Firmware 8.0

[mrElbe]

Correct, on a divided limited access highway, AP will not slow you down if for instance I have set the AP for 120 km/h with a posted limit of 100 km/h and then suddenly same highway continuation is posted at 90 km/h. AP will stay at 120 km/h as long as the divided limited access highway continues.

 

[MarcG]

You agree that on roads that the Tesla understands to be divided highways, where you can set any speed up to 85 or 90 along with autosteer, the car never reads a lower speed limit and adjusts the speed down. That is one of the features that was demo'd at the D launch event, but that has not been implemented yet.

The demo from the launch event was conducted on a makeshift road (I believe outside Tesla's design center in Hawthorne) that had speed limit between 25 and 30 mph, if I remember correctly.

This would more likely mimic local, undivided roads, on which the latest 8.0 versions behave exactly like the demo (versus divided freeways, on which you correctly state that the car does not slow down for lower speed limits).

EDIT: found a user-uploaded video of a test ride during that launch event

 

[CHG-ON]

Was that since the latest update (2.50.114)? That was the case with the AP1 software -- there were no speed restrictions on any roads. With the new software, the restriction appears to be 90mph on divided/limited-access roads, the speed limit on roads not meeting that criteria. This new restriction is one of the things many AP1 users are unhappy about.

Yes, this has been discussed extensively in this thread and others. The old limitation of 5mph over the limit was apparently lowered to the speed limit with the latest software update for AP1 cars....

Many thanks. I just found it. Very annoying.

 

[Andyw2100]

The demo from the launch event was conducted on a makeshift road (I believe outside Tesla's design center in Hawthorne) that had speed limit between 25 and 30 mph, if I remember correctly.

This would more likely mimic local, undivided roads, on which the latest 8.0 versions behave exactly like the demo (versus divided freeways, on which you correctly state that the car does not slow down for lower speed limits).

I posted a couple of test drive videos recently myself, in another thread.

The speed adjustments taking place in the video are not like the speed adjustments you are referring to above. In the videos, the driver sets the speed initially when the car is travelling at about 11 MPH. It must have recognized the speed limit there as 25, as the car speeds up to 25 just before seeing the 30 MPH sign. The car then speeds up to 30, and then back down to 25 later, at the next 25 MPH sign. This is very different than what happens now with the speed limiting.

And none of the above would work on divided highways. No one watching the launch demo videos could have expected the speed limit adjusting to only happen on roads like that one. To take my example and your suggestion to a ridiculous extreme, you could argue that the speed adjusting was only shown to work in closed, private environments, so no one should have expected it to work on public roads.

Tesla has provided a lot of what was promised for AP1 from the outset, but not the speed adjusting, and certainly not the "coming to pick you up on private property."

 

[MarcG]

You're right for the most part Andy.
The one scenario where I know the speed goes up on its own is where AP had previously adjusted down to obey a lower speed limit than originally set.

Example: undivided road speed limit is 50mph, AP set to the max speed (in latest firmware = 50mph, in earlier ones 55).
Car comes up to a new speed limit of 40mph, AP slows down accordingly.
A bit later, speed limit goes back up to 50mph: AP adjusts up again.

I posted an example of this in a few posts way up this thread. Initially the AP speed did not go back up, but a few weeks after I posted about it Tesla released a version that did.

 

[Andyw2100]

You're right for the most part Andy.
The one scenario where I know the speed goes up on its own is where AP had previously adjusted down to obey a lower speed limit than originally set.

Example: undivided road speed limit is 50mph, AP set to the max speed (in latest firmware = 50mph, in earlier ones 55).
Car comes up to a new speed limit of 40mph, AP slows down accordingly.
A bit later, speed limit goes back up to 50mph: AP adjusts up again.

Yes, I was aware of that.

But as I think we now agree, that is just Tesla imposing a limit and maintaining that limit, which is based on the speed limit of the road, as that speed limit changes.

I think the feature still missing that a lot of people want is the ability to set TACC at some speed relative to the speed limit--say the speed limit or the speed limit plus X, and then have the car maintain that speed as the speed limit changes, on divided highways, of course. So my wife, who commutes on an interstate and is pretty conservative, would set the speed to speed limit plus 5 MPH, and when the limit changes from 65, where it is for most of the trip, down to 55, the car would slow itself from 70 to 60. (I realize the offset was never demo'd, but very early on we did get an offset exactly like that for the speed assist (warning.) The concept would be the same.)

I recognize that the probable reason Tesla has not yet provided this is that the format of speed limit signs is not consistent, and there could be somewhat catastrophic errors. I think they could probably deal with that with some sort of safety mechanism that causes the car to alert instead of actually change the speed if the differential between old speed and new speed is too great. If they want to get really fancy, they could even geo-locate "overrides", so that if there is one sign on someone's regular route that causes trouble, the safety over-ride could be over-ridden, if that makes sense.

I guess what I'm saying is that this should be a problem the smart folks at Tesla can solve. I'm just concerned that now that there is AP2, there may not be that much incentive for Tesla to continue to improve AP1.

 

[WannabeOwner]

I'm just concerned that now that there is AP2, there may not be that much incentive for Tesla to continue to improve AP1

I think that swings both ways. If it turns out to be not too difficult to migrate some AP2 features to AP1 that will be a really good feel-good factor for all owners - I think "Tesla cars continue to improve even after even-better-hardware is rolled out" will be a good PR soundbite.

I've never even been offered (paid or otherwise), let alone received, a Map Update of any sort for any of the Audi, VW or Seat vehicles I have owned (with internal SatNav) in the last decade. All dealer-serviced at the required intervals.

