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Factory Staff - Long Hours affecting Quality?

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by Brian H, Sep 9, 2012.

  1. Brian H

    Brian H Banned

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    #1 Brian H, Sep 9, 2012
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2012
    Heh. 6 days a week, sometimes 7, Elon sez, not quite 'round the clock'! If you work for TM, expect 50 hour work weeks, with occasional 60 to 80 hour weeks.
     
  2. DrDave

    DrDave Member

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    I bet 60 is about minimum right now, not occasional.
     
  3. CapitalistOppressor

    CapitalistOppressor Active Member

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    6 days a week is for individual workers. The company as a whole is clearly working 7 days a week and Elon looks like he hasn't been sleeping again.
     
  4. Krugerrand

    Krugerrand Active Member

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    Actually, there are plenty of individual workers working 7 days a week.
     
  5. DrDave

    DrDave Member

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    You know them? I would dare say the workers are going 7 as well. Today is Sunday and they were there. Smooth ramp no doubt.
     
  6. ckessel

    ckessel Active Member

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    I understand the push for some extra shifts, but I'm wary of getting a car made by folks on their 70th hour for the week...
     
  7. Discoducky

    Discoducky Active Member

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    QA, QC and Final Inspections are typically carried out by folks who get lots of sleep for that very reason so I hope TM isn't sleep depriving the last quality gate (of course this means Elon isn't doing it anymore either)
     
  8. bonnie

    bonnie Oil is for sissies.

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    Possibly you're overthinking this ... if Elon is personally inspecting right now, then clearly they understand the importance of the Model S meeting high quality standards. I think they're smart enough to make sure all their employees on the production line are getting enough sleep.
     
  9. DrDave

    DrDave Member

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    Come hang out at City Beach, Kirby's, Jack's, or any of the other bars around Fremont, or go a little further south into San Jose. May be an eye opener for what you think, and what is actually happening. Line workers are the true pulse of any manufacturing facility.
     
  10. bonnie

    bonnie Oil is for sissies.

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    Not sure what you mean here ... I've run manufacturing operations and am very familiar with the skills the line workers bring to the table. I also know it is highly unlikely that management would be so foolish as to downplay that role by working them 24/7 if they want a quality product.

    - - - Updated - - -


    To clarify ... I haven't run automotive manufacturing lines. The manufacturing operations I've been responsible for have been both for highly complex software driven electro mechanical custom medical devices and pharmaceutical fill finish lines, including a green field design and build. But not automotive.
     
  11. Krugerrand

    Krugerrand Active Member

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    You've certainly got a point there, but this isn't the only industry where people can/do work long hours. Ask the next firefighter you see what sorts of shifts he/she works. Or how about that on call surgeon, the ER nurse? Those are people in life and death jobs working crazy shifts and long hours. There are many other professions with the same circumstances.

    Naturally, when a person doesn't get enough down time their work can suffer and they become prone to making mistakes. It's as much the worker's responsibility, as it is their boss's responsibility, to know when they need to take a day for themselves. From what I know, Tesla is very open to that. Indeed, the CEO has said publically that he knows 7 days per week, 60-80 hrs per week is not sustainable.
     
  12. bonnie

    bonnie Oil is for sissies.

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    +1, totally agree.
     
  13. onlinespending

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    They can avoid this by using shift workers in manufacturing so that no one shift works more than a certain number of hours per day (like having a day shift and a night shift).
     
  14. VolkerP

    VolkerP EU Model S P-37

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    And it is clearly not sustainable to read TMC 60-80 hours, 7 days a week, and to rely on the moderators to do all the QC single-handedly. It is every posters responsibility to avoid contributing to the background noise and - huh? sorry, phone ringing. Yes, Doug?
     
  15. CapitalistOppressor

    CapitalistOppressor Active Member

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    Elon said in a recent interview that they are only requiring 6 days/week (because not everyone is able to work 7). Obviously many people, including Elon are working 7 days a week.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Here is the interview -

    In deep with Tesla CEO Elon Musk: Financials, Falcon doors and finding faults in the Model S

     
  16. nikwest

    nikwest Member

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    I recently have visited the Porsche 911 production site. They are producing more than 150 cars a day without a night shift. This is all on a single line producing all the different versions of 911 and Caymans/Boxter. All on a single production line. I've been pretty impressed. I highly recommend it, if you happen to be in Stuttgart, Germany sometimes.
    They are not doing night shifts as they think that this is decreasing quality too much.
    To me it seems that once all the initial quirks are resolved, it should be possible to achieve over 100 cars a day without a night shift.
     
  17. ElSupreme

    ElSupreme Model S 03182

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    This depends 100% on the assembly time of the vehicle and equipment on the line.
     
  18. ckessel

    ckessel Active Member

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    #18 ckessel, Sep 10, 2012
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2012
    Oh certainly, and it's been shown over and over people working on long shifts perform worse as the shift ends. Even people working 10-12 hours shifts get burn out and do poorer quality work even if they've slept well.

    I understand it's done in various industries. That doesn't mean the practice isn't rife with issue, it's just something that's done because it's something that's always been done.

    There was a review of aircraft tower navigators an exhaustion a few years ago and a recommendation was let the guys nap for 30 minutes every X hours on shift because it's an intense job (a few fell asleep sitting upright at the console). The head of the government agency said "No way, no one gets paid to sleep on the job!" Recommendations and reality be damned...he wasn't willing to break with the preconception of what's culturally acceptable.

    I suppose if I'm passionate about the issue it's because I've studied it quite a bit in the context of the software industry.
     
  19. ElSupreme

    ElSupreme Model S 03182

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    I used to work at a factory and we would produce more Tues-Thurs (3 days) than Fri-Sun (4 days). Night shift at that plant was actually pretty good and regularly produced 80-90% of what day shift did. And most of that was due to lack of engineering support, which was really day shift only.

    EDIT: We ran 12 hour shifts. 4 shifts. And ran 24 hours about 263 days a year (no labor day, or new years day). Day and Night shift would swap every 3 weeks. So all the line operators did both day and night shift. They would also switch 3 and 4 day weeks every 3 weeks.
     
  20. ckessel

    ckessel Active Member

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    Yea, I have no idea how Tesla is handling it so my concerns are somewhat questionable. Maybe they run two shifts with rotating folks so no one is on for extended periods and they all get actual time off. I really have no idea, I can only surmise based on that article with Elon where he was talking 60-70 hours weeks.

    I was thinking of that kind of pace and my car being produced in December when folks are really running on empty...
     

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