FSD FOMO

[3LE-TRK]

I have a 2019 Model 3 (radar). As I understand from other posts, people with vision only are thrilled with the recent developments but for radar equipped cars, switching to FSD (vision only) is brutal. Makes me sick with all the phantom braking and jerky movements.

My problem is a case of FOMO (fear of missing out). The autopilot was so no ugh better before this FSD beta and I am I cloned to opt out and go back to my radar original autopilot. I will miss the “eye of car” display but I think it will be a much more enjoyable experience. What if the next versions are amazing and I opt out and can’t get back in? What if the FSD versions of SW get new cool features that don’t appear in the main trunk of code…. Thoughts? I feel like it’s best to wait until this gets much much better. Help!

 

[Daniel in SD]

Is it only the Tesla Vision highway stack (old autopilot display) that you find unbearable?
If so I would wait to see if single stack V11 fixes it. I suspect that the top talent has been working on the FSD Beta stack and the Tesla Vision highway stack was a low priority.

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

I have a 2019 Model 3 (radar). As I understand from other posts, people with vision only are thrilled with the recent developments but for radar equipped cars, switching to FSD (vision only) is brutal. Makes me sick with all the phantom braking and jerky movements.

My problem is a case of FOMO (fear of missing out). The autopilot was so no ugh better before this FSD beta and I am I cloned to opt out and go back to my radar original autopilot. I will miss the “eye of car” display but I think it will be a much more enjoyable experience. What if the next versions are amazing and I opt out and can’t get back in? What if the FSD versions of SW get new cool features that don’t appear in the main trunk of code…. Thoughts? I feel like it’s best to wait until this gets much much better. Help!

Which FSD Beta version are you on?

I have a 2018 Model 3 with Radar, and when I switched to FSD Beta 10.3.1 the phantom braking while on the freeway was atrocious. It wasn't just that but even things like TACC during stop and go was totally ruined because it wasn't smooth.

Right around 10.8.1, and 10.9 it got a lot better.

The only problem now is anytime the FSD Beta is used for off-freeway use its can be really bad. So I need to turn off FSD Beta, but then sometimes I want FSD beta.

With FSD Beta off I imagine it wouldn't be really that much worse than before the whole FSD Beta and pure vision thing.

With the single stack I expect it to be truly awful so I'd advise waiting a bit before downloading that one (whenever it comes available).

 

[3LE-TRK]

I am on 10.8.1.

Is there a way to turn off FSD beta (go back to activating radar and away from vision only) without opting out? I seem to remember there was a way to do it with profiles. That would be best I think!

 

[3LE-TRK]

Which FSD Beta version are you on?

I have a 2018 Model 3 with Radar, and when I switched to FSD Beta 10.3.1 the phantom braking while on the freeway was atrocious. It wasn't just that but even things like TACC during stop and go was totally ruined because it wasn't smooth.

Right around 10.8.1, and 10.9 it got a lot better.

The only problem now is anytime the FSD Beta is used for off-freeway use its can be really bad. So I need to turn off FSD Beta, but then sometimes I want FSD beta.

With FSD Beta off I imagine it wouldn't be really that much worse than before the whole FSD Beta and pure vision thing.

With the single stack I expect it to be truly awful so I'd advise waiting a bit before downloading that one (whenever it comes available).

My autopilot actually got very good over the last few years. I have a pretty long street of two lane road that is full of traffic in the morning. Great to click into self drive. Now the car constantly wants to cross a double yellow to go around the car in front of me. The problem is there are 200 cars in front of that one. Makes it unusable. Add to that the constant breaking and swerving, it really is a step backwards.

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

My autopilot actually got very good over the last few years. I have a pretty long street of two lane road that is full of traffic in the morning. Great to click into self drive. Now the car constantly wants to cross a double yellow to go around the car in front of me. The problem is there are 200 cars in front of that one. Makes it unusable. Add to that the constant breaking and swerving, it really is a step backwards.

I don't think Tesla Vision in the FSD Beta causing this issue.

Instead this is the FSD causing this issue. All you really need to do is turn off FSD within the User interface, and this should fix the problem you're having without giving up the FSD Beta.

