For those in Norcal: How long does it take PG&E to approve a 200A service?

[holeydonut]

I've been waiting almost 2 months for PG&E to approve updating my house from 150A to 200A. I can't get my 8 kW array installed without the upgrade.

I feel like this is a rather normal request given all the people getting EV charging stations. Is this supposed to take weeks and weeks? What's the normal wait time to get sign off from PG&E?

They won't tell me what the hang-up is other than to just keep waiting. At this rate it'll be 2021.

 

[bakin1]

Can't offer much help, but I'm curious as to why you need to go to 200A. Is it a Tesla requirement? I'm in a similar position where Tesla asked me to update my pan

I've been waiting almost 2 months for PG&E to approve updating my house from 150A to 200A. I can't get my 8 kW array installed without the upgrade.

I feel like this is a rather normal request given all the people getting EV charging stations. Is this supposed to take weeks and weeks? What's the normal wait time to get sign off from PG&E?

They won't tell me what the hang-up is other than to just keep waiting. At this rate it'll be 2021.

Can't offer much help, but I'm curious as to why you need to go to 200A. Is it a Tesla requirement? I'm in a similar position where the Tesla engineering docs list a 200A panel, but I only have 100A service. Ideally, I'm just trying to replace my 125A panel with a similar one. I asked Tesla last week if 125A would work, still no response.

 

[holeydonut]

No, Tesla's cookie-cutter approach wouldn't work for me, so I went with Sunrun. But when I was in talks with Tesla they wanted me to go to a 200A as well. I guess it's pretty standard for PV + Battery installs.

I assumed Sunrun would have enough pull and process with PG&E to make some of these things a slam dunk. But I guess that's not the case.

 

[bakin1]

No, Tesla's cookie-cutter approach wouldn't work for me, so I went with Sunrun. But when I was in talks with Tesla they wanted me to go to a 200A as well. I guess it's pretty standard for PV + Battery installs.

I assumed Sunrun would have enough pull and process with PG&E to make some of these things a slam dunk. But I guess that's not the case.

oh ok. I think PWs are the reason. I'm just doing solar.

 

[SaveOurPlanet]

I assume Sunrun would have submitted the service and/or panel upgrade for you, why couldn't Sunrun give you the update? Do you have underground wire into your main service? I tried to get 200A upgrade when I setup home charging for my Model S 2 years ago and was told by the Tesla recommended electrician that PG&E service upgrade would take 3 to 6 months and will be very costly, so I just had a 30A NEMA socket instead of the Tesla Wall Connector. I assume it would be cheaper and faster if it is an overhead or drop wire. I have a 125A service and Tesla Energy came and checked everything but they never said I need to upgrade my panel, I am waiting for a 6.5 kW roof with 2 PW.

 

[holeydonut]

I assume Sunrun would have submitted the service and/or panel upgrade for you, why couldn't Sunrun give you the update? Do you have underground wire into your main service? I tried to get 200A upgrade when I setup home charging for my Model S 2 years ago and was told by the Tesla recommended electrician that PG&E service upgrade would take 3 to 6 months and will be very costly, so I just had a 30A NEMA socket instead of the Tesla Wall Connector. I assume it would be cheaper and faster if it is an overhead or drop wire. I have a 125A service and Tesla Energy came and checked everything but they never said I need to upgrade my panel, I am waiting for a 6.5 kW roof with 2 PW.

Sunrun submitted this application months ago and said they’re getting push back from PG&E and it’s going to take much longer than they thought. But they didn’t tell me what exactly was the problem.

My area is all underground power lines. But half of my neighbors have Teslas + Solar and gas upgrades to 200A service. They don’t remember this being an issue... but they also didn’t deal with the unending tragedy of 2020.

 

[Merrill]

I've been waiting almost 2 months for PG&E to approve updating my house from 150A to 200A. I can't get my 8 kW array installed without the upgrade.

I feel like this is a rather normal request given all the people getting EV charging stations. Is this supposed to take weeks and weeks? What's the normal wait time to get sign off from PG&E?

They won't tell me what the hang-up is other than to just keep waiting. At this rate it'll be 2021.

I need to replace my 40 year old 200 amp panel, PG&E has postponed the shut off of power so my electrician can do the replacement 3 times. Either for the fires, smoke or potential PSPS. Not a good time of year to have this done.

 

[wwhitney]

Do you have a proposed one-line diagram? Did Sunrun do a load calc?

