FSD Beta and Snow

[johnmodely]

So after a few snow drives in FSD Beta 10.8.1 with the recent storms in Northeast seems like beta has zero training/logic for snow/icy conditions. Another sad side effect of a cali/texas car company making cars for worldwide conditions but assuming everyone drives in 70 degree whether 24/7.

Pretty sure Beta currently does not compute whether there is snow on the ground or not, its pretty impressive on how it can handle visualizations/surroundings with white snow everywhere, but driving dynamics do not take this into account. For example on turns the same type of acceleration/braking is used causing the car to actually lose traction (had a few fishtail experiences where I had to take over). What's interesting is that there also seems to be no logic for when the car loses traction either (ie kept acceleration to try and plow through the turn until I disengaged).

Northern Beta testers have similar experiences in snow/icy conditions? This is just another layer that FSD needs to overcome and shows how far away we still are unfortunately.

 

[Chisale]

FSD can just barely manage driving under perfect road conditions, perfect lighting and hardly any other cars around. There's no way I would even remotely consider turning it if it was even wet out. Much less icy. Yes, a couple years ago I said wide spread level 4 driving was ten years away (at least) and people just laughed and laughed at me.

 

[aronth5]

So after a few snow drives in FSD Beta 10.8.1 with the recent storms in Northeast seems like beta has zero training/logic for snow/icy conditions. Another sad side effect of a cali/texas car company making cars for worldwide conditions but assuming everyone drives in 70 degree whether 24/7.

Pretty sure Beta currently does not compute whether there is snow on the ground or not, its pretty impressive on how it can handle visualizations/surroundings with white snow everywhere, but driving dynamics do not take this into account. For example on turns the same type of acceleration/braking is used causing the car to actually lose traction (had a few fishtail experiences where I had to take over). What's interesting is that there also seems to be no logic for when the car loses traction either (ie kept acceleration to try and plow through the turn until I disengaged).

Northern Beta testers have similar experiences in snow/icy conditions? This is just another layer that FSD needs to overcome and shows how far away we still are unfortunately.

FSD and snowy roads just don't play together. My opinion has always been don't expect FSD to support this type of driving for several more years and don't expect anything more until then. The number of countless edge cases when it's actively snowing and snow/ice has built up on the roads just means stay home or drive yourself. I'm not bothered by this since I never assumed it would handle snow/ice anyway. Oh and wet snow and ice on the cameras still needs to be properly addressed.

 

[nvx1977]

So after a few snow drives in FSD Beta 10.8.1 with the recent storms in Northeast seems like beta has zero training/logic for snow/icy conditions. Another sad side effect of a cali/texas car company making cars for worldwide conditions but assuming everyone drives in 70 degree whether 24/7.

Pretty sure Beta currently does not compute whether there is snow on the ground or not, its pretty impressive on how it can handle visualizations/surroundings with white snow everywhere, but driving dynamics do not take this into account. For example on turns the same type of acceleration/braking is used causing the car to actually lose traction (had a few fishtail experiences where I had to take over). What's interesting is that there also seems to be no logic for when the car loses traction either (ie kept acceleration to try and plow through the turn until I disengaged).

Northern Beta testers have similar experiences in snow/icy conditions? This is just another layer that FSD needs to overcome and shows how far away we still are unfortunately.

I had similar experience testing in snow. Doesn't seem like it's a priority for FSD, given it struggles plenty without snow.

Also, it snows plenty in California. If Tesla assumed we all drive in 70F weather, then why have logic to change regen when it's cold?

 

[qdeathstar]

I’m not sure why you thought it would work in snow.

 

[johnmodely]

I’m not sure why you thought it would work in snow.

Uhh because we were promised robo taxis two years ago…lol

 

[qdeathstar]

Uhh because we were promised robo taxis two years ago…lol

 

[Reddy Kilowatt]

I've been pushing it in the snow. First when the heavy snow is falling the sensors quickly fail when covered and that is the end of FSD for the trip. I do put the car into Chill mode so I don't loose traction, I'll also reduce the speed below the posted limit. (I'm trying to set the driving dynamic to match how I would be driving in the situation)

After the storm the FSD has been working pretty good even on some covered roads. I did the same with AP and covered roads years ago. I'm not going to push the limits. I'm not going to crash my car trying either. I have my hands on the wheel ready to take over in a heartbeat, and do.