This won't work with V11 of the FSD Beta though because that's going single stack, and single stack means it uses the same FSD Beta code for everything. So it will be a short lived fix.

I would also recommend recalibrating the cameras. It might reduce the phantom braking like it did in my case, but it might not.

 

[3LE-TRK]

I don't think Tesla Vision in the FSD Beta causing this issue.

Instead this is the FSD causing this issue. All you really need to do is turn off FSD within the User interface, and this should fix the problem you're having without giving up the FSD Beta.

This won't work with V11 of the FSD Beta though because that's going single stack, and single stack means it uses the same FSD Beta code for everything. So it will be a short lived fix.

I would also recommend recalibrating the cameras. It might reduce the phantom braking like it did in my case, but it might not.

Recalibrating is a good thought. I will try that and report back. Thanks for the insight!

 

[alnmurray]

Issues with10.8.1 While stopped at a traffic light my steering wheel quickly started to turn into the other lane. If my hand wasn't on the wheel I would have run into the vehicle next to me. This is why it is important to hold on to the wheel even when stopped. When turning right the vehicle swings to the left and vice versa. It's scary because you think you may hit the vehicle next to you. I'm not a truck so this is not normal behavior to swing to the opposite side to make a turn. I drove like this in Italy & Puerto Rico when turning from a narrow street into a narrow street but not in New York. No unintentional panic braking just unexpected slow down & speedups. Overall, confident with this version of driving with FSD Beta 10.8.1 It's been 35 days since my last beta update.

 

[EVNow]

My autopilot actually got very good over the last few years. I have a pretty long street of two lane road that is full of traffic in the morning. Great to click into self drive. Now the car constantly wants to cross a double yellow to go around the car in front of me. The problem is there are 200 cars in front of that one. Makes it unusable. Add to that the constant breaking and swerving, it really is a step backwards.

Try Chill mode, if you haven't tried it yet. To me I cancel lane change as soon as it signals it once - and after that it won't try to overtake.

 

[Twiglett]

the stack switch does nothing to change the phantom braking issues caused by the vision switch.
Pre-beta, when my car was using radar I had a regular drive that never once in four years had a phantom braking issue.
As soon as I got the beta (and on the AP-stack which is 65mph and over), so not "FSD" but on vision, the same drive had 15 (yes fifteen) phantom braking events. Braking for dark shadows, braking for hill crests etc etc. All the things that radar AP solved years ago, well ok radar never tried to stop for dark shadows.
Even on later releases on the highway on a bright sunny day the car will brake hard when overtaking a semi if there is a dark shadow.
Vision might have fixed braking for overhead signs, but it broke a whole bunch more. Large step back for me.

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

the stack switch does nothing to change the phantom braking issues caused by the vision switch.
Pre-beta, when my car was using radar I had a regular drive that never once in four years had a phantom braking issue.
As soon as I got the beta (and on the AP-stack which is 65mph and over), so not "FSD" but on vision, the same drive had 15 (yes fifteen) phantom braking events. Braking for dark shadows, braking for hill crests etc etc. All the things that radar AP solved years ago, well ok radar never tried to stop for dark shadows.
Even on later releases on the highway on a bright sunny day the car will brake hard when overtaking a semi if there is a dark shadow.
Vision might have fixed braking for overhead signs, but it broke a whole bunch more. Large step back for me.

Do you feel as the Phantom braking issue decreased (while the vision stack was being used on the freeway) from version 10.5 Beta to 10.9?

In my own testing the best version of AP was the safety score one before the switch, and then 10.5 of the FSD Beta was horrible.

10.9 is mildly bad.

 

[Dewg]

When I got my MY early 2021, it still had radar and the firmware was still radar + vision. I had PBs, which I read had to do with vision and radar disagreeing with each other. The car would always take the safest choice between the two and brake. So vision could have seen something (like a shadow), and radar says it's not there - but the car would brake because one of the sensors said something was there. And vice-versa (like the overhead signs).

I remember Elon saying that the radar in cars today (he was generic, not specifically talking about Tesla's radar) provided very low resolution data, and couldn't keep up with modern vision systems. Hense Tesla was getting rid of radar in favor of vision-only. Obviously, I can't agree or disagree as I'm not an engineer, but if it's true it makes sense.