FSD Beta v11.x

JHCCAZ · May 23, 2023

Tronguy said:
Suspect that once all or most of the newbies are in, they'll probably let us old farts in so we can get whatever additional bells and whistles are in the 2023.12.X release.

My suspicion is that whenever some SW types are gluing large hunks of software together, Bugs Will Be Found.

Ha. Back in the day when in my Freshman year in Engineering, we were all forced into our very first programming class. In FORTRAN. (Should note: Unix and C were very, very new at the time and not seeing widespread use.) The prof made a point of telling all us newbies the below:

General rule: Write a 300 line program, not including whitespace and comments. 'Way more than half of the lines will have errors in them. Typos, everything else.

Before compiling, run Lint or the equivalent. This knocks the error rate to 25% of the lines. A lot fewer typos, but there'll be plenty of other errors.

Try compiling. The number of errors after fixing all the ABENDS and such in the compiler drops the error rate to 10%.

Start testing the software, varying the inputs and such. If one is lucky, error rate falls to 1%. And, for a very, very long time, that's where things stayed stuck. There might be errors in the code, but the SW will work well enough.

Now, imagine a code base of a million lines. Or two million lines. At 1% error rate, we're talking a 100,000-200,000 bunch of errors in the code.

If you were wondering why Microsoft/Apple/Adobe/etc have monthly updates, well, now you know .

Modern techniques, like running fuzzers, or using languages that put a straight-jacket on one's coding practices, can perhaps knock the error rate down by another factor of ten, but there'll still be a huge number of errors out there.

The prof stated that, once in a while, some miracle worker or other will write a 300 line routine that has no errors, on the first try. People like that are out there to irritate the rest of us and proving that the exception makes the rule. Which only proves that really, really good programmers are worth their weight in gold and become internationally famous, like Moxie Marlinspike and Bruce Schneier.

Things do improve, otherwise there'd be a drive-up window for software updates at the Tesla Service Center, where you'd turn in your old Hollarith punch card deck and get a new one - DON'T DROP IT.

Mardak · May 23, 2023

Can somebody newly added to FSD Beta with 2023.12.10 check if the Autopilot slider reverts back to legacy Autopilot stack? Some people are speculating that basic Autopilot now uses FSD Beta stack, but it's probably still the old behavior for now.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1661082556908048385

JulienW · May 23, 2023

Mardak said:
Can somebody newly added to FSD Beta with 2023.12.10 check if the Autopilot slider reverts back to legacy Autopilot stack? Some people are speculating that basic Autopilot now uses FSD Beta stack, but it's probably still the old behavior for now....

Yes AP is Legacy Autopilot stack. There is no such thing at this time as AP on the Beta stack. Just switch and you will even see the display change back to legacy stack graphics.

Edit: I'm on 22.45.15 but it is 100% the same Beta and here is Picture of FSD Beta and Legacy Autopilot stack at the same spot. Give it a try yourself and you will see.

KenC · May 23, 2023

I was going to wait and see how the new build was working out for people, then I remembered, I'm going on a 5hr drive to go skiing at 3am on Friday, and having FSDbeta would be great, since the last time I did it, I was so tired, driving home. So, I paid my $104. Hope to get the download soon.

JulienW · May 23, 2023

KenC said:
I was going to wait and see how the new build was working out for people, then I remembered, I'm going on a 5hr drive to go skiing at 3am on Friday, and having FSDbeta would be great, since the last time I did it, I was so tired, driving home. So, I paid my $104. Hope to get the download soon.

It is the exact same Beta build that has been out for a while and I got it April 8. Only the "regular" software is updated.

Pdubs · May 23, 2023

jebinc said:
Perhaps there is a secret safety score algorithm running in the background and yours is greyed out because of a very low and undisclosed safety score.

Flat earther.

I just want to answer the phone with the left knob thing. I haven’t got time to mess around with that Mickey Mouse FSD off highway. Tired of getting flipped off.

Supcom · May 23, 2023

I'm hoping that going forward Tesla keeps a 'stable' FSDb version available for new users to get immediately after subscribing/requesting FSDb. We have a new Model Y without FSD that I would like to be able to use for long trips by subscribing to FSD for a month and get FSDb, with its superior highway driving. The only way this works is for FSDb to be available very soon after subscribing.

Tronguy · May 23, 2023

JHCCAZ said:
Things do improve, otherwise there'd be a drive-up window for software updates at the Tesla Service Center, where you'd turn in your old Hollarith punch card deck and get a new one - DON'T DROP IT.

Worse yet, I arrived in college right in the middle of the transition. The first dozen or so programs I wrote by hand on paper, then used the punch card machine to make stacks of same that were then run through the high speed reader. But there five or six tty keyboards with attached line printers (no monitors) in the room with the card readers and lines of students in front of each one, with a hard ten-minute limit time in to use it. So, 30-50 minutes to get to a “terminal” with a DOS, ed-style editor, vs. going to a punch machine with no line. I stuck with the puncher.

Following year the school put in high-tech electronic glass displays. My S.O., then and presently, convinced me to give it a try. Hey! A backspace that works! And never looked back.

