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FSD Beta 10.69

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I've got mixed feelings about your comment. It comes down to language; that is, the ability for people to communicate with each other.

As far as I can tell, for each and every specialty in human endeavor there appears to be a specialized language. Lawyers have their own, to the point where, in a bog-standard contract, the first couple of paragraphs are given over to definitions of what some of the words to follow mean. And that's just the words that aren't already in standard use by lawyers; from time to time, there are court decisions (usually by appeals courts and sometimes by SCOTUS) where they literally start hunting up word definitions in $RANDOM dictionaries.

Beyond that, take sailors: the language used for sailing ships has its own grammar and word definitions dating back centuries. Sheets, lines, ropes, left and right and port and starboard (both used, with specific grammar). For that matter, the people who run railroads also have their specialized language, to the point of not being understandable at all by mere mortals not involved in the business.

Why does this happen? Because people invent linguistic short-cuts so they don't have to try and explain which rope/lever/concept in excruciating detail every time they mention a topic. Once one has done that, then that short-cut gets used to explain other short-cuts, and the whole process snowballs. It can and does get to the point where word definitions are completely made up out of previous short-cuts. It may look (and be) ugly, but it means that quite complex ideas can be batted around faster than a shuttlecock in badminton.

I'm a EE; at one time I was part of a group that was building a honking big communications system, there were roughly a hundred of us, hardware and software, and we had to discuss the ins and outs of the system as we designed it. I joked at the time that, "If you're not inventing an acronym a day you're not working!" And, yeah, our conversations in the middle of all this got pretty obtuse. But the definitions of the words we were inventing, or the words that were in vaguely common use whose definitions we were changing on the fly, were pretty blamed exact, as grammar terms tend to be, and what was a noun, verb, adverb, and so on were pretty much set in stone. (By the by: Physicists and mathematicians are famous for this. The entire Greek alphabet, full of innocent little letters minding their own business, has been hijacked for quite complex ideas. Chi-analysis, anyone?)

The problem crops up when one tries to unroll all these complex terms and lingo into the common language. A single sentence unrolled into simple, non-jargon words, might take up a whole page; a page full of these terms couple easily take up a chapter, and so on.

I swear, at least a third of undergraduate EE is learning concepts, learning the lingo, and figuring out how to manipulate those concepts with the lingo so learned. People who think that engineers have lousy grammar and writing skills had better think again: It's not a nicety, it's a requirement.

It's pretty clear by now that the AI guys sweating the details of FSDb walked into the project with their own lingo, a lot of it probably learned in college, and probably a lot more learned on the job. And, to my eye at least, a lot of what they're doing over there appears to have a flavor of pure research: They're inventing concepts left, right, and center, with the lingo to manipulate those concepts as they go.

There's a quote I read, once, from some professor or other, who said, "If you can't explain your ideas in single or double-syllable words, then you don't understand what you're talking about." Ayup; good point. But that comes from somebody whose job is explaining concepts and ideas to the ignorant. (Note: Not stupid, just ignorant.) It takes a certain mindset and practice to take complicated ideas and distill them down to levels where the hoi polloi can follow. My father, who was actually a college professor and dean, was death on making durn sure that people who were researchers had to teach undergraduate courses for sure, and graduate courses as a maybe: His opinion that if you didn't teach and lecture, then you got worse at researching, because you got worse at the fundamentals and lost contact. But, again, he was riding herd on people paid to teach, not necessarily on those who had to invent at high speed.

Which brings us back to the people writing those release notes. There is a species of STEM called, "Tech writers" who are trained in that ability to break complex ideas down to simple ones. Dunno if Tesla employs those; probably, just so they can bring new people up to speed. But the in-house audience are people fresh out of college with their new-found lingo built in. Given the newness of the AI and tech built into FSDb, they're probably not writing for the public, especially as concepts and ideas change over time.

And that's probably the point. It would probably take serious time and effort to break what they're talking about in the release notes to the point where a person with a high-school vocabulary could follow what they're talking about. And what would you rather have? Understandable release notes, or FSDb as fast as possible?

Me, I'd rather have the FSDb. And the release notes are, well, an education in process. I've already been corrected by forum members a couple of times when I spoke about what looked like Standard English words, but had been redefined as FSDb AI Lingo.

Hang on for the ride 😀.
This was the longest post, (by far), that I’ve read and went all the way to the last word. You got my attention and kept it. (not a small feat)

SQUIRRL!

Well done.
 
Checked software this morning and 10.69.25.1 downloaded. I guess Tesla has thrown in the towel for getting 11.x past the employee stage before the end of the year.

Sad. But, reflecting back over the year, FSDb has come a long way from jerking around simple turns and not knowing how to take it's turn at a stop sign. Still a long way to go, so may as well enjoy the journey.