 

[TrafficEng]

For all these "only up to the speed limit" posts, is that only when use AutoSteer, or is this also when using TACC and manually steering?

Only when using Autosteer. When using TACC there is no limitation on the speed you can set (up to 90 mph, I think, but would be crazy took set this high on a non-freeway road)

 

[BertL]

I know this thread has been focused on AP for the last few days, but so it does not get lost in the larger 8.0 scheme of things, it now appears to me 2.50.114 has introduced some new anomolies from .40 with perhaps additional USB rescans, CID lockups, and CID reboots seem to be acting differently in what is consistently cleared within Media Player (release-to-release or reboot-to-reboot, IDK).

Since I hate to cross-post, if you are interested, check out this post from Sunday and this one from just now for detail or further discussion over in the Comprehensive USB Bug List thread.​

 

[EMdoc12]

I've noticed that since receiving 2.50.114 I have slacker stations that now longer show a station/album cover. I have tried rebooting without any luck too. I don't ever remember having this problem before.

 

[4SUPER9]

Wow. I typically upgrade right away. I am glad that I did not. I often travel 395 to Mammoth were the speed limit is 65 and the average speed is over 75. I always keep it under 75, and get passed most of the route as is. AP typically slows to 5 MPH+ on many sections of this route, which I really do not mind, but does so on many of the divided sections as well. If I slow to exactly 65, I will get a lot of dirty looks. Not only that, even though I always keep to the right, I believe I will become a traffic hazard.

 

[rog]

I've noticed that since receiving 2.50.114 I have slacker stations that now longer show a station/album cover. I have tried rebooting without any luck too. I don't ever remember having this problem before.

Same here. Very annoying (and again surprised that Tesla QA did not catch this... )

 

[CHG-ON]

Many thanks. I just found it. Very annoying.

My thanks was re: now understanding the loss of the 5 MPH AP wiggle room.

I just wanted to add...

I think this nanny policing of us is partly due to the idiots early on doing stupid things like sitting in the back seat and driving. That was just the start of it. Then we had the terribly unfortunate death in FL. I don't mean to disrespect people's right to either be dumb or inattentive. But if I were running Tesla, or their legal counsel (I have NO legal experience, BTW), I would recommend the same nannying that is now happening. In this litigious USA of ours, it simply is too expensive to take the risk. If it is my responsibility to run a company, then I need to do what I can to ensure its longevity while achieving its mission.

Makes it unfortunate for those of us that try take responsibility and act reasonably while having fun with cool and useful tech. The loss of the 5MPH over the the limit is a real loss to me because most people in my area drive at that pace, which allows me to keep up with them. Now I can't use it because I would be an impediment.

Unfortunately, the "dumb it down for everybody" still seems to be the rule of the day.

 

[zambono]

Same here. Very annoying (and again surprised that Tesla QA did not catch this... )

They should eventually download

 

[boonedocks]

), I would recommend the same nannying that is now happening. In this litigious USA of ours, it simply is too expensive to take the risk

With that thought process all autonomous features should be ninnied that could impede our safety. Auto high beams, auto wipers, auto emergency braking, REGULAR cruise control.....where do we begin and end with the nannying...

 

[drklain]

Ask your legislators. That's where most of the nannying stuff comes from. There was a time when your car didn't beep all the time if the driver didn't have his/her seatbelt on....then it changed to beeping....then it changed to include the front passenger as well. Car manufacturers didn't put that in because of the kindness of their hearts but in response to regulation.

After 2019, all electric cars will have to make some sort of noise so that pedestrians who are walking around distracted don't step in front of them. Why? Legislation.

 

[bhzmark]

I hear that in Somalia the residents aren't burdened with this horrible thing called "legislation".

 

[thecloud]

I hear that in Somalia the residents aren't burdened with this horrible thing called "legislation".

Because some legislation is bad, it does not logically follow that all legislation is bad.

 

[jgs]

Ask your legislators. That's where most of the nannying stuff comes from. There was a time when your car didn't beep all the time if the driver didn't have his/her seatbelt on....then it changed to beeping....then it changed to include the front passenger as well. Car manufacturers didn't put that in because of the kindness of their hearts but in response to regulation.

After 2019, all electric cars will have to make some sort of noise so that pedestrians who are walking around distracted don't step in front of them. Why? Legislation.

Can you cite the laws or government agency regulations that have compelled the changes to Autopilot? I'm not aware of any. "Fear of legislation", maybe, or "fear of liability", but those are both completely different animals. In fact, it's pretty much the industry self-regulation one often hears about when someone is arguing why legislation isn't needed.

AFAIK Tesla's never said boo about why they're making changes, so it's all speculation. But unlike Tesla, the government does publish its laws and regulations, so if Tesla actually were being compelled, it would be possible to know that and cite specifics.

 

[chillaban]

Can you cite the laws or government agency regulations that have compelled the changes to Autopilot? I'm not aware of any. "Fear of legislation", maybe, or "fear of liability", but those are both completely different animals. In fact, it's pretty much the industry self-regulation one often hears about when someone is arguing why legislation isn't needed.

AFAIK Tesla's never said boo about why they're making changes, so it's all speculation. But unlike Tesla, the government does publish its laws and regulations, so if Tesla actually were being compelled, it would be possible to know that and cite specifics.

Some of that takes time to surface. The NTSB and NHTSA investigations into the Joshua Brown case is still ongoing, and it's unclear what if any requests were made. Eventually they will become part of a publicly released report, but it's still possible this is a regulatory matter that's been freshly discussed, or it's possible that this is just Tesla acting out of fear of legislation/liability, or genuinely trying to experiment with different AutoPilot behaviors to see their impact on safety.