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Gas stations disappearing across Massachusetts

Discussion in 'Tesla, Inc.' started by Driver Dave, Mar 24, 2017.

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  1. Driver Dave

    Driver Dave Member

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    The beginning of the end?

    Range anxiety of gas cars in the city.

    Gas stations disappearing across Massachusetts - The Boston Globe

    "land has become so valuable that it has enticed many station owners to sell."

    "Appealing because the profit margins of selling fuel tend to be slim."

    “You don’t make a lot of money selling gas,”

    "Stations make most of their profit today not by selling gas, but by selling other products on site, like coffee and snacks in a convenience store."

    “He was waiting until he had a delivery over in that direction [near the Charlestown gas station] but he ended up running out of gas first.”


    It is easy to see a snowball effect ready to happen.

    * The selling gas business already sucks.

    * It is only really used to attract customers.

    * Electricity is easier and cheaper and thus businesses (as they have been) will use it to attract customers.

    * Charging produces more time at the location, thus capturing the customer longer activities - for lunch, shopping, dinner.

    * Electricity is everywhere. No tanks. Mess. Every business will have a charging station.

    * As electric cars gain market share, chargers will expand, be more visible, producing more electric cars.


    "Gas stations" barely make financial sense now, and with the coming little push from EVs, well...

    “And what makes sense for pretty much everyone is to take the money and run.”


    When gas goes down, it will be quick.
     
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  2. dhanson865

    dhanson865 Active Member

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    When there are 3 gas stations at or near the same spot they have a price war (someone leads and someone responds), when one of them closes the two remaining often reach an equilibrium (maybe a small price offset but stable). Close two of the 3 and the last one will raise its prices.

    I'm glad I don't have to worry about it if the place I used to buy gas stops selling.
     
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  3. ShockOnT

    ShockOnT ⚡️⚡️⚡️⚡️⚡️

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    Things change.
    Cars came before filling stations, and the first motorists got their fuel from pharmacies in glass jars.
    Filling station - Wikipedia
     
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  4. CHG-ON

    CHG-ON Still in love after all these miles

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    I think what keeps gas stations going is that they are all franchised and the small independent shop keeper doesn't analyze his margins enough to realize that he could do better in another business. So he just keeps going, trying to eek by, but never really making enough to thrive.

    Too bad.
     
  5. igotzzoom

    igotzzoom Supporting Member

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    I've already seen a few around here get torn down and replaced by a fast-food restaurant.
     
  6. Driver Dave

    Driver Dave Member

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    Will be great when they torn down and replaced by fast-food restaurant and parking lot of charging stations.
     
  7. hpartsch

    hpartsch Member

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    Apparently sheetz is installing ev chargers. I've seen a few ev chargers at gas stations in Washington. It would be smart for them to adapt and quick! No real reason for me to otherwise stop at a gas station. Maybe for a restroom... But I'd rather stop almost anywhere else as they are typically cleaner.
     
  8. Tangible

    Tangible Member

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    This is a non-problem, except for drivers who don't plan ahead. All ICE cars can go at least 200 miles, and once you get out of the CBD there is still an abundance of gas stations. When I drive from Boston to the Berkshires on the Mass Pike in my "other" car I can easily do it on one tank of gas, passing about five service areas on the way.

    The federal government is now emphasizing fossil fuels and changing the mission of the EPA, and it seems unlikely that new EV subsidies or tightened emission standards are going to be a factor in EV adoption going forward. At the state level, some have imposed fees on EV owners, on the grounds that they don't pay the road use taxes that are built in to gas prices. ICE vehicles will,be over 90% of the market for at least a decade.
     
  9. Btrflyl8e

    Btrflyl8e Supporting Member

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    This is interesting, because while I've seen many gas stations close down and be replaced by other businesses here in FL, we've also had Wawa recently move to our state. At least in my area, they are rapidly opening locations, which are huge, lots of pumps, big footprint. It seems like every month I'm seeing a new one break ground...

    I can't imagine their food offerings are good enough to sustain them when the pumps are no longer necessary...
     
  10. McRat

    McRat Active Member

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    It started a long time ago.

    The higher the land cost, the fewer the gas stations, and the higher the price per gallon. Pretty much everywhere in the world.
     
  11. HankLloydRight

    HankLloydRight Fluxing

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    I hate you with the heat of 10,000 suns.

    It is.
     
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  12. gavine

    gavine Petrol Head turned EV Enthusiast

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    Wawa traditionally didn't sell gas. They are a clean convenience store with high quality food and good service. Only recently, did they start converting to gas stations.
     
  13. Btrflyl8e

    Btrflyl8e Supporting Member

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    What on earth is so great about their food? I stopped in once to see what all the fuss was about...I wasn't that impressed with their offerings. It WAS very clean and laid out in an appealing manner, though. I'll give it that
     
  14. Driver Dave

    Driver Dave Member

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    I find food tastes best when I'm inside eating and car is outside charging.
     
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  15. RubberToe

    RubberToe Supporting the greater good

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    Nope, no possible way. In California in 2016, 3.5% of new vehicles sold could be plugged in. The Model 3 is coming out this year, and will sell more per year than all other EV's combined. The ZEV mandate in California is 22% ZEV's by 2025. Note that 2025 is within a decade.

    You make the simple mistake of now allowing for technology acceleration. Many others make this same mistake, including the executives of major auto manufacturers, so you are not alone. I hope you fare better in the coming decade than they do. ;)

    RT
     
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  16. Tangible

    Tangible Member

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    And you make the simple mistake of trying to predict the future by extending a current trend linearly. Also known as the "Where's my jet pack?" problem.

    California is not America. With somewhere around 13 million registered vehicles it is the largest state by far, but it is only about 12% of the national total. The other 88% have different technology adoption rates and different state policies.

    More importantly, the EPA is now run by a guy who doesn't believe that carbon emissions cause climate change, or that government should place limits on what businesses can do. He sits at the Cabinet table with the former CEO of Exxon. Their boss has said that climate change is a Chinese hoax. The leaders of both houses of Congress have similar positions.

    These people can and enthusiastically will enact laws that end federal incentives for energy-efficient and low emissions vehicles. They can also pass laws that prohibit any state from enforcing regulations that are more stringent than the federal standards. California and other progressive states could fight that in court, but there's reason to believe they would not prevail.

    I stand by my statement that in ten years 90% of cars will still have gasoline engines. Let's keep this thread open and meet back here in 2027.
     
  17. Driver Dave

    Driver Dave Member

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    That could be like looking at an iPhone and saying "It's going to take a while, flip phones will still be 90% of the market in 10 years. Nokia has nothing to worry about."
     
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  18. aronth5

    aronth5 Long Time Follower

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    Your 90% projection isn't that unreasonable since there are over 250 million cars on U.S. roads now with an average age over 11 years.
    However, consumers will be buying millions of electric cars each year by 2027 altering the car industry dramatically.
    Tangible what percentage of new cars sales do you think there will be in 2027 which is really what counts?
     
  19. iwannam3

    iwannam3 Member

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    If you look at the lines and the price at Costco gas stations it's clear business/profitability is down at all the other stations.
     
  20. Tangible

    Tangible Member

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    It's easy enough to pick winners in hindsight, but proves nothing. Anecdotes cut both ways. Not too many years ago some were saying that all TVs would be 3D by now. Could have happened. Didn't.

    An important factor in the iPhone's success is that it needed no new infrastructure. Out of the box it ran on the existing ATT network. EVs need massive investment in public and private power.

    @aronth5 You make a good point. I was sorta kidding about 2027. Given human fragility and societal upheaval I'll be happy just to be alive.
     

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