Tomorrow's a new beginning. Maybe next month we'll see 11.x.
I’m so frustrated with this last FSDb iteration I rarely use it lately. The bloody turn signals have pushed me over the edge. I know it’s a small thing, but I AM SO TIRED of getting flipped off.
 
I love that they proclaim their omniscience even when the actual data shows otherwise.
Currently TeslaFi shows 82% of cars getting the latest release are existing FSDb cars and over 68% of all cars are still on the 44.25 branch.

[edit]
Just checked - only 6% of cars are on the 44.30.5 release. Accuracy is not their strong point. :rolleyes:
 
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Ever look at the release notes for any google app on an Android phone? "Bug fixes and performance improvements." Very rarely anything else. Many other app makers have followed suit.

The nice thing about Tesla's release notes is that they do have details. If you don't understand it, there are youtube videos that try to interpret them in layman's terms.
I had the same thought. I don’t understand everything in the release notes but it gives me an idea, and at least it gives more detail than a generic statement like “big performance improvements.”

The other thing that I get from the notes is how they’ve changed their programming approach.
 
Just finished installing and the app definitely shows only the regular release notes without the FSD parts.
At least you will be happy @mjwojtukiewicz , first thing the release notes now shows - "Minor bug fixes and improvements" :D

One minor annoying thing though, it reset the Apple Music creds
oh boy oh boy oh boy. From the ridiculous to the sublime
 
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A little bit like the "winning a race" paradox. First you run ½ the distance. Then you run ½ that distance. Next you run ½ that distance, then you run ½............ So you can never finish.
So if I wake up late and I'm racing to work, and only hit half of the trees on the way, can I still party tonight like it's 1069? Byzantine's beeswax?

Asking for a friend.........
 
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Just took another FSDb drive to my son's house. Turns remain the same (i.e., touching, crossing centerline), but a new issue appeared this time - Coming out of a left turn, about 200 feet ahead there was another left turn to make.... the car exited the first left and sped up quickly to the speed limit of 45 and then slammed the brakes hard coming into the next left turn. Thankfully, there wasn't any oncoming traffic as I'm not sure what would have happened. Junk, remains junk.


@WilliamG
 
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Just took another FSDb drive to my son's house. Turns remain the same (i.e., touching, crossing centerline), but a new issue appeared this time - Coming out of a left turn, about 200 feet ahead there was another left turn to make.... the car exist the first left and sped up quickly to the speed limit of 45 and then slammed the brakes hard coming into the next left turn. Thankfully, there wasn't any oncoming traffic as I'm not sure what would have happened. Junk, remains junk.
Fred Sanford would agree with you!
 
Just drove a short distance (17 miles) on 10.69.25.1. There were no big differences. I did however let the car stay in the left lane with a up coming right turn, in a short distance, and a car right beside me in the right lane (blue car) to see how my car would handle the situation (a car a short distance ahead as well). It handled the situation very well, slowing slightly to allow for a safe lane change behind the car to the right and getting into the right turn lane in plenty of time.
 
Regarding the release notes and how technical they are, I feel like an important point is being missed here about about why they do this.

Tesla engineers write the release notes before the release goes out and gets widely tested. Obviously, they are of limited use to end users that want to know in their actual driving what will be better, is the car more reliable now, where are there changes, etc. I get that and it's a valid complaint.

The problem is you can't answer those higher level questions before collecting data about the actual performance of the system. Part of the point of having such a large group of testers is Tesla can make very specific change (say, increasing the training data set for lane topology perception in snowy conditions), do some initial testing to look for obvious safety issues, ship it to 100k+ cars, and look for improvements at scale in the telemetry they get back.

Maybe the change makes 1% of left turns less jerky; maybe it makes 50% of intersections smoother. I would be really hard to predict precisely how the average user would actually experience these changes - plus it can depend so much on your local road conditions. If this were easy, they'd just tell us and they wouldn't even need a big real world test group.

That's why Tesla gives us a change log of what they changed and their intent with it. It's either that, or vague "Bug fixes and improvements". They don't tell us the impact of those changes, but plenty of Youtubers do if that's what you're interested in.
 
It handled the situation very well, slowing slightly to allow for a safe lane change behind the car to the right and getting into the right turn lane in plenty of time.
As an FSDb user since June 2022, one of my "surely they can do better" gripes has been the failure to use throttle management to gain position for needed lane changes. Just in the last release or two I've actually seen it ease up in speed to use a gap behind an otherwise conflict car at least twice (vs. never before). There have been lots of other improvements, some far more important, but this is one clear indication that they are pressing forward on a broad front.
 
I've actually seen it ease up in speed to use a gap behind an otherwise conflict car at least twice

Yeah it can do that fairly well. I wish it could speed up too, but I've only seen it slow down to align with a gap.

Lane changes are very subjective, so it's definitely not perfect. For example there's a (pretty low) limit to how much I'm happy slowing down in the left lane to get over for a right turn; I'll prioritize driving politely over making my turn.