Frameless windows opinions???

[eyedrop]

Was curious how many people enjoy having frameless windows/doors on their Model S, and how many could go without?

I've always appreciated a quiet cabin, especially since I drive 30k miles a year at 80mph average. My next car will be an LS or S Class style EV with frames around the windows, and better NVH characteristics.

I'm done with getting beat up by road trips, ironically in my full-size luxury sedan and can't wait to try the competition.

If only Tesla seperated or distincted future Model S to more luxury rather than focusing on silly lap times... Leave that to the kiddos with their little Model 3's....

 

[Simon_Emes]

Couldn't agree more. The Mercedes EQC is such a silent blessing, very smooth. If Tesla doesn't improve on those old school luxury features this will be my last.

However, have you tried the new Raven models? Supposed to be much quieter...

 

[Ande]

I could feel you post until .. EQC ???? Really ?
You should try that pathetic excuse for a half-assed attempt on an EV.
They did not bother to redesign the frame, so they waste a lot of space for the propeller shaft makes the puny battery placement much higher, making the trunk very small/useless.
The same frame as IC car, means it's front is not optimized for compression zones for crashes - nor does it even HAVE any frunk storage space.
Entertainments sucks badly, (phone based, no instant music as you enter the car.)

Finally - it is NOT very quiet, at least I did not think of it as quiet (but then my car is aftermarket soundproofed)
The performance was totally mediocre.
Autopilot ... once you have used Tesla's autopilot it is simply *NOTHING* compared.

I told the seller that "Mercedes will give Tesla's Autopilot its first real competition this year" was one of my reasons to test it when they had the VIP day, even the seller responded that I should not get my hopes up, as it is nothing like what I am used to.

 

[FatherTo1]

Perhaps that is another factor in why Mercedes decided to push the EQC back another year, into 2021, to make improvements and bring out a more competitive product, and especially in response to the mediocre range of the Taycan, eTron, and I-Pace.

I came from a Lexus LS 430/460 and don't mind the frameless windows, as it reminds me of the frameless windows in a 1995 ES 300 we used to have. I would prefer framed windows but the ES 300 was pretty quiet. As suggested earlier, try the new Raven S, it is both quieter and smoother riding. I felt, with proper Grand Touring tires, the Raven S rides 90% as smooth as our Lexus LS 460 over the same roads; the Raven suspension is that good. Someone else on the forum also felt their Raven rode 90% as well as their S Class. As for the frameless windows again, I just don't like my wife pushing on the glass to close the door but she's learned to break that habit.

 

[beatle]

I don't find the car to be loud. Not sure you can place the blame squarely on frameless windows either. Perhaps there are other cars that are quieter, but the MS is no convertible.

 

[Joelgjr]

as it reminds me of the frameless windows in a 1995 ES 300 we used to have. .

I had the 1992 ES300 with frameless windows and a 5 speed manual. They don’t make cars like that anymore. What a fantastic vehicle.

 

[Dithermaster]

I prefer frameless windows.

 

[Cheburashka]

Frameless windows look much nicer.

They are ok when done right. I've been in some Teslas where the wind noise around the seal is better than others.

The Model S is a noisy car though and the frameless windows surely don't help.

 

[Lorenzo Grilli]

Don’t mind the frameless but occasionally a pain in winter if forget to precondition car and the window/door handle jams

 

[Simon_Emes]

Not sure why your EQC experience wasn't good, mine was quite impressive. Yes, they should have and could have designed a real BEV, this is like the eGolf built on an old platform. Nonethess my ride was very quiet. Suspension smooth. performance ok, not P model like, but in v8 territory.

Took a friend with me today on the Autobahn who is driving a new 5 series and he thought the Model s had more wind and tire noise. Don't know why some cannot admit there are other brands who mange that better.

Anyways, the frame less glass - I love it, also liked it on my CLS.

 

[David29]

I prefer frameless windows.

Why? What benefit do they provide?

