Front end design of the Tesla Model 3

[eisbock]

It's my understanding that (in general) the rear end of a car has more impact on the overall aerodynamics of a vehicle than the front end. A vehicle with a sharp cut-off in the back creates a vacuum that works against the forward motion (i.e. increased drag). Getting a smooth airflow off the back is where people are spending most of their effort.

That's not to say that the front end and other aspects don't affect the aerodynamics, but those are more straightforward and "easier."

This is correct, that's where the whole "kammback" thing comes from. The S is slightly longer and flat at the end which kills its aerodynamics compared to the X/3. The S-like proportions of the 3 and the X-like back are what tie the 3 together aerodynamic-wise and will help it beat the S/X. It remains to be seen how much the front end affects the Cd.

 

[eisbock]

Important to remember that pic is from a fan, not tesla. The sensors have to be pointed forward not down though..

I would argue that pointing the nose down like that will actually increase drag vs reduce it. As a simply exercise, put your hand out of your window as you're driving parallel to the ground... now tilt your thumb-side downward.

Now tilt your thumb upward until it's pointing at the sky and you've got the 3 as it is designed now.

Kinda walked right into that one...

 

[JeffK]

Now tilt your thumb upward until it's pointing at the sky and you've got the 3 as it is designed now.

Kinda walked right into that one...

That's not true... the nose of the model 3 cuts parallel to the ground... see it's right in front parting the air in both directions, up and down (not just up):

Not to mention they've been testing in a wind tunnel and it's already going to be one of the lowest Cd's in a production car in history...

 

[eisbock]

That's not true... the nose of the model 3 cuts parallel to the ground... see it's right in front parting the air in both directions, up and down (not just up):

I... don't really understand what you're saying? Nothing is parallel about the Model 3.

The flat portion of the nose is perpendicular to the ground. It doesn't get any more right angle-y than this! What happens when wind hits a flat surface compared to a wedge (like the photoshop)?

Not to mention they've been testing in a wind tunnel and it's already going to be one of the lowest Cd's in a production car in history...

You set up an argument for why it's more aerodynamic, then you completely undermine that by saying "I'm sure Tesla knows what they're doing". Your argument should stand on its own without the need to add that in. That just tells me you're doubting what you said and are falling back on the whole "Tesla knows better" thing as evidence for your claims. The fact is, until we see some hard data, all we have to go off of is centuries of aerodynamic design and engineering, none of which suggest the front end is a more aerodynamic choice than something traditional like a Porsche.

I don't doubt Tesla knows what they're doing, but I think everybody is a little too focused on the effect the nose has on Cd (which is likely not as much as people think, thus giving Tesla some leeway in cosmetic design).

 

[Jayc]

And fortunately Tesla will not worry too much about what everyone is focussing on here but instead, they will attempt to get the best design outcome considering the degrees of freedom they have on the technical side. I for one trust in Tesla to deliver a good outcome. Certainly, there is nothing in their past designs to suspect otherwise.

 

[wallet.dat]

The Cd of the model S is 0.24, for the Model ≡ it may be 0.21, a difference of 12.5%. So that Model S nosecone is going to cost closer to 27 miles of range. No thanks.

Thank you kindly.

Is the Model S's Cd now 0.21 with the new refreshed front end? Does it get 27 more miles per charge now?

 

[sports4eva115]

only issue I have with the front end is that it doesn't look good with a license plate on it.... wondering anyone can chime in about not putting a front plate in cali?

 

[arjay]

only issue I have with the front end is that it doesn't look good with a license plate on it.... wondering anyone can chime in about not putting a front plate in cali?

Don't think we have a choice, and they are getting more insistent as time goes on.

 

[arjay]

The sensors have to be pointed forward not down though..

The render by Mihai75 is a suggestion illustrating the look of integrating the creases and the upper crease for a more horizontal aspect. There is no reason to think the sensors wouldn't be accommodated and the look still integrated by keeping the upper crease where it is and bringing the headlight creases to connect.

 

[Zoomit]

I hope they publish Cd numbers for the new S.

What's interesting is that the X has the same Cd as the old S. People will be quick to point out that a taller car should have a larger Cd, and so they'll think that the only reason the X was able to retain the same Cd is because of the front end change. The reality is that the shorter hood and bubbly back end are what brought the Cd down so far.

The 3 has those exact same features, but shorter and with a more prominent spoiler section on back, which is great for aerodynamics. Ignoring the front end, it is the most aerodynamically designed Tesla vehicle to date.

So, we don't really know how much the front end actually affects the Cd. The overall shape is far more important than minor creases and gouges. Yes, every millimeter counts, but it's not like the S nosecone vs stache vs I HAVE NO MOUTH AND I MUST SCREAM is the difference between .24 vs .23 vs .22.

Another way to look at it is "Why hasn't Tesla published the Cd for the new S?"

If it was lower because of the "more aerodynamic" front end, wouldn't you want to advertise that? It's probably pretty likely that the Cd hasn't changed at all, or if it did, it's a negligible amount in the hundredth or thousandth decimal place and rounding brings us back to .24 in the end. God forbid it went up because it's more flat instead of round, you sure as hell aren't gonna tell anybody that.

