Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.You know, great question. Where on earth would that type of message come from? Who would it start with I wonder
You can install our site as a web app on your iOS device by utilizing the Add to Home Screen feature in Safari. Please see this thread for more details on this.
Note: This feature may not be available in some browsers.
Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.You know, great question. Where on earth would that type of message come from? Who would it start with I wonder
I agree with many of your points. I watched a Dirty Tesla video where he shared that during his normal drives (not recording for YouTube), he engages and disengages constantly in situations where he knows the car may not handle things properly (too close to the parked car, changing lanes when it shouldn't be, etc.). That's typically how I handle it as well. I try to use FSD Beta as much as possible, and report issues as best I can when they happen.I don't want to amplify people who are consistently negative (I prefer just straight facts rather than constant bashing), but I'll just go ahead and do it anyway...
I don't understand why people continuously think each revision of the beta is going to be a game changer, or "." Obviously each one will be incremental improvement, with additional bugs, possibly crippling ones. This isn't our first rodeo. There are not going to be any big step changes for the foreseeable future. Expectations should be low for every release - think about a 2-3 year timeframe until it's actually (maybe) decent - that would be fantastically fast progress! You didn't buy your car and FSD to only have it for 5 years, after all - you're keeping it for 10-15 years.
I also don't understand why some people are so sanguine about the beta the way it is. To be clear, many people here are quite matter-of-fact about its limitations. But it's bizarre to me that anyone thinks it's good. Anyway, this list of limitations you list should not be a surprise. I'm not sure what Tesla's end goal here is, and they're clearly a long way off from any goal they may have, but these limitations should not be a surprise, and maybe they're deliberate (I definitely don't think so, but it is possible that some of them are).
But it seems to me the best thing to do to get the beta to be better faster is to complain about all the ways in which it sucks, not say "this should be expected that it doesn't drive the way we do." It's not clear that Tesla listens directly to feedback from testers, but at least if the overall sentiment here is realistic and less sycophantic (note, this does not mean complaining about everything and bashing Tesla & Elon at every opportunity - it means sticking to describing the limitations - just the facts) maybe that will motivate Tesla to get their act together. Unfortunately Elon seems stuck in an echo chamber (I think the algorithm fooled him somehow; he may need to adjust his settings), so it's not clear whether it will help. Anyway, it should not feel like the car is under computer control!
Also, reminder to users: the more interventions the better. Intervene! Override that accelerator! Don't let it suck and suffer; put it out of its misery and take pride in intervening BEFORE it screws up, seamlessly - that is how success is measured. No one should be able to tell that you are using FSDb (b). It's not clear whether it will help progress in any way, since this is Tesla, but it is undoubtedly better than not intervening.
Anyway, I'm holding off on installing this one for now; giving it some time to brew. After a couple days it should be pretty clear whether it is safe to install.
What is your definition of "good"? Based on your posts, I would guess that you consider "good" to be FSD Beta performing how a human would drive, with 0 interventions and 0 disengagements.
now my car can drive me around town with little intervention on my part. I choose to find that amazing.
I don’t want to feel g-forces too much. But it is generally change in g-forces that is the problem. It’s possible to drive quite briskly but still have it be very pleasant. Not the case right now. I definitely want a gentle and very brisk and confident drive, which is not at all what we have right now; it is one of the biggest issues I have (this is what prevents it from being used with others in the car).Others prefer a more gentle drive and don't want to feel g-forces as the car moves around
I didn’t call it bad, at least not very recently, that I can recall. In the past I have described certain aspects of the beta as “garbage,” though, lol. Anyway, such statements are not static assessments. And specificity is good with such assessments; blanket “bad” statements don’t provide much value.It's unfair to call the Beta "bad" just because it's not ready to come out of beta and be released with 0 faults.
Agreed, and that's something that will get dialed-in at some point. Early in the Beta, the car was very mild with acceleration, and I recall thinking it's too mild and needs to get moving quicker - I'm pissing off the people behind me. Recent updates have the car "jumping off the line", which feels uncomfortable when you're not expecting it, but makes the people behind you happier. It's like we're passengers (even though we're behind the wheel) in someone else's car and they drive "crazy" (we all have friends like that - LOL). I'm pretty confident they'll get it "just right" at some point in the process.I don’t want to feel g-forces too much. But it is generally change in g-forces that is the problem. It’s possible to drive quite briskly but still have it be very pleasant. Not the case right now. I definitely want a gentle and very brisk and confident drive, which is not at all what we have right now; it is one of the biggest issues I have (this is what prevents it from being used with others in the car).
The beauty of a free-market. In the end, all our efforts may just end up being an example to others. We may never get the end product we want with Tesla, but because of us other manufacturers may achieve it. But we still helped make it possible, and a point of pride.It is an amazing technological feat - part of what is nice about being in the beta is seeing the abilities and limitations of this particular system - but that doesn’t mean it is useful and in the end the accomplishment is/will be judged relative to other offerings.
