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Wiki FSD’s Earliest Adopters Still Waiting

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Not likely given the rest of that paragraph, taken from: Full Self-Driving Computer Installations:
They make it pretty clear that the subscription doesn't get free upgrades. And the way it is worded I would think that applies to the camera upgrades as well.
They have to make it so the subscription would not get the free upgrades otherwise people would abuse that just to get free hardware.
Certainly, the faster hardware would make normal AP be "better" and technically more responsive. Who wouldn't want more responsive hardware in questionable weather, intersections, higher highway speeds, etc, etc. I'm happy to have my FSD upgrade even tho I still don't have FSD yet (waiting on camera upgrade invite).
 
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Not likely given the rest of that paragraph, taken from: Full Self-Driving Computer Installations:



They make it pretty clear that the subscription doesn't get free upgrades. And the way it is worded I would think that applies to the camera upgrades as well.
This is my line of thinking too. I’m willing to pay. But they don’t have a quote on how much it costs or if it’s possible. I never realized the HW3 example because HW3 was included with my MCU2 upgrade irrespective of my FSD status (got HW3 without even being subbed to FSD). I really hope there’s an upgrade path because I can’t justify paying $12,000 for camera replacements lol. I’d prefer not to DIY anything at this time. Although there’s 1 person on the excel sheet that was a subscriber, have I missed something?
 
This is my line of thinking too. I’m willing to pay. But they don’t have a quote on how much it costs or if it’s possible. I never realized the HW3 example because HW3 was included with my MCU2 upgrade irrespective of my FSD status (got HW3 without even being subbed to FSD). I really hope there’s an upgrade path because I can’t justify paying $12,000 for camera replacements lol. I’d prefer not to DIY anything at this time. Although there’s 1 person on the excel sheet that was a subscriber, have I missed something?

That subscriber would be me. This is my story.

Here's my path:
April 2021: Bought my 2016 Model S used from Carvana, it still had the 2.0 computer and enhanced auto pilot on it
August 2021: I bought the infotainment upgrade for $2000 + tax for a total of just over $2100 (The info upgrade also included the FSD computer)
September 25th: I subscribed to FSD the moment it was available for $99 a month and pushed the "Request FSD opt-in" button
December 9th: Finally received invite to upgrade my cameras. Scheduled my appointment for Jan 4th, 2022
Jan 4th 2022: Had mobile techs come to my house and replace the cameras. They told me one of the cables was damaged so I needed to schedule a visit to service center to replace it and I wouldn't have autopilot (PS everything worked fine before they did their work)
Jan 10th 2022: Went to service center and had the cable fixed.

Since December I had been telling these guys they had the wrong triple camera but they didn't believe me.

Jan 12th 2022: They called and told me, yeah you were right we installed the wrong triple cam. We'll install the right one but we have to wait for it.
Jan 26th 2022: Finally got the correct triple cam installed

Opted out and back in a few times. I stayed subscribed for $99 a month the ENTIRE time since September and I still am subscribed.

June 4th 2022: Got the notification for FSD beta download 2022.12.3.20 with the big rollout. Safety score finally gone and FSD installed. Been using FSD Beta 10.12.2 since.
 
That subscriber would be me. This is my story.

Here's my path:
April 2021: Bought my 2016 Model S used from Carvana, it still had the 2.0 computer and enhanced auto pilot on it
August 2021: I bought the infotainment upgrade for $2000 + tax for a total of just over $2100 (The info upgrade also included the FSD computer)
September 25th: I subscribed to FSD the moment it was available for $99 a month and pushed the "Request FSD opt-in" button
December 9th: Finally received invite to upgrade my cameras. Scheduled my appointment for Jan 4th, 2022
Jan 4th 2022: Had mobile techs come to my house and replace the cameras. They told me one of the cables was damaged so I needed to schedule a visit to service center to replace it and I wouldn't have autopilot (PS everything worked fine before they did their work)
Jan 10th 2022: Went to service center and had the cable fixed.

Since December I had been telling these guys they had the wrong triple camera but they didn't believe me.

Jan 12th 2022: They called and told me, yeah you were right we installed the wrong triple cam. We'll install the right one but we have to wait for it.
Jan 26th 2022: Finally got the correct triple cam installed

Opted out and back in a few times. I stayed subscribed for $99 a month the ENTIRE time since September and I still am subscribed.

June 4th 2022: Got the notification for FSD beta download 2022.12.3.20 with the big rollout. Safety score finally gone and FSD installed. Been using FSD Beta 10.12.2 since.
Thanks, this makes me a little hopeful if you got an invite no questions asked when subbed to FSD.
 