Cheers, Wayne

 

[holeydonut]

Do you have a proposed one-line diagram? Did Sunrun do a load calc?

Cheers, Wayne

Sunrun and Tesla wouldn't give me the details other than "you need 200A"... The work order I signed simply reads:


Based on your solar design, visual inspection of your home, and Sunrun quality requirements, Sunrun has determined that additional
work needs to be completed prior to the installation of your solar energy system.

ITEM 1: Main Panel Upgrade (MPU)
ITEM 2: Service Feeder Upgrade

 

[mnsweeps]

You need permission from PG&E to upgrade a panel? I had a 200 amp panel with 200 amp main bus from 2003 when the house was build. Tesla asked me to upgrade to a 200 amp panel with 225 amp bus based on calculations and what L.A County permit inspector wanted. I called SCE and they removed the meter lock the next day.. My electrician upgraded panel as needed ..I called SCE after my final inspection passed and SCE guy came and locked the meter again.. It was so easy ..The whole process took like 8 working days.

 

[BrettS]

You need permission from PG&E to upgrade a panel? I had a 200 amp panel with 200 amp main bus from 2003 when the house was build. Tesla asked me to upgrade to a 200 amp panel with 225 amp bus based on calculations and what L.A County permit inspector wanted. I called SCE and they removed the meter lock the next day.. My electrician upgraded panel as needed ..I called SCE after my final inspection passed and SCE guy came and locked the meter again.. It was so easy ..The whole process took like 8 working days.

You need permission to upgrade the service, not the panel. (Although a panel upgrade is also required for a service upgrade).

 

[holeydonut]

You need permission from PG&E to upgrade a panel? I had a 200 amp panel with 200 amp main bus from 2003 when the house was build. Tesla asked me to upgrade to a 200 amp panel with 225 amp bus based on calculations and what L.A County permit inspector wanted. I called SCE and they removed the meter lock the next day.. My electrician upgraded panel as needed ..I called SCE after my final inspection passed and SCE guy came and locked the meter again.. It was so easy ..The whole process took like 8 working days.

Yeah that’s what my neighbors said about their upgrades... they said it was pretty easy and don’t understand why I’m being actively blocked now.

Maybe PG&E have read my rant threads on TMC and are making it a point to hit me with their red tape.

 

[sorka]

I've been waiting almost 2 months for PG&E to approve updating my house from 150A to 200A. I can't get my 8 kW array installed without the upgrade.

I feel like this is a rather normal request given all the people getting EV charging stations. Is this supposed to take weeks and weeks? What's the normal wait time to get sign off from PG&E?

They won't tell me what the hang-up is other than to just keep waiting. At this rate it'll be 2021.

It took about 3 week for them to approve my 200 amp service panel upgrade. I'm in Merced. The upgrade was done today. Solar and PW going in on Friday.

 

[SMAlset]

Yeah that’s what my neighbors said about their upgrades... they said it was pretty easy and don’t understand why I’m being actively blocked now.

Maybe PG&E have read my rant threads on TMC and are making it a point to hit me with their red tape.

So it’s not just Tesla Energy that you felt was giving you problems then. How much more was going with Sunrun costing you?

I wonder if all the wildfire damage, rebuilding of homes and reworking of PG&E’s lines to reduce areas of outages has the essential people tied up so you’re job is low priority since you have power at least.

 

[wwhitney]

I've been waiting almost 2 months for PG&E to approve updating my house from 150A to 200A. I can't get my 8 kW array installed without the upgrade.

The last sentence makes no sense. Where upgrading the service is problematic, it almost always can be designed around. And if you have a 150A service, the 120% rule would allow a 30A solar breaker, which is good enough for a 5.76 kW inverter. That would give you an acceptable 1.38 DC/AC ratio with a 8 kW array, or you could just omit a few panels and reduce the DC/AC ratio to 1.3 or 1.2.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Zorg]

Are you sure that they're not asking PG&E to upgrade your line? That takes months and will cost $10-20K.

 

[holeydonut]

Are you sure that they're not asking PG&E to upgrade your line? That takes months and will cost $10-20K.

Maybe this is the mixup... but no, I'm not asking PG&E to upgrade my line. All the homes in my subdivision were built within a year of each other and are pretty cookie cutter. After speaking with my adjacent neighbors, some had their homes upgraded to 200A service by PG&E when they bought their Teslas; or had Solar installed. They said it was not very expensive for this.

