TMC is an independent, primarily volunteer organization that relies on ad revenue to cover its operating costs. Please consider whitelisting TMC on your ad blocker or making a Paypal contribution here: paypal.me/SupportTMC

Has anyone done a P85 to a P85+ suspension retrofit?

Discussion in 'Model S: Driving Dynamics' started by Raven5000, Aug 10, 2013.

  1. Raven5000

    Raven5000 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2012
    Messages:
    110
    Location:
    San Francisco, California, United States
    Wondering if anyone has done this yet? I have a P85+ loaner right now and love the handling but like my car(P85) better because of the smoothness and quietness. The + seems noisier. I can hear the road noise more and hear the motor more. Wondering if I just did a retrofit if it would be the best of both worlds? Or would my ride be rougher and noisier like a +?
     
  2. EMDoc

    EMDoc Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2013
    Messages:
    149
    Location:
    San Diego
    this is what a few of us are interested in. waiting for the word from Tesla to see if we can get it done. so far, they say 13k which includes new wheels and tires which would be redundant (though the the rear wheels would fit the 265). Lolachampcar is an expert on this kind of stuff..you can search for the posts. he sold his p85 for the plus...
     
  3. pimp-boy

    pimp-boy Member

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2013
    Messages:
    141
    Location:
    Los Gatos
    Reviving the thread. :) Has anyone done the P85 to P85+ retrofit and not the full upgrade? Want to see if it was worth it. I'm sure there was a difference, but do you feel it was really close to the P85+?

    Please PM me if you can't post publicy.

    Thanks!

     
  4. EMDoc

    EMDoc Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2013
    Messages:
    149
    Location:
    San Diego
    Same here. Interested as well.
    I think my plan will be initially to swap out for Michelins and also get the larger rear wheels and see how the car feels. I'm sure it won't take away that "floaty" feeling but maybe I could live with it.

     
  5. dsm363

    dsm363 Roadster + Sig Model S

    Joined:
    May 17, 2009
    Messages:
    18,235
    Location:
    Las Vegas, NV
    I spoke with someone who had it done on a Signature P85 in the 500 VIN range. They were impressed with the upgrade. I didn't get a chance to drive it myself however.
     
  6. sgblank

    sgblank Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2013
    Messages:
    42
    Location:
    pescadero, ca
    The Palo Alto service center was quite helpful in providing me a quote for the upgrade.

    My two choices for a P85 to P85+ upgrade are:
    - $22,859 to upgrade my existing P85 to a P85+
    - $53,512 to trade in my P85 for a used service loaner P85+
     
  7. EMDoc

    EMDoc Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2013
    Messages:
    149
    Location:
    San Diego
    that is quite a discrepancy. even with tax, I was under the impression it would be about 16000. why the difference?

     
  8. sgblank

    sgblank Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2013
    Messages:
    42
    Location:
    pescadero, ca
    #8 sgblank, Nov 24, 2013
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2013
    @EMDoc - the quote from Tesla is attached.
    The Palo Alto service center said I could deduct the cost of the rear subframe $1518.69 in the quote as it was only needed on cars with earlier VINs then mine (6xxx).
    That still makes it a ~$23K upgrade.

    P85 PLUS ESTIMATE for P06xxx page 2.jpg
     
  9. EMDoc

    EMDoc Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2013
    Messages:
    149
    Location:
    San Diego
    Thanks for posting sgblank. Interesting that the "+" badge costs 21 dollars! Also, it looks like this is the complete retrofit with the dampers included. I think I would be happy with the partial retrofit and exclude the dampers at 1700 each! Appreciate the info!

     
  10. jerry33

    jerry33 S85 - VIN:P05130 - 3/2/13

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2012
    Messages:
    12,763
    Location:
    Texas
    So $9K is tires, wheels, and the TPMS sensors. Also what's your VIN number (roughly if you don't want to post it).
     
  11. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2011
    Messages:
    15,487
    It looks like we're looking at this similarly...
    $14K for a "full chassis retrofit" (i.e., without the wheels and tires) is starting to sound more sane to me.

    I kind of wish they separated out parts vs. labor because we keep hearing that labor is the costly part.
     