They have to make it so the subscription would not get the free upgrades otherwise people would abuse that just to get free hardware.
But is it really "abuse" since "All Tesla Cars Being Produced (2016 and later) Now Have Full-Self Driving Hardware"???

Just to turn around 5 years later, and say "Just kidding...you actually have to pay for that hardware" I'm just sayin'...

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I like how quiet this thread has become since the June 4th big beta rollout lol

Hopefully those of you still waiting will get in soon! Looking forward to 10.13 improvements and V11 soon (maybe someday)
It’s been real quiet here. I check everyday for updates but this thread is loaded with crickets now. I’m hoping I had the correct cameras installed when I got my retrofit done. Once the roll out starts again I’ll try to hop on. I just have to take a drive on the freeway for a 100 miles round trip on NoAP and see if Elon wants to be my friend.

I wonder if everyone that got FSD Beta is enjoying it and their thoughts on if it was worth the wait and money.
 
It’s been real quiet here. I check everyday for updates but this thread is loaded with crickets now. I’m hoping I had the correct cameras installed when I got my retrofit done. Once the roll out starts again I’ll try to hop on. I just have to take a drive on the freeway for a 100 miles round trip on NoAP and see if Elon wants to be my friend.

I wonder if everyone that got FSD Beta is enjoying it and their thoughts on if it was worth the wait and money.
Why don't you use NoAP all the time so that you're ready?

As far as FSD Beta, it's much worse than I expected from the YouTube videos. The videos don't show how jerky it is. It doesn't do anything smoothly. It doesn't brake smoothly to come to a complete stop, it doesn't accelerate smoothly, and it definitely doesn't turn smoothly. It's worse than a teenage driver.
 
Why don't you use NoAP all the time so that you're ready?

As far as FSD Beta, it's much worse than I expected from the YouTube videos. The videos don't show how jerky it is. It doesn't do anything smoothly. It doesn't brake smoothly to come to a complete stop, it doesn't accelerate smoothly, and it definitely doesn't turn smoothly. It's worse than a teenage driver.
I would if I could. I just drive to work and back home most of time. It’s under a mile away and about 1/2 a mile are unmarked roads. When I double tap the stalk I get a notification that auto steer is unavailable, probably because there are no lines to guide the car. I know it sounds crazy that I don’t drive much lol.

How often do you use FSD Beta? It kind of sounds like it drives like summons with a lot of uncertainty.
 
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I would if I could. I just drive to work and back home most of time. It’s under a mile away and about 1/2 a mile are unmarked roads. When I double tap the stalk I get a notification that auto steer is unavailable, probably because there are no lines to guide the car. I know it sounds crazy that I don’t drive much lol.

How often do you use FSD Beta? It kind of sounds like it drives like summons with a lot of uncertainty.
I see, I don't drive much either since I work from home, but my wife uses our car daily. I use FSD Beta just about every time I drive. If I'm in a hurry I won't use it because it is not as competent as a human driver & thus it's slower. It can't anticipate which lane will be faster or slower to make good decisions like a human can. It can't see 3-4 blocks down the road to anticipate traffic flows or the timing of traffic lights like a human can. I also don't use it that much with other ppl in the car because most ppl don't like it. Both my wife & my dad have complained about how jerky it is when I've used FSD Beta with them as passengers.

The scariest part of FSD Beta for me is how it wants to run red lights. I haven't captured any video with my phone showing both the dash & the behavior, but I did take a video of the dash in a situation where it may do that. Do others find that the red traffic lights don't show as constantly illuminated, but rather they flash? When they're flashing like in the video below, if there's a point where all the lights go dark in the eyes of FSD Beta plus there's no traffic it will go right through the red light. I've had it try to do it more than a half dozen times. I've also had times where it's slowing down for a red light then suddenly accelerates because it stopped "seeing" the red light. That is very scary. Every time I've tried to get a video of it running a red light when it's doing the flashing display like below the light either turns green quickly, there's too much traffic for it to go, or I'm too slow getting my phone out & it tries to take off before I can start recording.
 
I see, I don't drive much either since I work from home, but my wife uses our car daily. I use FSD Beta just about every time I drive. If I'm in a hurry I won't use it because it is not as competent as a human driver & thus it's slower. It can't anticipate which lane will be faster or slower to make good decisions like a human can. It can't see 3-4 blocks down the road to anticipate traffic flows or the timing of traffic lights like a human can. I also don't use it that much with other ppl in the car because most ppl don't like it. Both my wife & my dad have complained about how jerky it is when I've used FSD Beta with them as passengers.

