Extremely Disappointed With Model S Range When Driving on the Highway at 35F

[DBV1]

2020 X LR+ owner and I posted in X forum Disagree With Elon 400 EPA Miles Isn't Enough and got flamed. But 400 EPA miles in a Tesla is rarely 400 miles. Sure in summer at 58 mph I have matched or beat the rated range. But add a little speed (my choice),1000 foot altitude change on trip and cold (not my choice) and SNOW on the road(not my choice) and 371 EPA in my X becomes questionable for the required 215 miles we need to get to our cabin with ZERO super chargers on the way(Teslas choice) .

It sucks because bought the X to avoid driving Ice car, but the range anxiety felt doing this trip with 6 inches of snow on the way where range would get decimated while pushing the car through that made us take our Older Ice car the Tesla was to replace but just don't feel it can do it the winter. If we have taken X and it wasn't going to make it, our only real charge option is a destination charger 30 miles out of the way. Could add HOURS to the trip charging at 10 kw/hour so didn't test it. SUCKS having to burn gas to do this trip though as Tesla made it in Sumer OK.(93->17% usage in Summer)

So NO 400 miles EPA is not enough. Great leader is just wrong.

I agree with you that 400 miles is not nearly good enough either, especially when driving my normal ice speeds would not get the 400 miles. I have always want cars that I have to fill up the least amount possbile. My outgoing 21 BMW 5 Series could get nearly 600 miles to a tank and our BMW X5 diesel can get around 700 miles to tank, which is just awesome for trips. No reason not to make EV’s do the same and with realistic mpg too.

Not sure why people flame you either, as more range is good for everyone, unless you are just driving to the corner store every week. Range estimates, faster charging (similar to gas) will have to get better as EV’s usage grows and if they don’t then gas cars will not be going anywhere.

 

[MN-MS100D]

700 miles. Depends.

 

[ucmndd]

No reason not to make EV’s do the same and with realistic mpg too.

So long as batteries cost >$100/kwh, weigh ~14 pounds per kWh, and require associated quantities of raw materials there are very good reasons to not make EVs do the same. Here’s hoping technology continues to improve.

 

[Rocky_H]

So NO 400 miles EPA is not enough. Great leader is just wrong.

I do remember reading your thread on that and yes, you have a specific route where that range won't work.

My outgoing 21 BMW 5 Series could get nearly 600 miles to a tank and our BMW X5 diesel can get around 700 miles to tank, which is just awesome for trips. No reason not to make EV’s do the same and with realistic mpg too.

But this can be solved in either of two ways. You all are talking about clinching up and not getting out of the car for 8 or 9 continuous hours. That should not be required. These routes that need humongous range are in the Long Tail. They are getting down to a few % of places people can go, so it doesn't make much sense to burden the production and inventory for building cars that have that kind of over-the-top sized batteries. The better solution would be for Tesla to stop neglecting these regions that still have travel gaps that are way too large and get Superchargers installed there. @FirstInTown had said that this wouldn't even be an issue if the drive could be cut in half with a Supercharger in this area.

 

[redmunds]

The better solution would be for Tesla to stop neglecting these regions that still have travel gaps that are way too large and get Superchargers installed there.

Another solution might be to have a socket in the trunk/frunk where a portable battery pack could be connected for long road trips. System would need to engineered in a way to be safe, and most people would never need it, but seems like enough people could use the to make it an option.

 

[henderrj]

Another solution might be to have a socket in the trunk/frunk where a portable battery pack could be connected for long road trips. System would need to engineered in a way to be safe, and most people would never need it, but seems like enough people could use the to make it an option.

I understand that Rivian at least teased the idea of doing this with their pickup. Put a big pack across part of the bed, if you needed the extended range. It wouldn't be something you could easily pick up and set down, but still a distinct possibility for some people.

 

[ucmndd]

Another solution might be to have a socket in the trunk/frunk where a portable battery pack could be connected for long road trips. System would need to engineered in a way to be safe, and most people would never need it, but seems like enough people could use the to make it an option.

It’s an interesting idea that I’ve contemplated a bit…

To be useful you’re really talking about something basically powerwall-sized. So about 13kwh and 200+ pounds, which would yield something like 40 miles of rated range on a Model S.

Connectivity including cooling and BMS communications would be an interesting and slightly messy problem to solve (glycol quick disconnects?).

Such a beast would easily cost north of $5,000 and be fantastically unwieldy. For 40 miles of rated range.

This is not how we get people to adopt EVs.

 

[henderrj]

It’s an interesting idea that I’ve contemplated a bit…

To be useful you’re really talking about something basically powerwall-sized. So about 13kwh and 200+ pounds, which would yield something like 40 miles of rated range on a Model S.

Connectivity including cooling and BMS communications would be an interesting and slightly messy problem to solve (glycol quick disconnects?).

Such a beast would easily cost north of $5,000 and be fantastically unwieldy. For 40 miles of rated range.

This is not how we get people to adopt EVs.

I think you are correct. It should be a factory option that fills up the well in the back. I don't know why Tesla doesn't want to do it. Well, I do, Elon doesn't want to do it! On the other hand, they're only a few years away from significantly better range with the same space taken up. So, patience I guess!

 

[MikeGracz]

258 miles at 55-70 mph and 35 degrees F with autopilot and climate at 68 seems somewhat low unless there were other factors. I drove our new 2021 model S refresh from Seattle to Alaska in October. Once I hit Northern BC, temperatures were almost always around freezing. I never pushed it to the edge, but it seemed that I could get around 300 miles in those conditions at around 55-65 mph.
The main factors impacting reduced range are: slush/snow/water on the road- this creates a lot of drag, and reduces range quite a bit if it is extensive. Another is elevation change. If the net elevation change between your start and finish is substantial, say 2000' or more, your range might be depleted as much as you have observed. Other factors could be things like low tire pressure or high headwinds or any combination of these things...When charging stations are close together, it's a minor inconvenince to stop a little more frequently. When they are far apart, you really need to pay attention to some of these factors.

