Fisker Fires

[raymond]

There are about 250M cars in the US. There are about 250K car fires in the US each year. That's about a 1/1000 ratio, but less than 6% of those cars are new, and I suspect more fires happen in older cars than newer cars.

A sample of 2 cars in 2K isn't significant, but one can't help but speculate on the similarity of these two instances: Car driven, parked, and then caught fire within a half hour (or less).

Using these numbers, the chance a new car catches fire in a given year is 1/17,000 or about 0.0059%. The odds of 2 (or more) new cars out of 2,000 catching fire is 0.64%. (If I still know how to do statistical stuff...) Not enough to get somebody convicted, but more than enough for "strong suspicion!"

Throw in the additional similarity of the two fires and I'd say a structural problem is highly likely.

 

[stopcrazypp]

Using these numbers, the chance a new car catches fire in a given year is 1/17,000 or about 0.0059%. The odds of 2 (or more) new cars out of 2,000 catching fire is 0.64%. (If I still know how to do statistical stuff...) Not enough to get somebody convicted, but more than enough for "strong suspicion!"

Throw in the additional similarity of the two fires and I'd say a structural problem is highly likely.

You know what they say:
1 time is an isolated incident.
2 times is a coincidence.
3 times is ?

Luckily the Karma is not at 3 yet.

 

[vfx]

Using these numbers, the chance a new car catches fire in a given year is 1/17,000 or about 0.0059%. The odds of 2 (or more) new cars out of 2,000 catching fire is 0.64%. (If I still know how to do statistical stuff...) ....

Thanks to the math team! So is the new Cadillac CTS catching on fire at the same rate?

 

[doug]

This seems like a bad part that under certain circumstances will catch fire. Discovering where the fire originated is absolutely critical. It could even be a part from the ICE and have nothing to do with the EV aspect of the car.

I'd say most likely it doesn't have anything to do with the car being a plug-in. Though, the fires in many ICE cars are electrical in origin. Some insulation wears thin, and then there's risk fire from a short. I think Tesla had a safety service bulletin for the Roadster with a couple wires in the 12V system where the little lead acid battery is. Something that could easily affect an ICE car.

 

[Robert.Boston]

My favorite quote is the masterful understatement:

By the time fire crews arrived the front of the vehicle was mostly destroyed ... the owner seemed upset.

 

[dsm363]

My favorite quote is the masterful understatement:

Yeah. That's journalism at its best. Kind of like asking the losing team at the Super Bowl "How do you feel about the game right now?"

 

[smorgasbord]

Wonder how many Fisker owners are now parking their Karmas outside, instead of in the garage?

Interesting that they're not talking about that over on FiskerBuzz. Given the similar circumstances of the 2 fires, I'd feel like I'd need to open the hood after parking the car and then watch it for 15-20 minutes.

 

[jerry33]

You know what they say:
1 time is an isolated incident.
2 times is a coincidence.
3 times is ?

Enemy action.

 

[doug]

A trend.

 

[Bardlebee]

A trend.

This probably has been brough up already... but what of the repercussions if Beiber's car caught fire?

 

[doug]

Another Fisker Meltdown: Extended-Range EV Having Some Reliability Issues : Greentech Media

Armed with a billion dollars in funding, Fisker is struggling to overcome recalls, political backlash, and spontaneous combustion.

 

[doug]

Sorry to pull a TEGed here, but...

There were some issues with the cooling fan motors. I suppose that could be a source of ignition. Things are really packed in there.

Fisker Automotive shake-up: Former Chevy Volt chief named new CEO - San Jose Mercury News

"Our suspicion is it's the cooling fan," [Lead Fisker board director Ray] Lane said Tuesday.

 

[Vger]

Oooh, Al Gore has a Fisker... ouch!

 

[doug]

I guesss it's a different Schwarzenegger movie then.

Fisker Recalls All Karma Hybrid EVs Over Fire Risk

Fisker completes investigation of latest Karma hybrid EV fire, issues vehicle-wide cooling fan recall -- Engadget

MEDIA STATEMENT -- Woodside, CA Incident
ANAHEIM, CA -- August 18, 2012:

...

Fisker has today voluntarily elected to conduct a recall with respect to this cooling fan
unit. The company is working with the responsible supplier and this recall campaign is
not expected to have a material financial impact on Fisker.

I'd say it has a material impact on their brand image.

 

[medved]

Fisker completes investigation of latest Karma hybrid EV fire, issues vehicle-wide cooling fan recall -- Engadget

My favourite comments there:
"This Fisker car is a mess on wheels."

"Simple fix:
Add a high temp cooling fan to cool off the low temp cooling fan. Oh... but what will cool off the high temp cooling fan?
Never mind .. buy a Tesla."

I think the best solution for Fisker problems would be to upgrade the Fisker Karma to Tesla Model S.

 

[stopcrazypp]

Fisker Recalls All Karma Hybrid EVs Over Fire Risk

Fisker completes investigation of latest Karma hybrid EV fire, issues vehicle-wide cooling fan recall -- Engadget

Bonus points for predicting the cause!

I just hope this investigation was really done thoroughly and there wasn't another cause for the fires (in other words, ensure that another vehicle defect caused fire will not happen). This not only hurts the reputation of Fisker, but is another hit at the ATVM loans.

 

[SoCalGuy]

My favourite comments there:
"This Fisker car is a mess on wheels."

"Simple fix:
Add a high temp cooling fan to cool off the low temp cooling fan. Oh... but what will cool off the high temp cooling fan?
Never mind .. buy a Tesla."

I think the best solution for Fisker problems would be to upgrade the Fisker Karma to Tesla Model S.

Doesn't the Model S have cooling fans as well? I certainly heard some fan-like sound running during the roadshow drives.

 

[bonnie]

Not sure how Fisker is going to get away with blaming this on the fan manufacturer. Surely Fisker has a fan specification, determined this part met those specs, and then perform an inspection on each shipment of those fans to ensure they continue to meet spec.

Right???

 

[Todd Burch]

Doesn't the Model S have cooling fans as well? I certainly heard some fan-like sound running during the roadshow drives.

The Model S's drivetrain is liquid cooled, so we're talking pumps and heat exchangers. Might be a fan on the heat exchangers to cool the drivetrain when the car is not in motion...but I can't remember. The only air-based fans I know of would be the circulating fans for the climate control...but someone else can probably provide more detail (or correct me).

Of course the issue here is not that cooling fans were used, but that either the cooling fan design or its implementation in the system appears to be flawed.

 

[ckessel]

Of course the issue here is not that cooling fans were used, but that either the cooling fan design or its implementation in the design appears to be flawed.

Yea, every car has fans. It's not that fans that are inherently a problem.