 

[David29]

My opinion is that the frameless windows on my 2015 Model S is the single worst design mistake that Tesla made on the car.
To me, they have no value -- I know that some cars use them to give the look of a coupe, but that only works when (a) all the windows are down, which is rarely true for me, and (b) when there is no B pillar. With the B pillar, the car does not and will not ever look like a coupe or convertible! So the frameless windows simply give no advantage that I can see.
The big disadvantage of the frameless windows is the extra complexity of the door latch and window lift mechanisms. This is amplified in winter (as mentioned above). Ice on the windows is more problematic than on regular windows, because failure to remove the ice can put you into a very bad situation, as I learned my first winter -- You may be able to pull the door open if the window is being held in place by ice, but you will not be able to close it!
Plus I am sure they add to wind noise and drafts because the glass simply cannot be sealed to the door frame as reliably and tightly as on a normal window.
Stupid, stupid design. And why they have continued this design on later cars (when they should have learned the lessons from the first few winters) is simply beyond me.

 

[David29]

I could feel you post until .. EQC ???? Really ?
You should try that pathetic excuse for a half-assed attempt on an EV.
They did not bother to redesign the frame, so they waste a lot of space for the propeller shaft makes the puny battery placement much higher, making the trunk very small/useless.
The same frame as IC car, means it's front is not optimized for compression zones for crashes - nor does it even HAVE any frunk storage space.
Entertainments sucks badly, (phone based, no instant music as you enter the car.)

Finally - it is NOT very quiet, at least I did not think of it as quiet (but then my car is aftermarket soundproofed)
The performance was totally mediocre.
Autopilot ... once you have used Tesla's autopilot it is simply *NOTHING* compared.

I told the seller that "Mercedes will give Tesla's Autopilot its first real competition this year" was one of my reasons to test it when they had the VIP day, even the seller responded that I should not get my hopes up, as it is nothing like what I am used to.

I commented on the frameless windows question separately -- see above.

As for the EQC, I am quite surprised by your comments. The reviews I saw were very positive for this car. Bjorn Nyland (who is a long-time Tesla fan, and has owned Models S, X and 3) had an EQC for a week and said more than once, "I love this car." He specifically praised the car's comfort and quiet. (He did show that it is less efficient that some comparable cars and charges less quickly than the E-Tron and latest teslas.) Also, my daughter recently got the GLC on which the EQC is supposedly based, and loves it. She previously had an E class, and said the GLC is quieter and more comfortable. So I was looking forward to trying the EQC. I'll be interested to see if and how it might evolve in the two years before it finally reaches the US.

 

[cab]

Not a fan either. I have to believe Tesla did this (on the 3 too) for both cost reasons and to give them wiggle room in, um, less than precise stampings and assembly. Unfortunately, I think they are just one piece in the overall NVH challenges Tesla has. I do think the newer cars are more quiet, but haven’t driven a Raven as of yet.

 

[tranzndance]

The only time I want frames is when I wish I could put seasonal reindeer antlers (and nose) on my car.

I find frameless is useful in tight spots where having the window go down offers more space to maneuver when the door is open. I have a narrow stucco carport.

 

[Chaserr]

Tesla used frameless windows for the same reason porsche and lamborghini do it, but not for the same end goal. It's not lap times you want from Tesla, but you do want the range and one aerodynamically turbulent seal is better than two for aero efficiency. Sports cars use that efficiency to get a little faster, teslas use it to go a little farther. It's probably not going to change on Tesla ever but mercedes might sacrifice range for luxury.

@tranzndance if you don't use the frunk you can close them in the hinge and they will hold up just fine. It takes a couple santas helpers to hold them in place when you close it or the flop loose

 

[tranzndance]

@tranzndance if you don't use the frunk you can close them in the hinge and they will hold up just fine. It takes a couple santas helpers to hold them in place when you close it or the flop loose

Thanks for the suggestion. I did some more research and it seems that I'd have to remove them for highway driving, which would be inconvenient if I needed help to set them up to use with the frunk, and that they could affect range. I ended up getting reindeer decals for the windows. I also got decals for Halloween. A neighbor said her kids appreciated our involvement with the bear in the window effort, so I wanted to make my home and car festive since the latter is parked out front.

 

[iqless]

Just like bigger wheels, frameless windows are just a cosmetic improvement that otherwise improve pretty much nothing you'd care about while decreasing the quality of your ride.

 

[SO16]

I prefer frames. Less chance of water seeping through when going through a car wash and having hard sprayers hit the windows.

 

[daktari]

Frameless save weight I guess.
But I prefer the frames with triple rubber strips and double isolated thick glass on the e-tron. Door sound better when closing it also.