 

[mswlogo]

I understand that Rivian at least teased the idea of doing this with their pickup. Put a big pack across part of the bed, if you needed the extended range. It wouldn't be something you could easily pick up and set down, but still a distinct possibility for some people.

Exactly. They could make it some how slide in under the bed or something. And when it’s not plugged into your car, you plug it into your house. If you are away on a long trip chances are it’s not needed as much at home any way.

It could serve double purpose. Just make them small enough to be manageable or clever connections to the car and house so that it never needs to be lifted. Just rolled in place.

 

[MikeGracz]

We're dealing with the world of the EPA here .. the range isnt so much what you can expect, more how it compares to other EVs under controlled conditions. So, yeah, you didn't get the range you expected, but the same would have been true whatever EV you chose.

As for winter coats, there is a good reason why Tesla include seat heaters .. it's often lower energy cost to heat the seats then the entire cabin (especially when driving alone).

Actually we are dealing with the world of Tesla, not EPA, in this particular instance. EPA runs their tests uniformly and generates raw data. The car companies then can either go with EPA's reccomendation of multiplying the raw numbers by 0.7, which all of them do, except for Audi and Tesla. Tesla multiplies by 0.81. They may have good reasons (lower drag and other efficiencies) but they do not need to offer any of those reasons. I overshoot "EPA" range estimates in my Bolt, and under-perform with the Model S...the 0.11 difference in multiplication factors pretty much explains the difference. I learned of this in an email exchange with EPA.

 

[mswlogo]

We're dealing with the world of the EPA here .. the range isnt so much what you can expect, more how it compares to other EVs under controlled conditions. So, yeah, you didn't get the range you expected, but the same would have been true whatever EV you chose.

As for winter coats, there is a good reason why Tesla include seat heaters .. it's often lower energy cost to heat the seats then the entire cabin (especially when driving alone).

Close but not quite. You’d get the same range in another EV if you drive them under the EPA conditions.

Different conditions the cars can easily diverge.

For the record I get very close to EPA ratings on Model 3P and Model X Raven.

EPA runs with no HVAC in normal temps too.

 

[Snerruc]

If anyone is interested in real world data, I drove from Cape Coral to Palm Bay yesterday. Temp 90 degrees, air on, one quick stop and 35 miles on interstate at 75 mph. Rest at over the speed limit. Distance was 180 miles and started with 311 miles of range. Ended with 124 miles left. 187 miles used. EPA test does NOT include a/c, so this is pretty close to EPA or maybe even better. Have I done worse? Sure. But this was a trip I make all the time and it’s pretty normal.

 

[_jmk]

Teslas EPA numbers are a joke. I’d be really surprised if the ’400mi epa’ model S ever went further than the ’350mi epa’ mercedes eqs. EPA numbers are open for gamlng.

 

[Destiny1701]

Teslas EPA numbers are a joke. I’d be really surprised if the ’400mi epa’ model S ever went further than the ’350mi epa’ mercedes eqs. EPA numbers are open for gamlng.

Which means Model S hasn’t improved a mile since the 2019 Long range, Raven model. They just game the official spec and actual is more of the same. That was around 350/60 miles actual.

Way to keep duping your buyers Elon…externally slap on some wider fenders, black trim and call her a whole new car LOL . (guess it doesn’t matter when you plan to leave this mutball planet for mars anyway )

 

[MN-MS100D]

Maybe see Munro's videos for massive changes made to new Plaid MS.

 

[_jmk]

Maybe see Munro's videos for massive changes made to new Plaid MS.

Those are mostly cost savings and manufacturing improvements. Good stuff but not really very relevant for the end user.

 

[Destiny1701]

Those are mostly cost savings and manufacturing improvements. Good stuff but not really very relevant for the end user.

Agreed. Yes plaid is way faster but the performance P100D of 2017 already had Drag times of 0-60 2.2 sec. Def 3 motors added the extra juice. Handling wise we are seeing posted in threads more and more reports of previous gen S adaptive being a better suspension overall compared to new.

Inside agreed…hands down 100% diff and big step up
Exterior? Bandage upgrades. Wider fenders, black trim, now new lights after enough reviews complaining. Basically 10% variance off any 2016-2020 MS.

 

[zantosh]

Lessons I've learned with my 2018 Model S 100D:

• Buy a plug that will plug into a 30 amp RV socket. This will give you options off the beaten path
• Look up Blink, ChargePoint, EvGO and other chargers - it'll save you a lot of headache
• Get Plugshare and use that to locate more chargers in your area
• Locate hotels that have chargers for Teslas. Mostly they have them exclusively for Teslas, but it might also be a regular Jwhatever plug

With these combos, you can significantly reduce your range anxiety. Next, for driving:

• Don't carry anything on the vehicle like a cargo box or bicycles. It'll decimate your range
• Regen - learn to use regen to slow down and not your brakes
• Take your time - driving at below 75 mph will give you a big boost in your range
• Use Range mode in the winter - it'll reduce your overall heater effect but will save you some range
• Before you depart, while plugged in, heat up or cool down your car to an optimal temperature. It'll save you a lot of battery drain
• Get tyres and wheels that are designed for efficiency. They may not look cool, but they will give you more range
• Check your config - Tesla has the rated range vs the estimated range, or something like that. The rated range is what you want - the estimated range is pure fantasy