Still got a few of the punchcards around as mementos, though.

fasteddie7 · May 23, 2023

after a week of 11.4.1 I drove around recording around 90 minutes over 2 days to catch the quirks and hiccups on a hardware 4 vehicle. Specifically I wanted to have reference for the next version to see how it compares, but I cut the hiccups together if anyone is interested. Suggestions for next drive are welcome.

some hiccups:
it doesn’t see some stop signs every time
it will 100% turn on red with a no turn on red sign posted
It doesn’t like taking the left path at a fork in the road
it will wait to the absolute last moment to merge on a highway from a lane that is ending in specific places
it will turn off the road to make a right in some places
stops too early at signs where there’s no way to see if it is safe to continue and has to creep annoying vehicles behind it

jebinc · May 23, 2023

Tronguy said:
Worse yet, I arrived in college right in the middle of the transition. The first dozen or so programs I wrote by hand on paper, then used the punch card machine to make stacks of same that were then run through the high speed reader. But there five or six tty keyboards with attached line printers (no monitors) in the room with the card readers and lines of students in front of each one, with a hard ten-minute limit time in to use it. So, 30-50 minutes to get to a “terminal” with a DOS, ed-style editor, vs. going to a punch machine with no line. I stuck with the puncher.

Following year the school put in high-tech electronic glass displays. My S.O., then and presently, convinced me to give it a try. Hey! A backspace that works! And never looked back.

Still got a few of the punchcards around as mementos, though.

Wow, that describes exactly what I experienced in “Westin Hall” at NCE/NJIT in 1982…. By chance, are you describing the same place? My solution was to get a VIC20 w/15O baud modem to emulate a terminal so I could write and run my Fortran77 program from home. Punch cards sucked the big one!

JHCCAZ · May 23, 2023

fasteddie7 said:
after a week of 11.4.1 I drove around recording around 90 minutes over 2 days to catch the quirks and hiccups on a hardware 4 vehicle. Specifically I wanted to have reference for the next version to see how it compares, but I cut the hiccups together if anyone is interested. Suggestions for next drive are welcome.

some hiccups:
it doesn’t see some stop signs every time
it will 100% turn on red with a no turn on red sign posted
It doesn’t like taking the left path at a fork in the road
it will wait to the absolute last moment to merge on a highway from a lane that is ending in specific places
it will turn off the road to make a right in some places
stops too early at signs where there’s no way to see if it is safe to continue and has to creep annoying vehicles behind it

Almost all those hiccups are familiar to me. I don't have any road forks on my drive but my son just got it today. He sent me this as his biggest trouble spot:

clydeiii · May 23, 2023

Ramphex said:
You must not have a refresh model S. It drives like complete *sugar* so you have to supervise it more than just relaxing and watching the butterflies around you

Well I guess get a 2018 Model 3 like I have..?

FSDtester#1 · May 23, 2023

Mardak said:
Can somebody newly added to FSD Beta with 2023.12.10 check if the Autopilot slider reverts back to legacy Autopilot stack? Some people are speculating that basic Autopilot now uses FSD Beta stack, but it's probably still the old behavior for now.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1661082556908048385

Why are you only allowed 3 strikes?
I am allowed 5... well, now 4. Got my first one today after almost 2 years of FSD.
I earned it.. on the highway in the middle of nowhere, with no other cars around. holding phone and voice texting because the phone couldn't hear me while charging.

Ramphex · May 23, 2023

uscbucsfan said:
Because no one else is talking about FSD 12.X, yet twice you've brought it up.

All I know is….. FSDj 12 will be

JHCCAZ · May 23, 2023

Ramphex said:
All I know is….. FSDj 12 will be

For sure.. so don't get burned

Tronguy · May 23, 2023

jebinc said:
Wow, that describes exactly what I experienced in “Westin Hall” at NCE/NJIT in 1982…. By chance, are you describing the same place? My solution was to get a VIC20 w/15O baud modem to emulate a terminal so I could write and run my Fortran77 program from home. Punch cards sucked the big one!

Nope, I’m describing Purdue in 1978. The glass screen version was called PIRATE, for Purdue InteRAtive TErminal. And for us maniacs, it was FORTRAN IV. We didn’t get if/then/else until later. Later, we got 1’s: First programs were all in 0’s

.

PACEMD · May 23, 2023

Ramphex said:
That’s a density thing. Diesel floats on water because… lower density. Hot air balloon goes up…. lower density. Objects with higher density than ambient air, go down.

Prove me wrong.

That's what I'm saying, all those dense people not rising to the top.........

jebinc · May 23, 2023

Ramphex said:
All I know is….. FSDj 12 will be

“Mind-blowing,” it will be!

JHCCAZ · May 23, 2023

PACEMD said:
That's what I'm saying, all those dense people not rising to the top.........

PACEMD · May 23, 2023

vamike said:
While we share interests here, we range from totally optimistic and positive fans to completely pessimistic and negative haters, so naturally there are arguments and sometimes aggressive jabs. For me, witnessing the amount of time naysayers devote to persistent negativity is a fascinating study in human behavior. Many of us ignore the worst of naysayers, but EVNow seems to be a glutton for punishment

It's optimistic the positive hate from the naysayers, don't you think? As they always say, a little nay goes a long way.......

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