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Fairfax County property tax appeal
- Thread starter Rik
- Start date
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- Mid-Atlantic USA
Who benefits? Why, you do, and all the other residents of Fairfax County.
Looks like about half goes to the one of the best performing school districts in the country, then comes public safety with some of the best equipped emergency responders, then comes social services, parks and recreation, etc.
View attachment 2015_adp_goes.pdf
mikeash
Active Member
That same argument could be applied to real estate property taxes, income taxes, sales taxes, or just about any other sort of tax out there. It's pretty standard for people with more money to pay more taxes, and car value is a pretty good proxy for how much money a person has. If you own an expensive house you pay more taxes on it, why wouldn't the same be true of a car?
Personally I think the tax should be solely on the land, not the value of the house. If I'm using more space, that's less space available that someone else can build on and therefore generate more tax income. The value of my house should be inconsequential.
AMPUP
Member
Agree with this. I'm getting a little tired of hearing the old, "if you earn more and own more you should pay more". I'm all for paying what's fair, but I'm not all for paying everyone else's share. From a fairfax county point of view everyone in the county gets the same benefits so just because I own a larger house and an expensive car, shouldn't mean I pay more tax. Land yes, cost of house no. I work my ass off and spend days away from home every week for the privilege, so don't single me out to pay more than what's fair. On the car front, Is my car taking up any more room or damaging any more roads than a 1999 suburban? I already paid $4k in state taxes purchasing it and I already pay more to title/register it in virginia as EV's pay more in this state, I'm all for paying a fair tax to subsidize fuel taxes, however I'm not all for paying 2-3k every year for property tax whilst my neighbors SUV is $200, that just seems plain wrong.
Xenoilphobe
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the budget data, boy are we fat in this county. If this were private industry it would be the most non-competitive organization in the world. i would start with cutting the executive budget to near zero, let Virginia lottery fund the schools and raise the lottery ticket price. Then look at what we really need - do we need a fire department on every corner equipped with the latest and greatest? Why can't we go part-time volunteer - like the National Guard? Why are we deploying them overseas to every emergency event in the world - I am paying for that - no thanks...
Looks like big government and I am sick of having to fund it for the folks who don't pay a cent and we are rarely using it. Its like a gym membership that you never take advantage of.
I don't need the social services, an my experience with my 12 and 15 year old tells me that their are some school teachers that need to go.. Teaching to the SOL is not teaching. While we have good schools I grew up in DOD Schools over seas and when I returned my senior year to Robinson - I was less than impressed. I have lived here since 1983 and never used the fire department. The one time I needed the police 48 officers showed up - I was glad to see them, but realized that we might have an excessively large force for the same amount of crime in this area of the county. The judicial area is great, but we have gotten so liberal enforcing laws - I would defund this area and just use minimum sentencing for crimes - pay by credit card and move on.
We could also consolidate the DMV with SMART TAG - Get a smart tag embedded in the license plate and get rid of the DMV too. I don't need driver education - we are getting that in school with their massive budget. AMAZON could pick up the vanity plate business and probably do it cheaper than the DMV.
I would expand funding for parks and recreation and green the education workforce to reduce the education budget. If you are not a classroom teacher why are you billing to the education budget? I don't need a school board either - get rid of them and pay for performance to the top teachers in the county.
We are fatter than Jabba the Hutt and its time for some austerity measures. Industry is doing it - why isn't the county? This reminds me of the Taliban road checkpoints in Afghanistan - you get held up at every stop and they just keep asking for more. The more you give the more they ask for.
Im all for paying for services I receive - but I don't need the "indirect" management overhead the burdens the great workforce in Fairfax County.
Looks like big government and I am sick of having to fund it for the folks who don't pay a cent and we are rarely using it. Its like a gym membership that you never take advantage of.
I don't need the social services, an my experience with my 12 and 15 year old tells me that their are some school teachers that need to go.. Teaching to the SOL is not teaching. While we have good schools I grew up in DOD Schools over seas and when I returned my senior year to Robinson - I was less than impressed. I have lived here since 1983 and never used the fire department. The one time I needed the police 48 officers showed up - I was glad to see them, but realized that we might have an excessively large force for the same amount of crime in this area of the county. The judicial area is great, but we have gotten so liberal enforcing laws - I would defund this area and just use minimum sentencing for crimes - pay by credit card and move on.
