most new non-Tesla L3 sites are combined CHAdeMO/CCS, I wonder if it would behoove Tesla to come up with a CCS adapter?
Perhaps I'm misinterpreting, but here's my take. I frequently make a ~ 350 mile drive to visit family. There isn't enough Supercharger coverage to make this trip the entire way, but it's doable with a CHAdeMO adapter. So far I've done this trip twice, spent about $2.50 (really) in charging fees + $450 for the adapter. I normally spend about $30 in gas each way when I drive my ICE car. So, the CHAdeMO adapter should pay for itself for my driving in about 6 more trips, which I'll definitely make by the fall.
But, besides the pure dollar amount, the CHAdeMO adapter made this trip possible for me, which made owning the car possible. CHAdeMO is slow, unreliable junk compared to Superchargers, but for me, $450 was well worth it.
Charging speed is exponential with L-level.
Charge Rate = 3 * 10[SUP](L-level - 1)[/SUP]
L1 - 3*10[SUP]0[/SUP] — 120 Volts at 12 Amps — 3 mph
L2 - 3*10[SUP]1[/SUP] — 240 Volts at 40 Amps — 28 or ~30 mph
L3 - 3*10[SUP]2[/SUP] — 360 Volts at 250 Amps — 300 mph
Where is L4; 3,000 mph??? :biggrin:
Hmmm, a battery swap in 5 minutes...
Yes, I think the original question was a reply to my statement that CHAdeMO wasn't worth $450 to me. As you point out, it's entirely based on the relative coverage of Supercharger vs. CHAdeMO.
Where I live in MD, it makes no sense to have CHAdeMO, since I have a HPWC at home and reasonable SC coverage. Having just driven to Kentucky, however, I certainly could have benefitted from CHAdeMO, saving some of the contortions I had to do. However, this is not a trip I will be making regularly.
$450 for something I might be using 5-10 times lifetime is not worth it (especially as SC coverage improves). Now, if somebody went into the Rent-a-CHAdeMO adapter business, then we'd be talking.
The rental idea is a really interesting one, and has been kicked around before.
Just got back home to SoCal from a trip to Maine and back and the CHAdeMO was very helpful in traveling in VT. With the launch of NRG eVgo in VT, the two CHAdeMO we used were very reliable and allowed me to charge for free (until mid June) at White River Junction, VT and at Ben and Jerry's (in fact, I was the first user to charge there.).
So, it's great insurance at $450 considering how much I've spent on other charging adapters at L2.
Criminy! Wish I'd seen that thread last week. A couple of those guys live close enough to me that I could have driven over and picked it up!
That is the perspective I used when I bought one. As it happens I am using it enough to make operational financial sense, but I did not know that when I bought mine.
I'll be traveling in Vermont next month, with my CHAdeMO adapter in hand for just this reason. Regarding the eVgo, did you need to have one of their RFID cards to charge? How does payment work?
I signed up, but during the free trial it was not needed (timed out and started to charge).