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Fisker Karma

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You know the saying "You throw enough on the wall some will stick" the VC's seem to work on that saying.

The bebnefit is that ot does encourage change, innovation, creativity, the VC's are very good with concepts that are initially disruptive.
 
Someone pointed out that the Karma looks a bit like the 2003 Chevy SS concept.

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Wow, they are similar. Fisker has a few more lines to it, but the basic shape is very close. Both are somewhat like an elongated RX-8, now that I think about it.

On the VC thing, they go into these deals knowing the odds aren't very good. But a good VC will throw money at 15 projects, lose money on 14, and make a 30x return on the successful one.

-Ryan
 

Perhaps Fisker was bringing it on themselves by making that claim, but from reading the comments it's depressing how many of them give the same tired arguments against EVs. Some even made the same mistake of forgetting this is a PHEV that can run on normal fuel when it's out of batteries. Then there are those who expect the battery to be useless in 5 years, completely ignorant of the capabilities of modern day li-ion batteries.

Next time these PHEVs should stop making claims that don't put into account the efficiency of the EV drivetrain. Typical EVs usually at least supply the equivalent mpg figure. Most PHEVs I have seen makes ridiculous mpg claims that don't reflect the energy used by the battery at all. They all make claims like 150+mpg or 300+mpg when that mpg only refers to gallons of FUEL used and not the actual equivalent efficiency, which is usually much, much lower. This almost always leads to these same tired arguments against EVs.
 
Overinflated claims are the enemy of adoption. If people find out that some of the statements are misleading then they won't have the trust to switch to that alternate technology. EVs should be sold on merits, not hype.
 
Fisker to project "jet turbine" sound through external speakers

Okay, this is a pretty stupid move that will certainly be rediculed by those of the internet community:
"But the electric motor also has an unexpected side effect: It is completely silent, Fisker says, which might worry pedestrians with bad eyesight and disappoint sports car freaks keen to hear the roar of their machines.




Fisker says the solution is speakers the company has added inside and outside the vehicle. One option will allow drivers to make their car sound ''like something between a Formula One car and a jet plane,'' and certainly loud enough to be heard by pedestrians.




A gimmick? Fisker says most car makers already tinker with the sound of the engine.



''It's been enhanced and manipulated to make sure it sounds good,'' he says. ''Part of any experience is the acoustic experience.'' "

http://www.forbesautos.com/news/headlines/2008/march/ap031208-geneva-auto-show-superhybrids.html

Tire noise is still going to exist so I don't see why they have to deliberately do this. This is similar to the vroombox designed to make minivans sound like exotic cars. This is an expensive car, and this kind of imitation of sound is going to be laughed at.
You have people laughing here already:
Fisker Karma to project a jet turbine sound using speakers - Autoblog

Then you have people using this as a chance to bash EVs:
"That is one of the lamest ideas I have ever heard. If you want your car to sound cool, don't buy a damn electric car.

I have an idea: I'm going to buy a lamborghini and put a sticker on it that says ''electric vehicle''. That way, I can have the sound, looks, performance, and prestige that comes with owning a Lamborghini, and the pretentiousness of thinking that I am saving the world that comes with owning an electric car."

I don't agree, I think EVs have their own distinct sound that is pleasing to hear, and can certainly qualify as "cool". The sound is similar to a jet turbine or a supercharger and quite frankly is one of the most futuristic sounds you can hear. It doesn't need some speaker to mimic other sounds.
 
I think sound effects are a pretty bad idea. I don't want my electric car to sound like it has an engine.

I'm not completely convinced that it is such a great a hazard to blind people, but if that's true then maybe give it two horns, a traditional loud one, and a softer, less offensive one that just says "I'm here". If you see someone who looks inattentive and might step out in your way, you can let them know your coming.

Come to think of it, there are times in a regular car when that would be handy.

