Firmware 7.0 Beta Discussion

[MorrisonHiker]

If there are two cameras, which I currently doubt, especially since Tesla folks were quoted as saying the S and the X would in in "lockstep" for autopilot features, they may not be stereoscopic but two different focal lengths. A narrow-field and a wide-field camera allow much greater flexibility than a single wide-field.

Maybe they mean "lockstep going forward" and when X adds hardware, then future S vehicles will get it as well. I don't think they mean that the X will never get new hardware because it will always be the same as previously constructed S vehicles.

As it is, non-autopilot S vehicles don't have the same autopilot functionality as autopilot S vehicles because they don't have the hardware. Therefore, pre-autopilot S will never be "lockstep" with the X.

 

[andrewket]

The X's at the event had one camera. When I inquired about this last night on two separate occasions, the employees I was speaking with went quiet, after being very open about other items. I took this as a sign that they were given specific instruction that AP was not to be discussed. One showed sufficient body language to tell me (my interpretation, of course) "Yes, this was an unexpected and late change, and we're disappointed."

I believe the early X's will get the same AP features as the current S. At some point, both the S and the X will start shipping with AP2 hardware, but still with AP1 features. Then later an OTA update will add additional capabilities to these cars.

 

[EK123]

I think StonyMonster is correct. From the Mobile eye video, they prefer a 150 and 80 degree camera, IIRC. That's my bet for the two cameras.

One camera now, like the S. Room for second. . .
Google Photos

 

[Stoneymonster]

Maybe they mean "lockstep going forward" and when X adds hardware, then future S vehicles will get it as well. I don't think they mean that the X will never get new hardware because it will always be the same as previously constructed S vehicles.

As it is, non-autopilot S vehicles don't have the same autopilot functionality as autopilot S vehicles because they don't have the hardware. Therefore, pre-autopilot S will never be "lockstep" with the X.

I don't think they want to support multiple variants of AP hardware any longer than they have to. I expect when the X gets 2.0, the S will at the same time (new production Ses, I mean). I mean simultaneously. This way when AP 1.0 features are done in SW, they can move on to 2.0 without still worrying about finishing 1.0 SW. This made sense in my head.

 

[andrewket]

I think StonyMonster is correct. From the Mobile eye video, they prefer a 150 and 80 degree camera, IIRC. That's my bet for the two cameras.

One camera now, like the S. Room for second. . .
Google Photos

You're right, there looks to be a place for the second camera. It's possible the wiring is all there, and the second camera can be offered as retrofit. But I wouldn't get your hopes up. Anything that touches the huge windshield will probably be a PITA.

 

[Stoneymonster]

You're right, there looks to be a place for the second camera. It's possible the wiring is all there, and the second camera can be offered as retrofit. But I wouldn't get your hopes up. Anything that touches the huge windshield will probably be a PITA.

Let's hope they don't have stress fractures issues like the first few thousand Ses (Ss? S's?)! I don't think the usual roving windshield folks can replace these.

 

[pete8314]

Of the six, one was Elon, at least two were Tesla board members, and I believe one was Sergey Brin. Not exactly normal customers. Was Kimbal Musk one?

#2 was Steve Jurvetson.

 

[anxman]

Board of Directors | Tesla Motors

He's an early board member related to DFJ's early (and prescient / lucrative) investment in Tesla.

#2 was Steve Jurvetson.

 

[fieldalias]

Would be cool if there were lidars behind that nose cone, but that may be hoping for too much.

Elon's car at the event showed front Radar just like the MS.

 

[MorrisonHiker]

I don't think they want to support multiple variants of AP hardware any longer than they have to. I expect when the X gets 2.0, the S will at the same time (new production Ses, I mean). I mean simultaneously. This way when AP 1.0 features are done in SW, they can move on to 2.0 without still worrying about finishing 1.0 SW. This made sense in my head.

Yep. That's pretty much what I have been saying. I think it will work that way as well.

 

[Cebe]

Or, because they are Founders, they're all on the beta list.

Or, X has different set of sensors and implementing lane keeping for those sensors is easier than for the year old configuration S has. So, you have a version that can be released for the X, but not the matching version for the S.

 

[Stoneymonster]

Or, X has different set of sensors and implementing lane keeping for those sensors is easier than for the year old configuration S has. So, you have a version that can be released for the X, but not the matching version for the S.

There's no AP in the founder's cars' firmware, we have video evidence from the config screens.

 

[AmpedRealtor]

That's the same triangle single camera that's on the Model S with AP hardware. The upper things are just reflections of the side panels on the back doors.

Look at the top red square... there are two cameras in there. So even if the Founder's cars shipped with one camera, it's a fair bet to say that two cameras are not far behind.

 

[ICUDoc]

They might be cameras, AmpedRealtor, but to me they look like the bevelled front-facing side of the rear-view mirror???

 

[anxman]

That's dual forward radar at the bottom of the car though which doesn't match Elon's car. I think the designs and concepts were for stereoscopic cameras and radar but the engineering requirements forced them to delay it.

Given that they're still trying to get AP working on 2014 Model S variants, I'm not surprised that they're putting the brakes on next generation of AP hardware.

 

[darthy001]

Elon's car at the event showed front Radar just like the MS.


View attachment 96193

Might be missing it, but where is the radar in that picture? I dont see it below the nose as on the Model S.

I also believe Ampedrealtor is correct in his interpretation of the rendering from the website. Question is if they skipped the entire AP v2 or simply didnt make it in time for the foundes-series. Renderings could easily have been made prior to last minute decisions to skip it...

The camera-assembly shown on the founder-cars is at least _not_ identical to the Model S assembly. The one on the Model X actually looks like it has a cover of some sorts for the second camera and looks a bit awkward to be honest. On my model S the camera is perfectly centered, and the one on the founder-cars here is off center to the left from the pictures I've seen here.

Gut-feeling says that there is something missing from these early cars that will show up later. Just hope for the signatures and early production-cars that its not something they will miss.

 

[smac]

Given that they're still trying to get AP working on 2014 Model S variants, I'm not surprised that they're putting the brakes on next generation of AP hardware.

It might be the reason they are struggling is they don't have the next gen AP hardware.

We will just have to wait and see I guess.

 

[anxman]

Might be missing it, but where is the radar in that picture? I dont see it below the nose as on the Model S.

Look at the hood ornamental T, go straight down the image past the sun flare into the first area of black trim but above the chrome, and go left. That grey square is the forward radar. It's about a half thumbnail to the right of the circle.

 

[ecarfan]

Look at the hood ornamental T, go straight down the image past the sun flare into the first area of black trim but above the chrome, and go left. That grey square is the forward radar. It's about a half thumbnail to the right of the circle.

I think I see what you are referring to. It looks to be about 10-12" off center on the passenger side, correct?
Interesting that Tesla decided to move the forward radar off center. I assume that is so it will be out of the way of wherever the front plate is mounted.

 

[darthy001]

Look at the hood ornamental T, go straight down the image past the sun flare into the first area of black trim but above the chrome, and go left. That grey square is the forward radar. It's about a half thumbnail to the right of the circle.

hmm... still dont see it, but then again the compression on that picture is so bad that I see blocks/squares all over the place