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Fell asleep using Autopilot - admission from a Model S owner

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I would NEVER trust AP in undivided roads with oncoming traffic. I have driven 7K of the last 8K miles in AP and all of them on well marked divided highways.

It is simply not ready driving with vehicles coming against your direction on your adjacent lane.

And yet I have driven using autopilot for thousands of km and so has my business partner for tens of thousands of km. And 90+% of it is undivided roads including small country roads. The system works flawlessly to the level that we get a lot of work done on long commutes with the car doing the driving. The regular trip to Tartu (180km away) happens with 0 AP interruptions from my side besides the infrequent hold the wheel notices (usually happen every 5-10 min) or if I decide to pass slower traffic, really would like the car to adjust speed based on signs that I know it knows, that's the only thing one has to adjust if there isn't a car in front, if there is, then 2h of hands free worry free driving.
 
I would NEVER trust AP in undivided roads with oncoming traffic. I have driven 7K of the last 8K miles in AP and all of them on well marked divided highways.

It is simply not ready driving with vehicles coming against your direction on your adjacent lane.

I admit to having driven AP in 2-way non-median traffic, but your position is a smart move that I certainly wouldn't begrudge at the individual level. To be honest, I'm surprised that Tesla is comfortable leveraging the "beta" moniker as a liability transmission to this exposure. It's of questionable legal value, and feels fiscally risky. As a customer, I appreciate their willingness to push forward faster than most, it's how we are going to get to L4 sooner. But... I have to admit that if I had been part of that decision making chain, I might have recommended geofencing AutoPilot to divided highway use only.

We have now seen several instances of Autopilot processing getting it wrong resulting in accidents. But the day will come when that incorrect processing will cost someone (likely another driver/pedestrian) their life. When that happens, and Tesla is the deep pocket, the beta disclaimer is going to get tested. And to be honest, I'm skeptical it can stand up to challenge.

When something works correctly 99.9% of the time, it's problematic to expect most people to alertly react to the 0.1% exception. In the meantime, yours is a wise approach to minimize individual liability.
 
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What's the problem? Follow the instructions. why bothering making a discussion about what tesla "hiding behind". Watch the road, both hands on the steering wheel. No wonder why automatic transmission is so popular in the US. "i think GM is hiding behind this clutch thing... "
Yeah, I don't get why it is so complicated. If you treat it like an ACC system with autosteer (which is what it is) and monitor it as instructed (just as you would do with traditional cruise control), I don't see why it is so onerous to be expected to react in emergency situations.
 
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But the day will come when that incorrect processing will cost someone (likely another driver/pedestrian) their life. When that happens, and Tesla is the deep pocket, the beta disclaimer is going to get tested. And to be honest, I'm skeptical it can stand up to challenge.

I'm not so sure it will get tested since most of these types of cases settle out of court without an admission of liability and with a confidentiality clause.
 
I used to spend a ton of time on the road and had a couple of close incidents where I almost nodded off while driving. Once, the highway turned into an ocean and my car and the cars around me turned into sailboats. I realized I was dreaming and scared myself awake before anything happened (my first and only experience with lucid dreaming). Another time I kept almost nodding off and couldn't keep in my lane; I was lucky enough to be able to safely make my way off the freeway and into a parking lot to nap. I started carrying around both very spicy and very sour snacks with me from then on which would stave off drowsiness. I would have loved a system like the autopilot to keep me from wrecking in those situations.
 
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Big bag of M&Ms also does the trick keeping you awake.

That would make me ill. Eating sunflower seeds (I note I said shelled above but I meant unshelled - meaning with the shells on) is better for you, most of it ends up in a garbage bag in the car since it take some time to unshell them in your mouth, and it doesn't raise your blood sugar or make you as fat as sugar laden food.
 
Big bag of M&Ms also does the trick keeping you awake.
The problem with M&Ms is that while the theobromine will act as a stimulant the sugar rush tends to do the opposite. Semisweet chocolate has a higher theobromine to sugar ratio. Since I don't drink coffee, tea, caffine-laden soft drinks (preferably sugarless) or semisweet chocolate is pretty much it for stimulants, barring the use of drugs, which I avoid.

If I have trouble staying awake, it's time for a brief nap. That's tougher to do when I really, really want to make it to the next Supercharger station! (Just got back Saturday night from a 2971 mile road trip, driving alone.)
 
