First look at the Supercharger?

[Johan]

Actually it does make some sense to charge batteries using grid power because of demand charges. If the electrical utility has demand charges and peak usage charges, it would make sense to charge the batteries off grid power during off peak hours.

Given enough battery capacity the charger could also be plugged in to the grid with a relatively low-grade (low amperage) - cheaper - connection and charge continously (24h). The caveat of course being if say 10 cars want to charge 70kW each in rapid succession.

 

[TEG]

Connecting via lower power grid connections could reduce the costs of installation and allow it to be installed in more locations.

 

[Johan]

Connecting via lower power grid connections could reduce the costs of installation and allow it to be installed in more locations.

However, this would initially be off-set by the cost of batteries (in the charger). They don't have to be the same quality as the ones in the car, but the whole "pack" in the charger has to be able to discharge steadily at 90kW (the supercharge rate). And has to have good cycle life.

 

[EchoDelta]

I wonder if it looks like the Tesla logo 'T' from the front.
Also the left pillar seems to have a sort of station or something.

Elon seems excited about this. After the service plan 'loud feedback' I hope they have clear messaging, that they state underpromised goals and that they put forward a crystal clear value prop. (not for my sake, I think I'm likely to appreciate any smart thing they do, but the public maybe not so much).

 

[Teo_atawki]

Somewhere along the line I got the impression these stations were going to cost $500K each. That leaves the potential for a station to have the equivalent of 10 85KwH battery packs internally, since that would be ~10% of the station cost.

Running the superchargers totally off solar seems like a long shot. Back of the envelope calculations using an average 6.3KwH per day per m^2 of solar panel and 70KwH used per supercharge would require over 11m^2 of panels * the number of supercharges you anticipate daily.

The 6.3 number is based on Las Vegas' average sunshine and some generic solar panel calculator. YMMV

 

[wstuff]

Thank you TEG that was exactly my point, use the grid to charge a capacitive pack, or battery pack during the night and the solar cells providing shade for the recharger and car during the charging process and of course charging batteries or returning power to the grid for net metering purposes during the bright sunlight days.Robert

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

Solar carport with batteries in it to reduce peak charging.

They'll be pushing the merits of solar carports (more renewables, shading parking lots) as well as the ability to charge at a rate nobody else can match.

I hope there's other goodness.

Edit: I shouldn't be surprised if he takes a swipe at other manufacturers for not building their own charging network. (Yes, they have dealerships, but they can't control access to their chargers.). Although, he's already said that the 40 kWh isn't for people wanting to travel long distances you could say that Nissan is implying that fast charging on the Leaf allows for longer distances.

 

[wstuff]

Actually if the system is set up this way it makes it very flexible for the future, right now with the amount of EV traffic a well placed Supersite may recharge 4 Teslas a day in the next year, but we all hope they will be able to charge 50 a day ( as th EV traffic increases ) and all you would need to do is add battery pack storage capability so you slide packs in ( like memory chips in a motherboard )as demand on the route increases. The Supersite that charges 50 cars a day may have a storage capacity of maybe 12 batteries at any one time while a lower used Supersite may have a total of 4 battery packs. Robert

 

[tdelta1000]

I like the initial image of what may be the Supercharger. Does any know how many EVs can be recharged at these stations? If TM can perfect this network and sucessfully expand it then the sky is the limit for TM.

 

[Electric Machete]

A large capacitor seems like a more likely candidate than multiple battery back ups. I don't know how quickly the battery packs can discharge, but I would imagine that a capacitor could do it much more quickly. I'm not an electrical engineer, but it is my understanding that capacitors don't suffer the inevitable wear and breakdown that battery packs do. If they are looking to load batteries up quickly, then capacitor to battery makes more sense that battery to battery. The solar arrays can charge either system and they feed back to the grid once either system is full. In any case, it seems like an interesting development and we will have all of the details in a week.

 

[Adm]

Seems there will be live streaming video of the event:

http://gigaom.com/cleantech/tesla-to-unveil-details-of-super-charger-next-monday-night/

 

[FalconNinetyD]

Seems like SoCal reservation holders were invited.

Not me :-(

 

[TEG]

A large capacitor seems like a more likely candidate than multiple battery back ups. I don't know how quickly the battery packs can discharge, but I would imagine that a capacitor could do it much more quickly. I'm not an electrical engineer, but it is my understanding that capacitors don't suffer the inevitable wear and breakdown that battery packs do. If they are looking to load batteries up quickly, then capacitor to battery makes more sense that battery to battery. The solar arrays can charge either system and they feed back to the grid once either system is full. In any case, it seems like an interesting development and we will have all of the details in a week.

Having the equivalent to a Model S battery/pack would probably be a good match. I think the max output power tends to be similar to the max input power, so doing "battery to battery" might be OK that way.

Yes, (Super/Ultra) Capacitors have some benefits - they have high cycle life, and high power input/output capability, but some downsides too:
#1: They don't hold charge very long compared to Li-Ion cells, so aren't so great for long term power storage.
#2: Their range of voltage (between empty and full) tends to be much, much greater making the associated electronics more expensive and complicated.
#3: Good quality ones are very expensive.

Besides, Tesla probably has a ready supply of somewhat used cells leftover from Roadster repair work, so I think they would make a lot more sense financially.

 

[jerry33]

Besides, Tesla probably has a ready supply of somewhat used cells leftover from Roadster repair work, so I think they would make a lot more sense financially.

I'm guessing they also have some Model S packs that don't pass quality control for a car but would be fine for this purpose.

 

[Brian H]

Given enough battery capacity the charger could also be plugged in to the grid with a relatively low-grade (low amperage) - cheaper - connection and charge continously (24h). The caveat of course being if say 10 cars want to charge 70kW each in rapid succession.

Or simultaneously. How many outlets per SC station?

 

[vfx]

Since the illustration is somewhat fanciful it begs the question how big is this thing?

 

[TEG]

Since the illustration is somewhat fanciful it begs the question how big is this thing?

Yeah, sometimes you have to ask yourself questions like that...

 

[Brian H]

And what are the slanting lines radiating from the upper right?

(Begs the question means assumes the answer in the question wording, btw.)

But Elon's description as "looking like an alien spaceship has landed" seems about right, no? :wink:

 

[vfx]

A..
(Begs the question means assumes the answer in the question wording, btw.) ...

Thanks. Looks like the phrase ("What does that have to do with anything?")is used incorrectly enough (as in, "make me wonder") that it's hit the tipping point of being redefined or broadened.

 

[Vger]

And what are the slanting lines radiating from the upper right?

I think it is just a graphic design element superimposed over the photo/rendering.