Look at my signature. I own both AP1 and AP2 cars. I can compare them quite well.
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FIRMWARE UPDATE! AP2 Local road driving...and holy crap
- Thread starter Skalinator
- Start date
Look at my signature. I own both AP1 and AP2 cars. I can compare them quite well.
Show me where Tesla said parity with AP1 in December because I don't believe they ever said or printed that. They said the first software release for AP2 would be out by December, and it was - barely. The confusion here is between a single release with all features working perfectly, vs an incremental approach spanning months. Could Tesla have been more clear about this? Yes, I concede that. But I don't think they have purposely mislead anyone, at least not with their official remarks or website.
drshan
Active Member
Nice. Any you have no concerns? Just seems as if the initial roll outs of AP1 autosteer (v7.0) and AP2 autosteer (v17.5.32) are world apart.
The initial release of AP2 is behind where AP1 began. That's not particularly surprising, given AP1 was mobileye and they had years of development prior to Tesla choosing them as a supplier. The two platforms also use two very different approaches to the problem. AP2 takes more "on the road" development. Ultimately I think we'll be pleased with the results of AP2, but it will take some time.
I looked at the picture/capture you posted and I don't see where it says parity with AP1 by December. Validation != parity.
What does "Tesla's Enhanced Autopilot software is expected to complete validation and be rolled out to your car" mean to you? Is English your primary language??
Or more importantly, how does is expected to translate in your mind? I don't think it's easy to claim Tesla deceived the customer with this verbiage. It gives Tesla a lot of leeway.
The ONLY way it can be interpreted in a legal case is that the software is basically finished, but is with almost certainly going to COMPLETE validation by December. The only thing holding FSD back is "regulatory approval." Also, in a legal case context is paramount. Take the customer on a test-drive with functional AP, show a FSD video, and sell them something entirely non-functional with one word on a website to be your defense? I don't think so. I'd love for an attorney on this thread to play devil's advocate. It's simply indefensible.
Please note that Tesla didn't write we will START writing AP2 software and provide limited functionality for several months and years, and you should not expect the same experience as the car you test drove in the showroom.
When it comes to consumer protection, the only interpretation that will stand is the most consumer friendly. Sorry Tesla, this won't protect you. You are billion dollar company. You expect me to believe you couldn't have your lawyers write up a single paragraph to have a customer sign prior to purchase which would limit your liability in this? Give me a break, this is fraudulent advertising.
Please note that Tesla didn't write we will START writing AP2 software and provide limited functionality for several months and years, and you should not expect the same experience as the car you test drove in the showroom.
When it comes to consumer protection, the only interpretation that will stand is the most consumer friendly. Sorry Tesla, this won't protect you. You are billion dollar company. You expect me to believe you couldn't have your lawyers write up a single paragraph to have a customer sign prior to purchase which would limit your liability in this? Give me a break, this is fraudulent advertising.
drshan
Active Member
Bet TSLA
Active Member
You do continue to blather on and on. Let us know when you have a suit filed if you can find a lawyer stupid enough to do so.
Loosely transcribed:
"....for a few months HW1 car will be better than HW2...we expect to reach feature parity in December"
"Our goal is a demonstration drive....full autonomy.....car will drive from home in LA to Times Square in NYC....and park itself...without a single touch by end of 2017."
"....for a few months HW1 car will be better than HW2...we expect to reach feature parity in December"
"Our goal is a demonstration drive....full autonomy.....car will drive from home in LA to Times Square in NYC....and park itself...without a single touch by end of 2017."
NerdUno
Member
When a merchant ties their expectation to a date certain in order to sell a feature for their cars and then produces a video to prove that the feature is, in fact, working, it becomes a representation. When the merchant knows or should have known that their expectation was impossible to meet much less deliver on the promised timetable, it becomes a misrepresentation. Simple as that.
And, for the record, Enhanced AutoPilot didn't mean feature parity with AP1. It meant the enhanced feature set presented in Tesla's own video. That was the reason for the regulatory approval language.
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Bet TSLA
Active Member
Are you unfamiliar with the concept of a "demo". Something working in a demo means pretty much nothing in terms of it being deliverable. Somebody assuming that because they saw a demo means that will be part of the product they get is at best naive. Tesla never represented anything more than that what they demo'ed is what they would like the vehicle to do, eventually. They quite clearly said that the sensor suite and processor would be capable of that and more.
My AP1 car keeps getting better with every new firmware update. I'm sure the AP2 cars are too. I also expect that in the next couple of months the AP2 cars will leave mine behind and never look back. It's bizarre how so many of the people who are getting to go along on this ride are here whining and complaining that it isn't going fast enough. And you just know that if Tesla hurries things and as a result doesn't get it exactly right they'll whine and complain about that too. Some people just aren't suited to owning this sort of device.
@Bet TSLA, you don't really have a dog in this fight so I'm perplexed why you keep posting about this and encouraging me to sue? Feel free to throw your weight around when you pick up an AP2 car without functioning autopilot.
To those of you with AP2 cars who feel you have been let down by Tesla, please PM me. I know some of you already have.
Thanks
To those of you with AP2 cars who feel you have been let down by Tesla, please PM me. I know some of you already have.
Thanks
disagree
hos epi to polu
He's a stock holder and is motivated to argue against anything that could damage the value of the stock. It's transparent and boring.
If you are talking about legal claims here, feature parity is not the same as function parity, especially considering the context of admitting that HW1 cars will be better than HW2 for several months.
How many of the 400,000 people who have reserved a 3 are suited for this? I'm sure some will say everything will be ironed out by then, but I'm not convinced all the progress made with the S will translate to the 3. I suspect there will be a smaller percentage of owners willing to put up with this and there will be lots more of them.
disagree
hos epi to polu
EAP (not parts of EAP) software was expected to complete validation and be rolled out to our cars in December, which was in the window of 2-3 months, which was several months. What context turns this into open-ended eternity or reasonably translates the FSD video, tweets/comments from CEO, and/or purchase agreement into "parts of EAP will be rolled out in increments spread over 4 months beginning with 1000 cars right before the end of Q4?"
It's super great that the fanboys will say "thank you, sir, can I have another." No one is arguing about their joy from that.
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