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General Discussion: 2018 Investor Roundtable

Discussion in 'TSLA Investor Discussions' started by AudubonB, Dec 30, 2017.

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  1. Todd Burch

    Todd Burch Voltage makes me tingle.

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    Whether Elon emailed or not, citing “Emails provided to the Post” and treating that as gospel, and running with that story, is the very crux of the problem in the first place. It’s trivial to forge an email forwarded to a journalist. Harder to fake the server’s record of that email being sent. Proof of the latter, or at the very least a response from the accused, is warranted before these kinds of stories get published.

    Seems many publications still have a lot to learn about responsible journalism.
     
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  2. neroden

    neroden Model S Owner and Frustrated Tesla Fan

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    It does seem that Tesla's culture of chaotic and disorganized management made it an easy target for sabotage, and meant that Tesla did not catch and address the sabotage as promptly as they would have in a more orderly company. (The usual clue regarding sabotage is *something out of the ordinary*, and if operations are changing chaotically every week, it's much easier for a saboteur to appear "ordinary".)
     
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  3. haid

    haid Member

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    Maybe. Or maybe the management chain would have squashed to information. Don't confuse a lack of transparency with quality control.
     
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  4. ValueAnalyst

    ValueAnalyst Closed

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    It's amusing to watch dozens of delusionals try to derail TSLA investors by spreading fear, uncertainty, and doubt, and without shame, personally attack those who have served this community over the years and earned everyone's respect.

    If there is one thing I learned in the last nearly 5,000 posts, it's that nothing, and I mean absolutely nothing, will stop Elon, Tesla, its employees, and its investors from achieving their mission.
     
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  5. techmaven

    techmaven Active Member

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    We do not yet know the involvement of any of law enforcement. This initial lawsuit is about discovery. Tesla wants the legal means by which to discover additional conspirators. There is plenty of time for criminal charges to be filed but that is dependent on the timing of law enforcement, not Tesla.
     
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  6. AccelAdvent

    AccelAdvent Member

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    I agree with the ‘take the high road’ / ‘let the facts play out’ pleas to avoid getting carried away with conspiracy theories. However, I also think that it’s important to know/understand your opponents. If you haven’t, please read this thread (and particularly the excerpt from Taibbi’s The Divide, which specifically involves Chanos) for background context: Elon Musk vs. Short sellers
     
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  7. HG Wells

    HG Wells Martian Embassy

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    NO!
    Mars wants cars !

    After receiving the sample roadster that Elon so graciously sent us, we are eagerly awaiting the first shipment of Model 3's on the new BFR.

    For each model 3 we will grant Elon 100 square miles. Not to exceed 50% of the martian surface.

    As ordained by the supreme Martian Commander this day.
     
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  8. wdolson

    wdolson Well-Known Member

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    More like the warnings from smoking. My father remembers WW I vets calling them "coffin nails" when he was a kid, but few took the dangers seriously until the 60s.

    There are worse dangers than global warming. The ice core records over the last million years show the world temps sometimes spike just before they plunge into a period of glaciation. All of human civilization has happened in one of the brief warm periods in the middle of an ice age (the last 2 million years).

    If the world gets warmer, that would be economically bad for coastal cities, and low lying lands would go underwater, but looking at the Geologic record, that's more the norm than the exception. The last 2 million years have been among the coldest in Earth's history except for a very bizarre period about 650 million years ago when the ice caps went all the way to the equator for a while. For many millions of years there was a shallow sea that covered the prairie states up to around the Canadian border. The shoreline shifted back and forth over time and forests along the shore got inundated and buried periodically when the sea was expanding. These trees got buried and turned into coal. It's the reason Montana and some other nearby states have so much coal.

    If we end up in a full blown ice age instead (we are at about the normal length of an inter-glacial period now), All of Canada except the tallest mountains would be buried under 1500-3000 feet of ice. In some glacial periods the ice has come as far south as Kansas, but the last one played footsie with Puget Sound i(the glaciers came and went over 90,000 years leaving massive hills of glacial debris) n the west, came down into Montana, and came down further in the east covering Manhattan. Most of Utah was a lake a couple of thousand feet deep. The Great Salt Lake is the last remnant of Lake Bonneville.

    Florida was a lot wider and the Mediterranean mostly dried up into a much smaller salt lake. The Southern Sahara was a massive lake/march region. The Southwestern US was quite green and lush.

    In an ice age, we would gain some land nearer the equator as the oceans dropped, but most mountains and northern regions would be buried under ice. A lot of places we grow food today would be unusable. The San Joaquin Valley would become a lake, most of the Midwest would be unusable, and Canada, Northern Europe, and much of Russia would have to be evacuated. Southern California, Arizona, and New Mexico would be good growing regions, but the overall carrying capacity of the Earth would be much lower than it is now.

    What we're doing killing off life in the oceans, polluting them with plastic, and using up all the fresh water will get us before any rising temperatures do. 90% of the plastic in the oceans has been traced back to a handful of rivers in Asia and Africa, the over fishing of the oceans is driven more by demands in Asia than North America (the US and Canada started managing coastal fisheries before the sea life became too depleted and poaching from Asian fishing factory ships has been a problem since). The depletion of fresh water is most acute in India and China where they have been using ground water to grow enough to feed their populations and the water is running out. Much of the surface water in those countries has been badly polluted.