Once the streets are cleared the one thing I really notice is the car appears to treat the snow banks as the new curb line. Say if the plow has only cleared one area it centers its self on that path. I can see it tends to center on what is black top. (same as driving on a narrow country road) I had an example where the turn lane was not cleared but the roadway was. it stayed on the roadway then turned right into my parking lot which was clear, it didn't even try to enter the turn lane. If a plow cuts a intersection side street off and leaves mounts the car will balk. I hit the gas pedal if I don't feel its an issue driving through, otherwise I might drive around.

I've driven about 1000 miles with snow visible on 10.8 and 10.8.1. Unfortunately I got delayed Sunday evening and got caught in the mountains during the storm. No FSD on that trip, I didn't even try. I didn't even see another car for 20 miles. it was Ice with snow on top, very bad but the car drove good at a greatly reduced speed.

 

[gcsmoore1]

I have been using FSD beta for a few weeks now. Over Christmas weekend we got a foot of snow then heavy rain here in Fairbanks Alaska.
So conditions are snow everywhere and thick ice on roads with pot holes covering every expansion crack in the road.
My FSD performs remarkably well despite these conditions.
That's not to say it's perfect.
I likes to put its tires in the center drift left by overworked plows.
It also thinks the vertical ice berm is nothing to worry about and will drive too close to the ice wall.
It also drives slower than I would and needs help occasionally on turns.
Generally I'm surprised how well it does, and am looking forward to haw it works when we can see the roads.

 

[aronth5]

I've been pushing it in the snow. First when the heavy snow is falling the sensors quickly fail when covered and that is the end of FSD for the trip. I do put the car into Chill mode so I don't loose traction, I'll also reduce the speed below the posted limit. (I'm trying to set the driving dynamic to match how I would be driving in the situation)

After the storm the FSD has been working pretty good even on some covered roads. I did the same with AP and covered roads years ago. I'm not going to push the limits. I'm not going to crash my car trying either. I have my hands on the wheel ready to take over in a heartbeat, and do.

Once the streets are cleared the one thing I really notice is the car appears to treat the snow banks as the new curb line. Say if the plow has only cleared one area it centers its self on that path. I can see it tends to center on what is black top. (same as driving on a narrow country road) I had an example where the turn lane was not cleared but the roadway was. it stayed on the roadway then turned right into my parking lot which was clear, it didn't even try to enter the turn lane. If a plow cuts a intersection side street off and leaves mounts the car will balk. I hit the gas pedal if I don't feel its an issue driving through, otherwise I might drive around.

I've driven about 1000 miles with snow visible on 10.8 and 10.8.1. Unfortunately I got delayed Sunday evening and got caught in the mountains during the storm. No FSD on that trip, I didn't even try. I didn't even see another car for 20 miles. it was Ice with snow on top, very bad but the car drove good at a greatly reduced speed.

So is it fair to say that during an active snow/ice storm FSD is not safe to use or is that too harsh a statement?

 

[ThomasD]

So much for self driving cars on snowy roads. How does it handle the wet salt and sand spray from other cars? Do the sensors get too dirty to function? The neighborhood I live in doesn't get cleared in winter. The narrow roads near me only get plowed a few days after it snows

 

[nvx1977]

So much for self driving cars on snowy roads. How does it handle the wet salt and sand spray from other cars? Do the sensors get too dirty to function? The neighborhood I live in doesn't get cleared in winter. The narrow roads near me only get plowed a few days after it snows

the rear camera can get pretty dirty. I've had zero issues with the rest.

 

[Reddy Kilowatt]

So is it fair to say that during an active snow/ice storm FSD is not safe to use or is that too harsh a statement?

I would add the word “heavy” snow storm. During mild events wasn’t an issue. The main issue was the bumper sensors were completely covered over while driving. In the clips I saved the cameras were fine, except the rear one.

 

[k2ev]

Can FSD really work on snowy roads? Where I am it wont be able to see any lanes in winter

 

[Yelobird]

Can FSD really work on snowy roads? Where I am it wont be able to see any lanes in winter

In my area Chicago it disables and says not able to use due to weather and site