But the day will come when that incorrect processing will cost someone (likely another driver/pedestrian) their life. When that happens, and Tesla is the deep pocket, the beta disclaimer is going to get tested. And to be honest, I'm skeptical it can stand up to challenge.

When something works correctly 99.9% of the time, it's problematic to expect most people to alertly react to the 0.1% exception. In the meantime, yours is a wise approach to minimize individual liability.

I couldn't have said it better myself. I've said the same thing on this forum, but not this well. Tesla is in deep doo-doo when somebody dies in an AP related accident. But I'm very relieved to see I'm not the only one that thinks this.
 
Last night, my friend had fell asleep while auto pilot was engaged around 3am on the freeway, when he had woke about 10 miles from when he recalled he was awake (on the freeway), his car had stopped in the far right lane (not shoulder). He wasn't sure if the car had moved itself to the right or if that was the lane he was currently in. However it did stop in a lane that was for moving traffic and was quiet surprised he didnt wake to an accident or being rear ended by another vehicle.

If I was in his situation, I honestly think the car should make a very louder than normal alarm as the car is performing to slow down. It has so many other safety features I dont find this unreasonable. The alarm in a mild sound goes off when you dont wear your seat belt, when you dont have your hands on the wheel with AP after a certain time or distance driven, the steering wheel vibrates when you cross over lanes with out the signal, etc. I would strongly urge Tesla to update an alarm for this instance. I know a lot of owners would say , well dont fall asleep at the wheel or you should always be alert, but the fact is, there definitely are going to be occasions that were not intentional when owners are too tired or medically they knock out at the wheel. Also to note, the tesla knows the MPH on the road its on. If it knows that the MPH is say 65-70mph, why would it stop in lane with moving traffic, and have the owner just wake up at any time to find himself in a moving lane? There really should be an alarm that sounds off. As an owner I would find this a beneficial feature and not one bit annoying.
 
Okay so this may be a taboo topic, but someone had to bring this up sooner or later. I've now spoken with three Model S drivers who each admit that on long drives Autopilot keeps them refreshed - but strangely also sometimes induces drowsiness similar to the effect many people experience while riding in cars as passengers.

And two of those people told me that switching off the auto-steer function instantly restored mental alertness. Sounds ridiculous I know.

I wonder if this drowsiness effect is common - if so I would not be surprised to see nobody on the forums admitting it, out of a (perhaps misguided) fear of either being lectured by self-appointed safety-nags (you know who you are) or worse, having their posts brought in as evidence in some future civil action after a car accident.

But the kicker - I've spoken with a Model S owner (no I will *not* identify that person in any way so don't ask) who admitted to me privately that on an hour long drive recently they briefly nodded off three times coming home late at night from a party. This person claims they don't think they were asleep for long - but of course how would they know? They didn't know how fast they were going - somewhere between 65-75 mph they estimated - and of course the "nod offs" couldn't have been for too long because they never awoke to find themselves parked on the freeway with their emergency blinkers after "hold the wheel" failed to get their attention.

This is a person who doesn't drink or use any drugs, who's in good health.

However, the owner may have used autopilot to travel in a situation in which they otherwise would not have - coming home alone late at night from a party (the person is normally an early to bed type).

The key question none of us can answer is: what is statistically safer? A sleepy/drowsy barreling down the highway using autopilot, or an awake driver not using autopilot but who is subject to all the "human errors" and attention lapses people routinely make while driving?


Even with AP on and asleep, the tesla has safefy sensors from hitting another car in front of it and stays in the lane, this to me is better safety outcome compared to other non teslas. But I do wish the Tesla updated an Alarm for this very scenario.
 
Agreed. The alarm should sound deafening like a burglar alarm both inside and outside too. How about some also enabling flashers too ?

Although you have to agree that your friend owes his life to AP, unless you are arguing he fell asleep because of AP?
 
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Agreed. The alarm should sound deafening like a burglar alarm both inside and outside too. How about some also enabling flashers too ?

i dont recall him saying his hazards were on....
But its a serious issue if the car activates its stop procedure on a moving traffic freeway. An alarm to wake the driver should be deployed first before or as its about to go through the slow down procedure. That kind of technology is not hard to implement since the alarms already do sound for other safety features