Pick up some garlic stuffed olives for me, would you?Downloading mine, and getting ready to test run to Costco for some shrimp scampi, Greek yogurt and pineapples. Should I get a rotiserrie chicken?
exactly this. I also don't understand the constant negativity out certain folks and that is their prerogative.I don't want to amplify people who are consistently negative (I prefer just straight facts rather than constant bashing), but I'll just go ahead and do it anyway...
I don't understand why people continuously think each revision of the beta is going to be a game changer, or "." Obviously each one will be incremental improvement, with additional bugs, possibly crippling ones. This isn't our first rodeo. There are not going to be any big step changes for the foreseeable future. Expectations should be low for every release - think about a 2-3 year timeframe until it's actually (maybe) decent - that would be fantastically fast progress! You didn't buy your car and FSD to only have it for 5 years, after all - you're keeping it for 10-15 years.
I also don't understand why some people are so sanguine about the beta the way it is. To be clear, many people here are quite matter-of-fact about its limitations. But it's bizarre to me that anyone thinks it's good. Anyway, this list of limitations you list should not be a surprise. I'm not sure what Tesla's end goal here is, and they're clearly a long way off from any goal they may have, but these limitations should not be a surprise, and maybe they're deliberate (I definitely don't think so, but it is possible that some of them are).
But it seems to me the best thing to do to get the beta to be better faster is to complain about all the ways in which it sucks, not say "this should be expected that it doesn't drive the way we do." It's not clear that Tesla listens directly to feedback from testers, but at least if the overall sentiment here is realistic and less sycophantic (note, this does not mean complaining about everything and bashing Tesla & Elon at every opportunity - it means sticking to describing the limitations - just the facts) maybe that will motivate Tesla to get their act together. Unfortunately Elon seems stuck in an echo chamber (I think the algorithm fooled him somehow; he may need to adjust his settings), so it's not clear whether it will help. Anyway, it should not feel like the car is under computer control!
Also, reminder to users: the more interventions the better. Intervene! Override that accelerator! Don't let it suck and suffer; put it out of its misery and take pride in intervening BEFORE it screws up, seamlessly - that is how success is measured. No one should be able to tell that you are using FSDb (b). It's not clear whether it will help progress in any way, since this is Tesla, but it is undoubtedly better than not intervening.
Anyway, I'm holding off on installing this one for now; giving it some time to brew. After a couple days it should be pretty clear whether it is safe to install.
Had exact same issue on first drive today. Seems to have gone away now. Never had a strike till this release. No amount of torque on the wheel would stop the nagSo I’m getting red arms of death every 30 seconds or so, no matter how much I torque the yoke. Pretty much have to disengage and re-engage for them to go away. Anything else results in this
View attachment 811306
I have never had a single strike before. Tried a restart. This issue makes this FSD release virtually useless
We just got this for the first time last week, when we were on 2022.4.Iforget, which we'd been on for aaaaages. It was on the freeway, so not technically FSD, just old-fashioned Autopilot. As soon as I double-flipped, it screamed at me to take over. Instantaneous. We thought maybe bug splats on the cameras. Then the next day I tried again in a similar spot. It settled into AP, and then maybe 10 seconds later it did the red wheel thing.the screaming red wheel of death came up
Many there companies have faced this issue .. how to get (necessary) feedback from testers without getting overwhelmed. Microsoft used to do this using "MVP" (most valuable professionals) who were not MS employees but volunteers who participated in forums like this but would also have access to internal MS reporting so that they could give early feedback of issues that users were reporting .. essentially acting as triage agents for the beta teams in MS. Worked pretty well all round.If only there existed an official Tesla FSD Beta Testers forum that had people from Tesla's FSD team participating in it....
But *were* they counted as strikes? Did they appear as that on the Autopilot screen?We just got this for the first time last week, when we were on 2022.4.Iforget, which we'd been on for aaaaages. It was on the freeway, so not technically FSD, just old-fashioned Autopilot. As soon as I double-flipped, it screamed at me to take over. Instantaneous. We thought maybe bug splats on the cameras. Then the next day I tried again in a similar spot. It settled into AP, and then maybe 10 seconds later it did the red wheel thing.
It hadn't occurred to me that these might be counted as strikes against us. Not fair!
Today we upgraded to 2022.12.3.20. We'll see......
I noticed this today also, the cameras seemed to pick up the reflection of my car in the car to my left, and project that as an additional car to the left of THAT car (which put that phantom car pointed the wrong way into oncoming traffic).Yeah. Was pretty obvious from the influencer videos that there were a lot of issues with object identification in this version of beta. This is a bit different than what was in those videos, but still similar.
I’m surprised the car hasn’t shown you the reflection before, but maybe their changes to the NN make this possible at this angle now.
I'd forgotten I could look. Thanks! I just checked. "This car has no such incidents" or some such message. Yay. Still, they were alarming events.But *were* they counted as strikes? Did they appear as that on the Autopilot screen?
This happened on an earlier release (10.8.somthing if I recall) .. it was some part of the ADAS stack hard-crashing. Nasty thing to happen, of course, but at least it shows that Tesla have various very reactive fallbacks for such emergency scenarios.I'd forgotten I could look. Thanks! I just checked. "This car has no such incidents" or some such message. Yay. Still, they were alarming events.