We could also consolidate the DMV with SMART TAG - Get a smart tag embedded in the license plate and get rid of the DMV too. I don't need driver education - we are getting that in school with their massive budget. AMAZON could pick up the vanity plate business and probably do it cheaper than the DMV.
I would expand funding for parks and recreation and green the education workforce to reduce the education budget. If you are not a classroom teacher why are you billing to the education budget? I don't need a school board either - get rid of them and pay for performance to the top teachers in the county.
We are fatter than Jabba the Hutt and its time for some austerity measures. Industry is doing it - why isn't the county? This reminds me of the Taliban road checkpoints in Afghanistan - you get held up at every stop and they just keep asking for more. The more you give the more they ask for.
Im all for paying for services I receive - but I don't need the "indirect" management overhead the burdens the great workforce in Fairfax County.
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AMPUP
Member
At least there is an appeal process and they seem to be open to looking at different sources to judge car values. In Quebec, we have a luxury fee on yearly vehicle registrations. 1% on the value of a car over 40,000 CAD. When you take into account exchange rates and the 10%-20% markup on automobiles sold in Canada, you're paying this additional fee on anything selling for over $32,000 in the States.
Well, it is written that they use the MSRP for the first year, then (Wholesale Price - $500) for each subsequent year for assessment purposes. The problem is that they ONLY consult something called "The Monthly Quebec Automobile Guide." This monthly lists dealer auction prices uniquely in province. Naturally, no Model S has ever been sold at auction here, so they fall back to a (last value - 7%) rule.
Yes, somehow the wholesale value of a one-year old car is only 7% off the MSRP of a new vehicle. When you consider the $8,000 provincial rebate on EVs, you can buy a better equipped brand spanking new Model S for less than what the Quebec DMV considers a used one to be worth. Over seven years, the owner of a similarly priced ICE could save nearly $3,000 in fees compared to a Model S driver.
AMPUP
Member
The model s yearly tax in fairfax county is anywhere between $2000-4000, yes that's a year. On top of the $4-6k of Virginia state tax. Think yourself lucky
I just got mine. I bought at the end of May so I have a pro-rated bill for the last 6 months of 2014. They assessed my 2014 60kwh @ $66,400.
Not sure where the number came from? Is it NADA MSRP ($66,900) * 95%?
Solution: don't live in Virginia. Paying $2k-$4k per year for a CAR TAX is probably one of the most absurd things I've ever heard of in my entire life. They are downright raping you of your money. They have no right to steal money from residents like that. We pay enough to the fed and state taxes already. Hell that's just as high as my state income taxes. I can't imagine having to pay state taxes and then double for owning a car. If I was forced to live in a state like that I'd be driving around on a bicycle.
Xenoilphobe
Well-Known Member
Got mine today - they assessed me on a value of $95,000 - with the State picking up part of the tab - my out of pocket was $3812.82 for a full year. Happy New Year! Can't wait for the next bill-- awesome - love this place - awesome - its great - yeah right.
Wife and I are looking for property elsewhere - I already paid on three other cars this year and was considering another Tesla - but - not if I have to pay almost $8K in Taxes when you add in a P85D.... Plus another $6K in sales tax for what services again?
Costa Rico looks better and better everyday.
OCD research begins --- http://247wallst.com/special-report/2014/04/02/states-with-the-highest-and-lowest-taxes/print/
Wife and I are looking for property elsewhere - I already paid on three other cars this year and was considering another Tesla - but - not if I have to pay almost $8K in Taxes when you add in a P85D.... Plus another $6K in sales tax for what services again?
Costa Rico looks better and better everyday.
OCD research begins --- http://247wallst.com/special-report/2014/04/02/states-with-the-highest-and-lowest-taxes/print/
You have to look at the total tax picture. Property taxes in VA are low compared to MD and absurdly low compared to, e.g., New Jersey. Income tax is also a lot less here than in MD or DC.