The front end makes a difference, but it's not night and day as most people here seem to think.

I see no reason why the mustached S would have a lower Cd than the original. This is even ignoring the nasty (aerodynamically) cavity behind the Tesla logo. The Cd is likely worse, but the effects are minor and it may still round to 0.24.

Is the Model S's Cd now 0.21 with the new refreshed front end? Does it get 27 more miles per charge now?

No way. I understand the increase range is from the updated EPA mileage testing. The refreshed front end didn't do anything to significantly help the Cd.

For subsonic vehicles, a parabolic shape is generally preferable as it extracts the least energy from the air to force it around the vehicle. The original nose was closer to a parabola. The refreshed nose is more of a blunt parabola.

 

[CalDreamin]

I think the reveal M3 prototypes are gorgeous. I much prefer the clean. honest M3 front end to the nosecone front end on om my 2013 MS

 

[eisbock]

I see no reason why the mustached S would have a lower Cd than the original. This is even ignoring the nasty (aerodynamically) cavity behind the Tesla logo. The Cd is likely worse, but the effects are minor and it may still round to 0.24.


No way. I understand the increase range is from the updated EPA mileage testing. The refreshed front end didn't do anything to significantly help the Cd.

For subsonic vehicles, a parabolic shape is generally preferable as it extracts the least energy from the air to force it around the vehicle. The original nose was closer to a parabola. The refreshed nose is more of a blunt parabola.

Finally. Somebody else on this damn board who isn't blindly parading around claiming the 3's front is aerodynamic. It felt like I was all alone and the only arguments I've seen were "I'm sure Tesla has a reason" or "Tesla designs aerodynamic cars... do you?"

 

[Zoomit]

Everything is a trade. They definitely could have made the nose more aerodynamic, but they also need to have recognizable styling and suitable pedestrian crash protection, etc. I'll bet their aero lead is ok with the nose, but salivating over getting rid of the side-view mirrors some day.

 

[Zaphod]

I... don't really understand what you're saying? Nothing is parallel about the Model 3.

The flat portion of the nose is perpendicular to the ground. It doesn't get any more right angle-y than this! What happens when wind hits a flat surface compared to a wedge (like the photoshop)?

It's really not perpendicular to the ground, at least to my eyes. It is ever so slightly pitched forward, maybe a few degrees. The lower part is also slightly pitched forward so ending with a subtle "V" profile, albeit inverted.

 

[ecarfan]

Is the Model S's Cd now 0.21 with the new refreshed front end? Does it get 27 more miles per charge now?

Tesla has not released a CD value for the refreshed S. Any figures you read other than the original CD value are speculation.

 

[Electric700]

...The Model 3 front end looks terrific aesthetically, and also undoubtedly has excellent aerodynamics.

Agreed!

 

[sickfox]

@JeffK - You cracked me up. Your comment is sooooo funny.

You've got to be senior age to link to AOL images.. The old batmobile is cool.

Might I introduce you to Google Images

@nexsuperne101 - That's ugly! What happens if you dont put the front plate?

In the UK, we have to display a white numberplate on the front, so a very rough approximation would look like this; This works with the front end, as it breaks up the solid single piece of one colour.

 

[AC238]

I don't understand why a car that does not need a grille should have one?

That said, Tesla is not infallible, reportedly Saleen's front end revision of the Tesla has lower drag. I think Brabus' modified Tesla model S is mostly cosmetic as far as the front splitter; the biggest change for Mansory's Tesla Model S is actually the rear end of it.

edit: the front end may be flat to comply with crash regulations with pedestrians and not anything to do with aerodynamics (see Pedestrian Protection | Euro NCAP , JNCAP｜Car Assessment - Pedestrian Head Protection Performance Tests , Improving Pedestrian Safety Through Vehicle Design -- Edmunds.com)

Buy a Volt.

I think they are looking for a Ford Fusion Energi / Ford Focus Electric , Fiat 500e, or Volvo V60 plug-in ... even the Honda Accord plug-in looks different to an extent from a normal Accord

 

[roblab]

only issue I have with the front end is that it doesn't look good with a license plate on it.... wondering anyone can chime in about not putting a front plate in cali?

Ding-dong!!

Don't put a front plate on your car in CA. Ten percent of all cars in CA do not have a front plate. The worst that might happen is a fix it ticket, and the law says it must be "affixed", which you can do with velcro tape. Then you take it off.

I got a ticket for no front plate about 20 years ago. I have not had a front plate since then. California needs to change the stupid law (made back when radar couldn't see cars and had to flash off the license plate). But the legislators are too busy making other silly laws.

 

[voyager]

For subsonic vehicles, a parabolic shape is generally preferable as it extracts the least energy from the air to force it around the vehicle. The original nose was closer to a parabola. The refreshed nose is more of a blunt parabola.

That makes the Mihai front-end suggestion a parabola versus the Model 3's original blunt parabola?