The down side is that people would have to figure out which horn to use, and often you don't have but a second, or even less, to hit it. I guess put the traditional one in the traditional place, and the softer one somewhere else. That way, in a panic, you would still go for the loud one, and it would still get the job done, just not as nicely.
 
My thought on sound effects is that noise is a form of pollution, too.

I used to work in downtown Chicago and still stay there overnight when seeing a show or something. It's amazing how quiet the city gets after dark when the traffic dies down. We've just become accustomed to the noise we create, and maybe the world would be a lot more peaceful if we all drove electric cars.
 
I think it is one of those phases that "EV people" go through when they say "Eureka! I could use my sound system to make my EV sound like an ICE!"
Lots of people spontaneously thought of that idea when they first pondered the Tesla. It is an old idea that just keeps resurfacing. I think it shows that Fisker is a little immature in this area that they get excited enough to actually make an announcement that they plan to offer it as a feature.

Many ICE vehicles have very quiet engines now such that engine noise is no suitable warning to pedestrians. Cars have horns already that you can use if you see a pedestrian that needs your attention. The fake ICE noises would be fun for some, but tacky for many others. I would make it a "hidden option" that only a nerd/geek could figure out how to unlock with the car control computer. The average customer might be better off not knowing such a thing even exists.

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Perhaps they could add sound effects for squealing tires around corners, and a simulated crashing sound whenever the airbags go off! :biggrin:
 
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Here's my thoughts on the subject:

- The idea of speakers to make car "noises" is ridiculous since it isn't even related to the characteristics of EVs.
- Additional speakers add more weight and utilizes more energy (Gordon Murray when designing the McLaren F1 was so vigilant on saving weight he even had Kenwood design speakers exclusively for the car that were significantly lighter)
- I'm all about safety for both pedestrians and motorists but people should simply be more aware of the other to begin with - easier said than done unfortunately.
- I like the idea of two sets of horns; one soft and one loud. Maybe the loud one could where you would normally expect to find one on the centre of the steering wheel while buttons could be at the 3 and 9 o'clock positions for easy access to warn others.
- The paradigm around performance = extremely loud should and will change over time.

Nonetheless the sound of a Tesla or any well engineered EV at any speed is music to my ears (or lack thereof). Especially the Eliica.

 
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Apparently, many years ago, Frank Williams, the F1 Team Manager had loudspeakers installed in the rear pillars of his Esprit so that he could talk to other road users!

What is it about otherwise intelligent, successful men that they come up with ideas like this?

Let's hope Elon keeps his head screwed on.

I was willing to overlook the Karma's rather pointless photovoltaics-on-the-roof but this "Vroom-box" undermines the credibility of EVs in the eyes of the public.

As annoying and unnecessary as GM's Volt advert with the doggie bath.

Still, I think Darryl should do another Mythbuster on "Quieter cars and pedestrian safety"
 
".. but this "Vroom-box" undermines the credibility of EVs in the eyes of the public."

That's the big problem; EVs don't have credibility with most of the public. They think EVs are weird. Rather than try to counter that perception, most EV makers keep reinforcing it:

* NEVs that only run at reduced speed
* Three wheelers
* Strange looking vehicles like the Aptera
* Bizzare commercials
* Vaporware with outlandish claims like the ZAP-X

So now Fisker comes along with a car that is attractive while still looking like a regular car, and has great performance, (at least on paper), and then they have to go and spoil it with stupid gimmicks.

Tesla stands alone as the only normal, attrative, high performance car that just happens to not use any liquid fuel of any kind.
 
I still think PV on the roof does make a bit of sense. But only to drive the AC within the car/battery during hot summers days when that problem is important. That way you can probably sit parked somewhere in the sun and keep the temperature at decent level inside the car and not have to "turn on the engine" as you would with a dinocar (well use the main battery in this case but you get my point).
Making cars deliberately more noisy sounds pretty silly, and might even be illegal here. Strictly speaking using the horn in Norway for anything but an emergency is forbidden. So the first think a Norwegian importer would do would be remove that feature I guess..

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