    Soil depletion is also a serious problem. The nutrition content in our fresh food has been dropping since the 20s. I saw somewhere that spinach grown in the 20s had something like 10X more iron than spinach grown today.

    But I digress in a major way...
     
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  9. Rarity

    Rarity Member

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    #11529 Rarity, Jun 21, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2018
    Yes, this is about discovery leading to encumbering your opponent. Criminal charges may even put some of this discovery under wraps, the opposite of Tesla's goal. My guess is that the trade secret law is no joke.
     
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  10. racer26

    racer26 Active Member

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    Purchasing things (including proprietary information) which are known to be stolen is itself a crime. Whoever was pulling Tripp's strings *definitely* committed a crime as well, and Tesla is entitled to relief from what their actions did.
     
  11. Rarity

    Rarity Member

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    Even if it isn't proven a crime, you could be liable in a civil court. And even before you are proven liable in a civil court, your actions could become so legally encumbered that you are unable to act.
     
  12. racer26

    racer26 Active Member

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    I am 100% certain the lawsuit is not about collecting Tripp's money - he surely doesn't have deep enough pockets to pay the damages he caused. It's about getting to discovery and finding out who was pulling his strings.
     
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  13. Rarity

    Rarity Member

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    Completely agreed. But even if nobody was pulling his strings, he is now toxic to everybody he touched. And it sounds like he may have reached out and touched quite a few.

    I will be very interested in learning the outcome of the preliminary injunction hearing.
     
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  14. Krugerrand

    Krugerrand Is Cat

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    #11534 Krugerrand, Jun 21, 2018
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 21, 2018
    Wrong to receive IPO from a company and not at least contact that company and tell them; if you’re innocent of wrong doing that is.

    Oh, please. Have you not been paying attention? The guy gave false info to the media, that the media flogged, that affected the stock price and shareholder confidence. Elon’s going to be quiet about that? When he’s already decided to take the media on head on? *vigorous eyeroll*

    MOD: “IPO”??? Did you mean to write “Proprietary Information”, perhaps?
     
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  15. Krugerrand

    Krugerrand Is Cat

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    This is a valid point and certainly many of us here probably prefer organization around us rather than chaos. However, often times out of chaos comes brilliance (like the Universe).

    Anecdotally, many of the most brilliant and creative people I’ve come across in life seem to have some kind of connection to chaos, either creating it in their wake or living amongst it.

    And of course, pressure to accomplish something so grand as Tesla’s mission can in and of itself create chaos.

    Ultimately, though, I wouldn’t blame Tesla for this breach but rather the man (and anyone/everyone else involved). Nobody and no company should have to protect against dishonest people. That we all must is a statement about mankind, not about Tesla.
     
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  16. Boomer19

    Boomer19 Active Member

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    agreed to you, and disagree that shorts aren’t capabale of such - it’s all in the book, which came from discovery during court proceedings. i don’t think we have to worry about russia on this one ;)
    but, that said, let’s see what happens. this could just be an angry dude that just didn’t get his way.
     
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  17. Boomer19

    Boomer19 Active Member

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    yes and that L Lopez journalist” from BI seems to be, at least, on the list of those who are possibly the main contact in media. but there won’t be any repercussions there. they can say whatever they want, no matter how untrue, and walk away.
     
  18. RubberToe

    RubberToe Supporting the greater good

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    They said the same thing about the inevitable spread of Democracy. Just sayin...

    RT
     
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  19. ValueAnalyst

    ValueAnalyst Closed

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    Trade pressures deepen as Daimler warns on sales

    Screen Shot 2018-06-21 at 10.28.51 AM.png
    Auto stocks sank to a nine-month low on European markets .SXAP after Daimler cut its 2018 profit forecast and German rival BMW said it was considering “possible strategic options” in light of the rising trade tensions between China and the United States.

    This is just the beginning. This trend of pointing to anything but Tesla for their declining earnings is going to get increasingly ridiculous.
     
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  20. SPadival

    SPadival Active Member

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    Reposting this here as well.

    As jesse mentions, Chanos threw crumbs at the analysts and in exchange, used them as cutouts to attack Fairfax, with Chanos being the man behind the curtains.

    As it turns out, Montana Septic has a possible Chanos connection, getting some juicy Enron bankruptcy litigation morsels thrown his way!!

    ytCropper | QTR #23 - Montana Skeptic Talks About How Tesla Reminds Him of Enron

    And boy, there were a lot of bottom feeders during the Enron bankruptcy

    CASHING IN BIG-TIME ON ENRON'S COLLAPSE Gravy train for lawyers & accountants

    So is MS one of the many cut-outs for Chanos? For someone with a self admitted modest short via “long dated puts” , he is certainly investing an inordinate amount of time in Seeking alpha and Twitter bashing Tesla. Maybe the ultimate prize he is waiting for is the elusive Tesla bankruptcy gravy train.
     
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