VA is a terrible place to own a car, though. I have no idea why the state is so unfriendly to car ownership, but the car tax, the speed laws, the ridiculous stickers that we have to put on our windshields, the stupid EV policies...it is all terrible.
Having said that, at least we don't have speed cameras (yet), unlike MD and DC. And I'd have to have a much nicer fleet of cars than I do in order to make living in MD cheaper.
swb1701
New Member
I just got my Fairfax County assessment today -- like Xenoilphobe the assessed value was $95,000 -- up from $85,000 last year (the car will be 2 years old in April). Did anyone else see their assessment increase this year?
I'm currently traveling but I'll look for mine when I return. I've never heard of an auto assessment going up. That's crazy. If mine is for more than what I sold the car for in October I will likely challenge it.
paulkva
part of the supercharge.info dev team
I don't have a copy of my bill yet, but I just looked online. I guess mine's assessed at $95,000 also, because my amount due is the same as @Xenoilphobe, to the penny. I just found my 2013 bill; my car was assessed at $83,030 when new. I'll wait for my copy of the 2014 bill before contacting them, but I almost certainly will be contacting them.
While I'd obviously prefer no car tax, I have no problem paying it based on the value of my car, as I knew that was the law when I bought the car. But I do have a problem if the assessment is absurd. Some specific points of contention:
Based on the email @fryfrye received and posted in this thread a couple months back, Fairfax claims they use 90% of MSRP for 2nd year models, and although they state they don't account for the $7,500 tax credit, the $72,400 MSRP they quote does reflect it. By that standard my 2014 assessment should be $79K (assuming they use the MSRP of the "base" P85), not $95K. If it's based on pre-tax-credit MSRP (which I think we all disagree with), the 2014 assessment should be $85K.
The same email shows that his car (S85) was assessed at $65K in 2014. How can a P85 (which was a $15K difference in MSRP at the time) purchased at basically the same time be assessed for $30K more? That clearly fails the "uniform application" standard (in my non-lawyer opinion). Again, by that standard my car's 2014 assessment should be $79K.
And finally: Does anyone want to buy a nicely-optioned silver P85 with ~16K miles for $95K? If so, I could sell it and buy a similar one I saw on Edmunds for $80K and make a near-instant $15K profit. If Fairfax uses trade-in values as that email claims, and a very similar car is selling from a dealer for $80K, my 2014 assessment should be substantially lower than $80K -- probably closer to $70K-$75K. (I think this is unfortunately the weakest argument, as there's relatively little data on Model S trade-ins, and that's precisely the reason our assessments were delayed in the first place.)
While I'd obviously prefer no car tax, I have no problem paying it based on the value of my car, as I knew that was the law when I bought the car. But I do have a problem if the assessment is absurd. Some specific points of contention:
Based on the email @fryfrye received and posted in this thread a couple months back, Fairfax claims they use 90% of MSRP for 2nd year models, and although they state they don't account for the $7,500 tax credit, the $72,400 MSRP they quote does reflect it. By that standard my 2014 assessment should be $79K (assuming they use the MSRP of the "base" P85), not $95K. If it's based on pre-tax-credit MSRP (which I think we all disagree with), the 2014 assessment should be $85K.
The same email shows that his car (S85) was assessed at $65K in 2014. How can a P85 (which was a $15K difference in MSRP at the time) purchased at basically the same time be assessed for $30K more? That clearly fails the "uniform application" standard (in my non-lawyer opinion). Again, by that standard my car's 2014 assessment should be $79K.
And finally: Does anyone want to buy a nicely-optioned silver P85 with ~16K miles for $95K? If so, I could sell it and buy a similar one I saw on Edmunds for $80K and make a near-instant $15K profit. If Fairfax uses trade-in values as that email claims, and a very similar car is selling from a dealer for $80K, my 2014 assessment should be substantially lower than $80K -- probably closer to $70K-$75K. (I think this is unfortunately the weakest argument, as there's relatively little data on Model S trade-ins, and that's precisely the reason our assessments were delayed in the first place.)
AMPUP
Member
Got mine today $2859 for 9 months!!! F!! Outrageous, I see a class action appeal 
in my stars, thoughts?
in my stars, thoughts?Similar threads