The scariest part of FSD Beta for me is how it wants to run red lights. I haven't captured any video with my phone showing both the dash & the behavior, but I did take a video of the dash in a situation where it may do that. Do others find that the red traffic lights don't show as constantly illuminated, but rather they flash? When they're flashing like in the video below, if there's a point where all the lights go dark in the eyes of FSD Beta plus there's no traffic it will go right through the red light. I've had it try to do it more than a half dozen times. I've also had times where it's slowing down for a red light then suddenly accelerates because it stopped "seeing" the red light. That is very scary. Every time I've tried to get a video of it running a red light when it's doing the flashing display like below the light either turns green quickly, there's too much traffic for it to go, or I'm too slow getting my phone out & it tries to take off before I can start recording.
I wonder if those are LED lights and they mess with the cameras refresh rate?

I have had no problem with traffic lights at all and i never see flash like that. (hit the report button when that happens, and maybe follow up with an email)

About the jerkiness, the most jerky is when doing left turns in parallel with other traffic, as it appears to be simultaneously adjusting for staying on the proper road path, while keeping it's distance with the adjacent car.

About the braking for red lights, it slows down too little with regen and then applies the brakes to slow to a stop.
You can tell it's using the brakes if you watch the energy circle... when I slow down it will regen more than -50kW, but when FSD is coming to a stop it will be less than -50 and constantly decreasing towards 0 while the car is actually more aggressively slowing down... therefore replacing regen with braking.

The scariest maneuvers are unprotected lefts.
I have been watching Chuck Cook's videos... and he would complain how close to the edge it would stop, but from the drone vids I was like, come on, it's clearly stopping before the edge.
Well, now that I am in the car with FSD, I'm like... gee/whiz why are you stopping so close to the edge?? Yeah, it stops suddenly right on the edge, while scaring the crap out of me and the cars coming from the other direction. I almost always step on the brake when approaching unprotected lefts with a lot of incoming traffic as it does make me very uncomfortable.

But when traffic is light, I let the car do it and it does a good job.

In downtown areas with a lot of pedestrian traffic, it's so cautious that I get honked a lot... but it is programmed to be safe and cautious around pedestrian, so that is not a bad thing.

Overall I enjoy it and (besides the jerkiness) I am amazed that my car can take me from A to B for the most part with none or minimal interventions.
 
Now that I've been playing with Beta a little over a month I can say YES I am so glad to finally have it. But like they guys above me yeah it definitely feels worse than the youtube videos make it seem.

Sometimes it really amazes me though. I have had several 0 intervention 0 disengagement drives around town and when that happens I am floored.


Biggest complaints from my personal experience:
-Constantly choosing wrong lane "to follow route". I'll have a right turn coming up and it wants to go to the far left lane.
-Waiting too long to get into a turn lane. Approaching a traffic light where I need to turn left and it won't get into the left turn lane until the last second even if the turn lane has a long section. Sometimes it waits so long it can't change lanes because there's too much traffic and people don't wanna be cut off.
-Acceleration through and out of a turn is unnecessarily fast without a lead car. Even after a month this still scares the *sugar* out of me when the car just jets off by itself mid turn lol
-Commitment issues. Sometimes the car will stop, check, and confidently move through an intersection. Sometimes though, it will start moving through, and even though its completely clear the car will abruptly stop in the middle of the intersection or turn for no reason and i'll have to hit the pedal to move it on.
-Jerkiness. Sometimes turns are incredibly smooth. Often lane changes can still be jerky and turning through intersections the wheel will bounce left and right a lot.


TLDR; still love beta - has a long way to go
1) lane choosing issues
2) random panic when moving through a turn or intersection for no reason
3) wheel jerkiness


P.S. Would love a Model X vs Model S fsd comparison on the same routes. Is Model X better due to the cameras sitting much higher and having better visibility?
 
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Now that I've been playing with Beta a little over a month I can say YES I am so glad to finally have it. But like they guys above me yeah it definitely feels worse than the youtube videos make it seem.

Sometimes it really amazes me though. I have had several 0 intervention 0 disengagement drives around town and when that happens I am floored.


