GM -- General Motors discussion

[X Yes?]

And it does highlight the only real argument I see the shorters having. That Tesla will run out of cash, and clearly marks the people making them as shorters.

"run out of cash" Think you nailed it! This a real concern with the Bond market now tanking and the difficulty of launching a secondary offering (again). Can't think of a stronger reason to short any stock.

 

[Krugerrand]

Good question, I'm sure they have it figured out. Under Mary Barra's leadership, GM has over delivered on product launches, production schedules, product launches and PROFITS. They allow enough time for Beta testing. They don't make unrealistic promises and suffer the wrath of the investment community.

Actually they didn’t meet the product distribution of the Bolt.

 

[X Yes?]

Actually they didn’t meet the product distribution of the Bolt.

Was that by a week or a month?

 

[Gerardf]

Good question, I'm sure they have it figured out. Under Mary Barra's leadership, GM has over delivered on product launches, production schedules, product launches and PROFITS. They allow enough time for Beta testing. They don't make unrealistic promises and suffer the wrath of the investment community.

Is that you Bob ?
Mr. Lutz, please feel free to post under your own name..

 

[DurandalAI]

Really? Which established industries are spreading FUD about Tesla? I think the trouble lies with a company that is not keeping their promises. Investors and fund managers see an imbalance between value and stock price. They are exploiting this imbalance to make a buck. Capitalism.

It seems this guy is not familiar with Koch Industries.

 

[X Yes?]

I want to see the article on how they plan to get batteries for all those cars. I assume you havn't studied the matter. No auto makers on the planet are building giant battery factories and out side of China, there is all of a single gigafactory between the dozens of car companies coming out with hundreds of Tesla killing EV models and that capacity is planned for like 2023. What they presented is fluffy lies with no basis in reality. Everyone is waiting for someone to make batteries for them and someone will, at a very high Mark up. Because demand will be infinitely higher then supply (econ 101). So it's great that gm had endless amounts of money to burn making very only and half cars because they are going to need it to survive. At the end of the day, Tesla wants everyone making EVs. And they want then to succeed. Like they really want them to succeed so Tesla doesn't have to do all themselves.

Thanks ATHiker. Lot's of New Battery capacity, coming very soon:

There has been a lot of new battery capacity announced. LG Chem to Open $1.63 Billion Lithium-ion Battery Factory in Europe | INN
EV Batteries: A $240 Billion Industry In The Making That China Wants To Take Charge Of
SK Innovation To Invest ~$777 Million Into EV Battery Production Facility In Hungary | CleanTechnica
The list goes on....

 

[Krugerrand]

Was that by a week or a month?

That would be still. So remind us when it became available.

 

[McRat]

It's hard to understand how so many folk who can afford $100k cars (like me) have no idea how business works.

Did everybody inherit their money?

Off topic. If you are real investors, look at Northrup Grumman. Just sayin'. I don't hold NOC. I invest in my own company, but if I invested in other people's shiit, it would be NOC.

 

[schonelucht]

They have $3.5B in the bank and only used $250M last quarter. As they have said, they are close to generating free cash flow.

In terms of Tesla being cash flow positive : seeing is believing. Tesla has promised this before only to miss the mark each time.

 

[DurandalAI]

Off topic. If you are real investors, look at Northrup Grumman. Just sayin'. I don't hold NOC. I invest in my own company, but if I invested in other people's shiit, it would be NOC.

I sure hope they run the rest of their business well, because my interactions with them as an IT Services provider stank. I’m not sure that who was chosen to replace them was any better, but they certainly don’t treat their customers right in my experience. They are a perfect example of a company that has mastered suckling from the government teat with the most minimal return in terms of quantity and quality of product. That said, they’re loads better than Vectrus.

