Marketwatch Discover
The Biden administration will ask Congress to extend incentives that have spurred a U.S. electric-vehicle market that still trails EV adoption in China.
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EV Rebates may be returning soon including Tesla based off current administrations package
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N8Howell33
Member
While I would love to see this pass, I am guessing this thing will die in the senate. I think it’s impossible to get 60 votes for this.Marketwatch Discover
The Biden administration will ask Congress to extend incentives that have spurred a U.S. electric-vehicle market that still trails EV adoption in China.
Cheburashka
Active Member
I hope it dies. The tax credit is dumb. All it does is incentivize Tesla and others to charge more. When the credits expired they simply dropped the price and that was that.
On top of that, there is no reason why my taxes should be subsidizing someone's luxury car purchase.
The big difference with China is they actually have low-cost EVs that the public can buy. I'm talking 15K crapbox type cars.
On top of that, there is no reason why my taxes should be subsidizing someone's luxury car purchase.
The big difference with China is they actually have low-cost EVs that the public can buy. I'm talking 15K crapbox type cars.
If it includes additional taxes to offset the costs, then it could pass with a simple majority. But that is still a difficult task given the political environment.
N8Howell33
Member
Yeah reconciliation process like the stimulus. They would have to offset it with increasing taxes etc and this particular proposal is in the 3-4 Trillion range I think. I am hoping it passes, I just think the odds are super low.
The typical American has different driving requirements and wants. For example, most Americans drive longer distances and want large vehicles, which is difficult given current battery tech and costs.
For my needs, a small cheap EV would be great, but I'm not the norm.
Cheburashka
Active Member
Really? Doesn't the "typical" american drive something like 30 miles a day? And also larger vehicles and luxobarges like the Model S aren't the same thing. Most Americans do not drive luxury cars.
Uncle Paul
Well-Known Member
Believe this incentive is designed to reduce the onslaught of hoards of inexpensive Chinese made EVs. Desire is to provide seed money to produce EVs and EV parts within the USA, instead of just importing the cheaper Chinese offerings.
Auto producers have seen how the Chinese have taken over and dominated the US eBike market. US manufacturers never had a chance.
Auto producers have seen how the Chinese have taken over and dominated the US eBike market. US manufacturers never had a chance.
Cheburashka
Active Member
The article linked states it will help Tesla and GM. Just another corporate giveaway from the taxpayers to the rich megacorps.
The subsidy it seem is primarily going to help the manufacturers and that is perfectly ok for the government to do. We the consumers are not going to materially benefit from it as the manufacturers who had exhausted their tax rebate will raise the prices (Tesla and GM). The companies who did not use up their tax credits will continue to sell as is and the GM and Tesla will raise prices and increase their margins. If anything, this should motivate us to load up on Tesla and GM stocks. And stocks of general battery companies.
ucmndd
Well-Known Member
If we can piss away trillions to the same billionaires and megacorps via wealth redistribution in the form of tax breaks, I don't see why we can't do the same in the name of at least incentivizing them do something globally beneficial in the process.
Given the choice, I'll take the latter. Since we seem to be incapable of choosing, I'll accept both instead of only the former.
I'm not on one side of the fence or the other (though I'll gladly take some money if they deem it), but keep in mind, just because we can afford a 100k car doesn't mean we shouldn't get the incentive. There are 100k ICE cars that are far nicer frankly, than a Tesla. The incentive is to lure me into buying a car that isn't nearly as nice and introduces issues that I have to deal with (range/charging stations etc) to go green, when I could choose a much nicer ICE car for the money.
Not saying I agree with the green act or the subsidy, but don't mistake it as "You can afford a 100k car, you shouldn't get a subsidy"
Not saying I agree with the green act or the subsidy, but don't mistake it as "You can afford a 100k car, you shouldn't get a subsidy"
AMPd
Well-Known Member
You wouldn’t get the subsidy though, I mean technically yes you will but Tesla will increase the price by the tax credit amount so the cost of the car remains the same to you. The only one benefiting from this is the auto manufacturer.
I'm not sure they would, they didn't reduce the price the full credit that went away, it was only partial. Plus it'd be a bad look. Maybe a couple thousand or they will delay or eliminate a planned decrease. Assuming it will have no benefit to consumers is a stretch.
AMPd
Well-Known Member
They reduced the price by way more than the credit. It wasn’t all at once but the car got a whole lot cheaper than it used to be.
I’m not sure why it’s a stretch considering that’s how it went down the last time, if anything it’s a stretch to assume Tesla will not increase the price.
Yup. Hence why the political pendulum will probably shift to the republican next round. I think if the democrats really want to encourage EVs AND help the poor as they market in their message, then they need to restrict the credits only to the low cost EVs. This forces manufactures innovate and lower their prices to get the credits and help the poor like the democrats are professing. Otherwise people will see this as a corporate giveaway to the rich corporation and the next election they will just pay for it politically. Apparently Tesla doesn't need the credit. They will be forever profitable according to Elon. And they already have the Chinese to keep them profitable. Hence they don't need the credit. Don't get me wrong, the republican are equally bad at making policies. Most are only interested in filling their pocket books with money.
I wouldn't be surprised most of those people and their family/friends in captiol hill are buying up TSLA and other EV stocks in anticipation of passing this bill. But you know what they will do when it gets close to either passing or not? They will probably sell their shares.
I wouldn't be surprised most of those people and their family/friends in captiol hill are buying up TSLA and other EV stocks in anticipation of passing this bill. But you know what they will do when it gets close to either passing or not? They will probably sell their shares.
Totally hope it dies too. So stupid, so people that can afford a Tesla or other priced similar EV car need a tax credit. Dumb, creates fakes sales. Agree is a luxury card purchase and government should not be providing incentives. Let the competition do that.
Just more ways to bankrupt are Country that just spends and spends everyone’s money. Sad - how individuals have to watch their money, but the government does not.
ucmndd
Well-Known Member
The problem with competition and the "free market" as it exists right now is it does not account for environmental impacts. In fact, it deeply incentivizes grossly unsustainable levels of pollution.
Incentivizing the transition to sustainable (and supply-secure) energy consumption in the name of national security would seem to be well within the realm of proper government function to me.
I do agree there are probably more equitable ways to do it than large cash incentives on very expensive cars. 10 years ago a $7,500 tax credit on a $100k car might have been defensible to incentivize the development and scaling of the technology. In 2021, maybe not so much.
Uncle Paul
Well-Known Member
These tax credits are not designed to "help out" either rich or poor people. They are designed to incentivize car shoppers to purchase an EV over ICE. Getting rid of polluting gas/diesel burners is the intent.
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