Fix for Roadster 80A Charging Bug

[mknox]

FYI Sun Country Highway has now switched over to 80A stations, and won't be stocking 70A anymore, so the timing on this is perfect.

I checked with our service center and the update has not been released yet, but they promised to install it for me once it is available.

I've got two CS-100's on order. Sun Country told me they have newer firmware that deals with the Roadster bug, and apparently one other EV model that also had problems with these larger charging stations. Sounds like the issue is being addressed from both ends...

 

[djp]

Sounds like the issue is being addressed from both ends...

Hopefully they don't cross paths and break each other!

 

[mknox]

Hopefully they don't cross paths and break each other!

Seriously! I originally planned on CS-90's (out of respect for Roadster owners) until Sun Country told me of their fix.

 

[Doug_G]

The new CS-100 firmware is, from what I've heard, able to reduce the power the station reports to 90A through the push buttons on the front panel. I believe it's the Leaf that also has the 80A problem.

 

[hcsharp]

Are you working on a ModelS-Roadster adapter?

I had a prototype at TESLIVE. That's the best part of getting this bug fixed. There are way more Model S HPWC out there than there are 75 or 80A J1772 stations.

It contained electronics to overcome the Roadster bug. Then I discovered a small NEC compliance issue after discussing the design with a couple of EEs so I had to start over on the electronics. I was just about to start testing the new design - only to have Tesla eliminate the problem! It still needs electronics, but now it's very simple and I plan to send a couple of them out for testing later next week.

 

[brianman]

I'd really like to see if Roadster HPC->ModelSAdapter->RoadsterAdapter->ModelSAdapter->Model S works.

 

[hcsharp]

I'd really like to see if Roadster HPC->ModelSAdapter->RoadsterAdapter->ModelSAdapter->Model S works.

I tried that but the Model S got confused and started wanting to be a Roadster. Every day it began looking more and more like the Roadster. I really got worried one day when I opened the door and saw that the 17" touch screen had shrunk down to about 4", so I stopped the experiment. :tongue:

I did make a Roadster HPC to J1772 connector but it was a 1-off project and I have no plans to make any more.

 

[TonyWilliams]

FYI Sun Country Highway has now switched over to 80A stations, and won't be stocking 70A anymore, so the timing on this is perfect.

The last CS-90 in stock at Clipper Creek was purchased by a Rav4 EV owner just a few weeks ago.

 

[pharma5]

80A fix is very cool news. I wonder if this spoils our 'something cool' surprise for 2014?

Feels like a fix to connect/charge on Model S systems...

 

[djp]

80A fix is very cool news. I wonder if this spoils our 'something cool' surprise for 2014?

Feels like a fix to connect/charge on Model S systems...

Ha - I'm going to be very disappointed if the "something cool" is a Model S HPWC to Roadster adapter.

 

[DrComputer]

Cool. I have an old Tesla HPC that I converted to a J1772 end instead of the Roadster connector. I purchased the cable with the J1772 connector directly from Clipper Creek. At the time they offered to also send me the programmer so I could increase the output of the HPC from 70A to 75A but said that my Roadster wouldn't charge if I did that. I assume that I can now do this if I get the firmware update on my Roadster. This will now allow me to charge the S at 75A while the Roadster would still be limited to 70A?

 

[dsm363]

Can't the Roadster charge at the full 80A?

 

[Dave EV]

The new CS-100 firmware is, from what I've heard, able to reduce the power the station reports to 90A through the push buttons on the front panel. I believe it's the Leaf that also has the 80A problem.

Did you really mean 90A there? I thought the CS-100 was always limited to 80A max since the J1772 is limited to 80A. Clipper Creek's model names are slightly confusing since the model names refer to the size of the circuit breaker that should protect the EVSE.

CS-100 = 80A
CS-90 = 72A
CS-80 = 64A
etc...

http://www.clippercreek.com/uploads/ClipperCreek%20CS%20Series%20Public%20EVSE(1).pdf

 

[djp]

Can't the Roadster charge at the full 80A?

We'll find out when the new firmware is released. The on-board charger was designed to work with the 70A HPC so they'll probably limit it to 70A to stay within the original design and to avoid new QA testing.

 

[Doug_G]

Sorry, I meant to say 70A.

FYI, the newer CS-100's can deliver 80A, but until recently the J cable they used was limited to 75A, so they were only delivering 75.

I'm pretty sure the Roadster will only pull 70A from a CS-100. On the bright side that is still much faster than what a Model S will do on a miles per hour basis.

 

[pharma5]

Ha - I'm going to be very disappointed if the "something cool" is a Model S HPWC to Roadster adapter.

I'm right with you on that one. I remember the heyday of speculation a mere two summers ago.

 

[hcsharp]

FYI, the newer CS-100's can deliver 80A, but until recently the J cable they used was limited to 75A, so they were only delivering 75.

I've been wondering about that. Do you know who makes the 80A J connector? ITT-Cannon made the 75A version. I haven't seen one of the 80A versions but I know EVLINK (Schneider) announced that they would be coming out with an 80A charger last winter.

 

[Doug_G]

No, I don't know who makes it. The cables are actually branded Clipper Creek.

 

[tomsax]

I've got two CS-100's on order. Sun Country told me they have newer firmware that deals with the Roadster bug, and apparently one other EV model that also had problems with these larger charging stations. Sounds like the issue is being addressed from both ends...

Clipper Creek has a variant of the CS-100 which they call the CS-100/80. It supports 80A charging but normally provides a 72A pilot signal, which the Roadster recognizes as valid. If you press the Start button twice, it switches the pilot signal to 80A to allow a Model S to charge at the full 80A. So, Model S owners have to know the secret handshake to get the full charge rate.

At Plug In 2013 last month, Clipper Creek President Dave Packard told me that they are currently only selling the CS-100/80 to Sun Country Highway. So, if you've ordered a CS-100 from a Clipper Creek distributor other than Sun Country Highway, you are probably not be getting the CS-100/80 with the dual charge modes.

The Nissan Leaf is the other car that doesn't recognize an 80A pilot signal as valid. I hoping Nissan will get that fixed soon so this whole crazy issue can be reduced to an obscure footnote in the history of the modern electric vehicle.

 

[brianman]

If you press the Start button twice, it switches the pilot signal to 80A to allow a Model S to charge at the full 80A. So, Model S owners have to know the secret handshake to get the full charge rate.

Thanks for the tip, Tom!

I find it somewhat surprising that they made the double-tap work for "older tech" rather than for "newer tech". Going forward, especially now with the Roadster fix, the majority will be wanting what is now "double tap" experience so they have "the wrong default".