 

[Reciprocity]

Thanks ATHiker. Lot's of New Battery capacity, coming very soon:

Not really. Chinese batteries are mostly for the Chinese markets and not appropriate for long range EVs. This is because they enforce a very specific standard for batteries that are not very good and thus cannot achieve cost effective long range EVs. So if you look at the table, which is fraught with errors, its clear that Panasonic, which is Tesla and way under estimated, is equivalent tot he non-China production. So at most, those autos can only make as many cars as Tesla. And when they do? They wont be taking market share from Tesla, they will be taking market share from their profitable brands and offsetting with EV sales at massive losses because they have to buy batteries at retail in a situation where 120 models are coming out. Prices for these guys is going to sky rocket.

 

[schonelucht]

Not really. Chinese batteries are mostly for the Chinese markets and not appropriate for long range EVs. This is because they enforce a very specific standard for batteries that are not very good and thus cannot achieve cost effective long range EVs.

Ancient history (read 2016). The new EV mandate requires third gen chemistries (ie NMC or NCA) since last year and production capacity is switching over at a rapid pace.

 

[Reciprocity]

Ancient history (read 2016). The new EV mandate requires third gen chemistries (ie NMC or NCA) since last year and production capacity is switching over at a rapid pace.

The batteries are still spoken for by Chinese companies and not for export with very few exceptions. Foreign auto makers have partnered with local battery manufacturers, but not to the tune of 100's of GWh, more like sub 1GWh over the next 5 years.

Chinese auto makers will eat into demand for US brands there because they will have EVs to sell and EVs are very popular there. People with money there will choose between the GM and the EV and select the EV. Sometimes that will be a Tesla and sometimes it will be another foreign automaker but mostly it will be Chinese automakers which doesnt help GM.

 

[X Yes?]

The batteries are still spoken for by Chinese companies and not for export with very few exceptions. Foreign auto makers have partnered with local battery manufacturers, but not to the tune of 100's of GWh, more like sub 1GWh over the next 5 years.

Chinese auto makers will eat into demand for US brands there because they will have EVs to sell and EVs are very popular there. People with money there will choose between the GM and the EV and select the EV. Sometimes that will be a Tesla and sometimes it will be another foreign automaker but mostly it will be Chinese automakers which doesnt help GM.

You may not, but the Chinese seem to love GM products, as they were up 15% in volume last month. For the Chinese, it's likely a GM electric or from one of their joint venture partners. China's gonna get tougher for Tesla. They will be priced out of the market unless they can find and agree to accept a Chinese partner. Then they just need to come up with a boatload of cash to build another plant.

 

[X Yes?]

GM, VW Volvo Audi and BMW are all talking about massive EV manufacturing. Where is their Gigafactory? I don't think anyone in the world can compete with Tesla at the moment on high range EV's

GM and all successful OEM's are moving away from vertical integration. They also want to be able to use the latest tech. The world will soon be awash in battery production, more than enough to cover the projected 5% of the total BEV production by 2030. GM is well prepared for whereever fuel price or BEV demand is: How GM Plans To Bury Tesla With Onslaught Of Electric Vehicles That Will -- Gasp! -- Make A Profit

 

[Reciprocity]

GM and all successful OEM's are moving away from vertical integration. They also want to be able to use the latest tech. The world will soon be awash in battery production, more than enough to cover the projected 5% of the total BEV production by 2030. GM is well prepared for whereever fuel price or BEV demand is: How GM Plans To Bury Tesla With Onslaught Of Electric Vehicles That Will -- Gasp! -- Make A Profit

You assume to much. You assume 5% by 2030 is correct. Again. For every EV a traditional Auto sells, they lose profits from a non-EV product they could have sold. Fans of GM in China, which I agree there are many, will want a GM EV and when they buy one, GM losses the fat margins from the ICEv that person would have purchased and instead they lose $10,000 on the EV, in part because they have outsourced the power train at massive losses. EVEN IF these EVs are at some kind of profit, the more successful they are with EVs the more fragmented and in efficient their production becomes and the less they make. And China is the not the entire world, its just the country that is forcing auto makers to sell more EVs sooner then later. If they where not doing this, I doubt GM would be making any efforts in EVs but at the end of the day, it will benefit them in other parts of the world and will benefit Tesla by making EVs less scary for the average customer. Then those customers can choose which car is actually better instead of basing their decision of fuel type.

 

[X Yes?]

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