Biggest complaints from my personal experience:
-Constantly choosing wrong lane "to follow route". I'll have a right turn coming up and it wants to go to the far left lane.
-Waiting too long to get into a turn lane. Approaching a traffic light where I need to turn left and it won't get into the left turn lane until the last second even if the turn lane has a long section. Sometimes it waits so long it can't change lanes because there's too much traffic and people don't wanna be cut off.
-Acceleration through and out of a turn is unnecessarily fast without a lead car. Even after a month this still scares the *sugar* out of me when the car just jets off by itself mid turn lol
-Commitment issues. Sometimes the car will stop, check, and confidently move through an intersection. Sometimes though, it will start moving through, and even though its completely clear the car will abruptly stop in the middle of the intersection or turn for no reason and i'll have to hit the pedal to move it on.
-Jerkiness. Sometimes turns are incredibly smooth. Often lane changes can still be jerky and turning through intersections the wheel will bounce left and right a lot.


TLDR; still love beta - has a long way to go
1) lane choosing issues
2) random panic when moving through a turn or intersection for no reason
3) wheel jerkiness


P.S. Would love a Model X vs Model S fsd comparison on the same routes. Is Model X better due to the cameras sitting much higher and having better visibility?
Your experience mirrors mine precisely. The hesitations for no obvious reasons and choosing the wrong lane are especially annoying.

Eager to see what the interminably delayed 10.13 brings!
 
Now that I've been playing with Beta a little over a month I can say YES I am so glad to finally have it. But like they guys above me yeah it definitely feels worse than the youtube videos make it seem.

Sometimes it really amazes me though. I have had several 0 intervention 0 disengagement drives around town and when that happens I am floored.


Biggest complaints from my personal experience:
-Constantly choosing wrong lane "to follow route". I'll have a right turn coming up and it wants to go to the far left lane.
-Waiting too long to get into a turn lane. Approaching a traffic light where I need to turn left and it won't get into the left turn lane until the last second even if the turn lane has a long section. Sometimes it waits so long it can't change lanes because there's too much traffic and people don't wanna be cut off.
-Acceleration through and out of a turn is unnecessarily fast without a lead car. Even after a month this still scares the *sugar* out of me when the car just jets off by itself mid turn lol
-Commitment issues. Sometimes the car will stop, check, and confidently move through an intersection. Sometimes though, it will start moving through, and even though its completely clear the car will abruptly stop in the middle of the intersection or turn for no reason and i'll have to hit the pedal to move it on.
-Jerkiness. Sometimes turns are incredibly smooth. Often lane changes can still be jerky and turning through intersections the wheel will bounce left and right a lot.


TLDR; still love beta - has a long way to go
1) lane choosing issues
2) random panic when moving through a turn or intersection for no reason
3) wheel jerkiness


P.S. Would love a Model X vs Model S fsd comparison on the same routes. Is Model X better due to the cameras sitting much higher and having better visibility?
Same, 100% spot on.

About the "-Jerkiness. Sometimes turns are incredibly smooth" I have noticed that close by traffic increases jerkiness. No/light traffic = very smooth
 
It’s been real quiet here. I check everyday for updates but this thread is loaded with crickets now....... Once the roll out starts again I’ll try to hop on.
Careful what you ask for. :) I guess the reason crickets here is because those people complaining for months about not getting it are now on other threads complaining that it is terrible and it does do what they were hoping it to do. 😁
 
I wonder if everyone that got FSD Beta is enjoying it and their thoughts on if it was worth the wait and money.
Opinions are all over the map. I've been waiting for 5 years, but I didn't have to pay anything for it. Personally, I think fsd is nowhere near worth $12k or the subscription price if I were to have to pay for it. I've been using it since last November. However, I really do like AP and NOA during my long interstate drives.
 
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Why don't you use NoAP all the time so that you're ready?

As far as FSD Beta, it's much worse than I expected from the YouTube videos. The videos don't show how jerky it is. It doesn't do anything smoothly. It doesn't brake smoothly to come to a complete stop, it doesn't accelerate smoothly, and it definitely doesn't turn smoothly. It's worse than a teenage driver.
Sounds like we have a similar experience and thought about it. I would go a bit further than saying it drives worse than a teenager. It drives worse than my teenager on his VERY FIRST attempt at learning to drive and during that drive he almost hit the mailbox and rang over the curb twice ! :eek:
 
It’s been real quiet here. I check everyday for updates but this thread is loaded with crickets now. I’m hoping I had the correct cameras installed when I got my retrofit done. Once the roll out starts again I’ll try to hop on. I just have to take a drive on the freeway for a 100 miles round trip on NoAP and see if Elon wants to be my friend.

I wonder if everyone that got FSD Beta is enjoying it and their thoughts on if it was worth the wait and money.