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Feds tighten crash test advertising rules

Discussion in 'Cars and Transportation' started by yobigd20, Nov 20, 2013.

  1. yobigd20

    yobigd20 Well-Known Member

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    hah....

    Feds tighten crash test advertising rules - Businessweek

     
  2. montgom626

    montgom626 Active Member

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  3. Krugerrand

    Krugerrand Active Member

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    Oh, now isn't that just about as ironic as it gets. How about this instead: How about the NHTSA devise a more accurate scoring system and let manufacturers tell the ENTIRE truth about the cars they make? Huh? How about that? No, no, no, let's not do that. Let just keep using the antiquated system we have and put a muzzle on all those numbers the public doesn't get to see. *******!
     
  4. AnOutsider

    AnOutsider S532 # XS27

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    Well how many manufacturers would be able to claim above 5 stars to begin with? Additionally, how much of the public want more than a simple overview system? How many even know that there's stars in every category and an overall?

    I'd argue not many to both, which means the system in place has been pretty good for the current needs and target audience.

    Tesla made up a number not in their system. They could have said it scored above and beyond or that "if the rankings went any higher we would have gotten X". They've always been pretty loose with their statements (lease pricing anyone?) and they got slapped for it.

    Let's not make excuses for them.
     
  5. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

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    Most likely NHTSA is getting hassled by annoyed ICE competitors. Not sure I would blame them, to be honest. Manufacturers rightfully expect equal treatment and that everyone go by the same rules.

    NHTSA is already sensitized enough to make a disclaimer that they were requested by Tesla to start a fire investigation. Sounds like Tesla is getting to be a bit of a sore spot with them. That strikes me as a bad idea.

    Tout the car as 5-star. State your reasons why you think it qualifies as the safest ever - talk about how individual tests exceeded the standard if you like. But don't claim a nonexistent 5.4 rating.
     
  6. Krugerrand

    Krugerrand Active Member

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    Clearly one company, who's trying to change the entire industry and related industries would. :)

    I don't know how much of the public want more than a simple overview system. Haven't bothered to ask anyone. But I don't assume that a) they're too stupid to understand something more comprehensive than *'s, or b) that given a choice they wouldn't want to know more. Maybe I'll start by asking parents?

    It certainly does not mean the system in place is good for current needs and target audience. It just means nobody's questioned it. Lots of things in this world stay the same - dealership laws anyone - while the world around them changes, such that before you know it, they are outdated and everyone just says, 'Well, that's the way it's always been, so it must be fine.' What's the point of even telling manufacturers their cars scored higher than the highest score that can be given? If you're going to tell them that, then why can't they tell to the public?

    Nobody's bothered to upset the NHTSA until this point and from statements made by Mr. Strickland it seems they don't like to be upset. But I'll remind Mr. Strickland they aren't above reproach and they are here to serve the public. Gagging a manufacturer from telling the whole story of the scoring a vehicle recieved is not, imo, serving the public. Perhaps a better approach would for the NHTSA to release all the numbers for every vehicle, rather than allowing the company to do it.

    Actually, I think they did say just that.
     
  7. redi

    redi 2013 P85+ with HumanPilot Technology

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    I suspect Elon's writers and marketing department in general need to be told to 'reel it in' for a while since they keep putting the boss out in the open for being called out and fact-checked. The blog posts are pushing it as well.

    An ever-increasing reputation as a "truth bender" is not needed right now.
     
  8. PokerBroker

    PokerBroker Member

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    Note: don't poke the government in the eye even if you are right, they might just make an example of you
     
  9. markwj

    markwj Moderator, Asia Pacific

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    Sir, the system is out of 5 stars. Your use of 7 stars in your post violates our guidelines. :/)
     
  10. stopcrazypp

    stopcrazypp Well-Known Member

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    Strickland (the head of NHTSA) said he had gotten into heated one-on-one arguments with Elon before, and I imagine argument about this was probably one of the main topics.

    As for a point of subtly, Tesla never said the government gave then 5.4 stars directly (in fact they made it clear the NHTSA does not publish ratings above 5 stars), but that the government did give them a VSS number that equated to 5.4 stars. Everything else was paraphrasing by the media.

    Direct quote here:
    http://www.teslamotors.com/about/press/releases/tesla-model-s-achieves-best-safety-rating-any-car-ever-tested
     
  11. Krugerrand

    Krugerrand Active Member

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    Exactly why they should be poked, especially if you're in the right. They are not an unquestionable entity. They are here to serve us, not serve themselves. *We*, the people, get to decide how much power we give them. Never forget it is people, just like you and me, in these organizations, and as the saying goes their - smells as bad as ours.
     
  12. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

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    Error, line 1: Gender mismatch.
     
  13. Krugerrand

    Krugerrand Active Member

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    It's okay, I wasn't holding it against him. Much. :smile:
     
  14. markwj

    markwj Moderator, Asia Pacific

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    I am sorry, I have a cold ;-)

    - - - Updated - - -

    Can this whole thing be paraphrased as:

    Tesla got a 95%, which is an A grade
    A bunch of others got low 90s%, which are also A grades
    Tesla boasted that they got a higher percentage score than anyone else (but same grade)
    Examiner says 'Hey! You are only supposed to quote grades, not percentage scores'

    Or did I miss something? I thought Tesla did get a better score than the others, but just the same top grade bracket (five star)?

    That said, if the NHTSA doesn't want people quoting things other than the number of stars, then they should tighten their disclosure regulations to control that. Isn't that what they just did? Closing the barn door after the horse has bolted, and all that.

    As to the subject of whether it is sensible to antagonise the government agency supervising you, that does sound scary. From Mr Strickland's recent comments, it sounds like the working relationship between him and Elon is strained at best.
     
  15. stopcrazypp

    stopcrazypp Well-Known Member

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    This is exactly what happened. After Tesla's blog post the NHTSA issued a statement that essentially said Tesla shouldn't be doing that and that they are upset about it, but there's really no rule preventing Tesla from doing so. Now after the fact they make such a rule so Tesla can't do it again in the future.
     
  16. Krugerrand

    Krugerrand Active Member

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    Well, I'm sorry you have a cold and it affected your telepathic abilities. Get well soon. The next woman may not be as forgiving. :biggrin:
     
  17. omarsultan

    omarsultan Active Member

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    +1

    Rule #1 is to protect the boss's credibility
     
  18. ggr

    ggr Roadster R80 537, SigS P85 29

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    He might want you to hold it against him! ;-)
     
  19. yobigd20

    yobigd20 Well-Known Member

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    So next time instead of saying "model S scored higher than any other vehicle" they should say "the model a receive a 95% score and no other vehicle has ever scored above 90% before" and leave it at that. Just post the fact and let the media post that it's the highest score ever awarded.

    The whole thing is ridiculous. You know the only reason this discussion ever happened was because the manufacturers of those 90% cars cried and whined like babies back to the NHSTA. They are all scared Tesla's gonna render both their cars and business models obsolete and they will act like little children instead of accepting defeat. This is the world we live in today where they don't know what responsibility and hard work is like. Bitch and moan and whine and cry like little babies and suck up and ass kiss to get your way. These teenage brats may now be adults in age and run companies now but they still act like little children. If they were to just spend their time doing some real R&D maybe they'll invent something good enough to keep there company afloat once genIII comes out. At least BMW is trying with the i3 whereas all the other ones are throwing together stupid compliance cars that nobody actually wants.
     
  20. Krugerrand

    Krugerrand Active Member

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    I believe he's on the wrong forum then. :wink:
     

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