A few months ago Sunrun's PM said they "do this 200A service upgrade all the time and it's no big deal." Sunrun's work order also says this is a "zero cost" to me and part of the original bid.

I just wish Sunrun would let me talk to PG&E directly on this. It's like scenario in Office space where the Jump to Conclusions Mat guy is supposed to be the one that takes specs from the customers and relays to the engineers. It's clear to me the project managers employed by Sunrun don't know how to resolve an issue; they only know how to push paper and wait. But PG&E sucks, and they're probably sitting there with their thumbs up their bottoms. Which means Sunrun is sitting there doing nothing as well.

I don't know why Sunrun won't work in parallel and schedule the racking/panels/home-run and Battery/TEG mounting knowing they can't interconnect until the 200A service is live. I just need a picture of the hardware installed (but probably not working) before December 31 to get the Federal Tax Credit.

I have managed hundreds of projects in my career, and I have never missed a deadline or whiffed on my budgets/expectations. But the moment I have to let someone else take over like with this Solar+Battery thing, it all goes into a black hole and falls way behind schedule. It's maddening for me since I never miss my deadlines, and I hold others to that same standard.

My install has now hit 120 days since I signed a contract; and they promised five times this would not take longer than 120 days. And now they're just like ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ .

 

[holeydonut]

The last sentence makes no sense. Where upgrading the service is problematic, it almost always can be designed around. And if you have a 150A service, the 120% rule would allow a 30A solar breaker, which is good enough for a 5.76 kW inverter. That would give you an acceptable 1.38 DC/AC ratio with a 8 kW array, or you could just omit a few panels and reduce the DC/AC ratio to 1.3 or 1.2.

Cheers, Wayne

I left out the part that there are 3x Powerwalls on a partial home backup (I can't backup my ACs even with 3x Powerwall since I can't get soft starts on these Copeland units).

Sunrun uses Enphase IQ7+ that I think are 290 continuous AC output. The panels are 345 watt so this is already a ratio of 1.2 at peak. I don't know what maths their engineers did, but Sunrun unequivocally refuses to install without the 200A service. But Sunrun also thinks getting a 200A service is "easy" so I don't understand what is the blocker.

 

[Zorg]

Maybe this is the mixup... but no, I'm not asking PG&E to upgrade my line. All the homes in my subdivision were built within a year of each other and are pretty cookie cutter. After speaking with my adjacent neighbors, some had their homes upgraded to 200A service by PG&E when they bought their Teslas; or had Solar installed. They said it was not very expensive for this.

A few months ago Sunrun's PM said they "do this 200A service upgrade all the time and it's no big deal." Sunrun's work order also says this is a "zero cost" to me and part of the original bid.

I just wish Sunrun would let me talk to PG&E directly on this. It's like scenario in Office space where the Jump to Conclusions Mat guy is supposed to be the one that takes specs from the customers and relays to the engineers. It's clear to me the project managers employed by Sunrun don't know how to resolve an issue; they only know how to push paper and wait. But PG&E sucks, and they're probably sitting there with their thumbs up their bottoms. Which means Sunrun is sitting there doing nothing as well.

I don't know why Sunrun won't work in parallel and schedule the racking/panels/home-run and Battery/TEG mounting knowing they can't interconnect until the 200A service is live. I just need a picture of the hardware installed (but probably not working) before December 31 to get the Federal Tax Credit.

I have managed hundreds of projects in my career, and I have never missed a deadline or whiffed on my budgets/expectations. But the moment I have to let someone else take over like with this Solar+Battery thing, it all goes into a black hole and falls way behind schedule. It's maddening for me since I never miss my deadlines, and I hold others to that same standard.

My install has now hit 120 days since I signed a contract; and they promised five times this would not take longer than 120 days. And now they're just like ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ .

Interesting. I had my 100A upgraded and that took a few months just to get the plans from PG&E as they had to upgrade the neighborhood transformers (tract homes from the early 70s). Sounds like upgrading from 150 to 200A is not as big a deal where you are.

 

[BrettS]

I don't know why Sunrun won't work in parallel and schedule the racking/panels/home-run and Battery/TEG mounting knowing they can't interconnect until the 200A service is live.

I’m sure they don’t want to get into a situation where they have installed hardware on your house and you are refusing to pay because it’s not working. Obviously things should work out fine with the service upgrade, but if something happens and the upgrade takes much longer than expected or if the utility refuses the upgrade for some reason it could put them in a tough spot with labor spent and hardware installed on your house that could wind up being unusable.