  12. yobigd20

    yobigd20 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2012
    Messages:
    5,793
    Location:
    Skaneateles, NY
    Wow! That's an incredibly expensive upgrade! More than double the price of the original cost of the upgrade...

    and $2400 for tires? Are all of you ok with spending $2400 for new tires every 5-10k? You do realize that any notion of "being green" or "saving money on gas" is completely negated by anyone getting 21" tires like this, right?

    I don't know about most of you, but I stretched my budget for this Tesla. Currently I drive about 60,000miles/year. I recognize that is more than 2-4x than most people. For me, a P85+ w\ those tires would cost me anywhere from 6-12 replacement sets per year given their 5k lifetime. That's about $14k-$28k of tire maintenance cost PER YEAR. Obviously, out of my budget. Probably out of all your budgets too unless your millionaires. But I realize none of you drive as much as I do anyway.

    But lets say you drive 15,000 miles/year which is probably more realistic. You'll probably have to replace those rear tires 3x and the front tires maybe once. That's still almost $5k/year in tire maintenance. Personally, I still wouldn't be OK with that. At 15k miles/year, if you were driving a 30mpg ICE car, assuming $3.50/gallon, you'd spend $1750/yr in gas. So basically this would cost you 3x more per year in maintenance than an ICE vehicle.

    I know I've been pretty loud about the real true cost to own 21" tires (I guess its not really specific to the + package, however the tires on the + package are $500/tire on tirerack or over $600/tire from Tesla...[actually I thought they were closer to $1000/tire at the service centers]), so my sincere question to all of you here is this: are you ok with that type of cost of maintenance every year? Even if you are a super duper millionaire, most of you probably got that way by being smart and making practical decisions. This doesn't seem like one to me. That is why I fail to understand why any practical person would want to do this.

    - - - Updated - - -

    they did separate labor out. it's at the bottom of the one. $3850.
     
  13. EMDoc

    EMDoc Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2013
    Messages:
    149
    Location:
    San Diego
    Agree with all of above. The partial retrofit looks to be about 14K if you exclude dampers and an entirely new set of wheels. The San Diego center will piecemeal it together as should others...so that should save a bit on wheels. As for tires, I expect to replace those anyway with the Michelins. The entire retrofit looks to be the 23K price...which is not worth it in my opinion. I'll be happy with the partial.

    YBD - My car presently has 10k miles and the contis are in good condition and I expect they will last another 10K at least with the tire rotation. I do drive a lot but split the drives with my other car. I had the Michelin PS2 on my other car and depending on driving style (mostly freeway for me), you can get 15K or more out of them (especially if not constantly accelerating on surface streets). Part of the reason I got rid of the M3 was because this car is much more practical AND fun to drive. I miss the crispness of the M3 and even with the retrofit, the MS is a large car but I'd be happier. Also, the Michelins are pricey however hopefully they will make the SuperSport tires in the 21" size...these tires have better treadwear and are cheaper than the PS2. Otherwise, there are other brands which are cheaper and offer close to the performance of the Michelins.


     
  14. dennis

    dennis P85D

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2012
    Messages:
    1,224
    Location:
    Silicon Valley CA
    The partial retrofit deletes the dampers and the swaybars which also saves a lot on the labor. So what you get are the wider rear wheels and stickier/wider Michelin tires + the revised rear suspension components with the stiffer bushings. When I was pursuing this I asked Tesla several times if they could provide a partial retrofit demo car, at least in the Bay Area/factory. That way potential buyers could compare the results of the $15K upgrade to their current car and a P+ loaner. So far that has not happened AFAIK.
     
  15. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2011
    Messages:
    15,487
    Mea culpa. I'm blind.

    (IMO) So the real difference in cost (vs. buying off the assembly line) is thus not the labor but rather that there are so many "not same" parts being replaced and you effectively get no credit for the old parts. This is very different from the impression I had from different discussions with Tesla folks and from posts/PMs on TMC.

    All of this is reasonable, just different from how I had been thinking about it.
     
  16. dennis

    dennis P85D

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2012
    Messages:
    1,224
    Location:
    Silicon Valley CA
    That is correct, and it is the reason the upgrade is so expensive. For example, Tesla buys the rear suspension components from a supplier with the bushings already pressed in, so instead of pressing out one bushing and pressing in a stiffer one they replace the entire component. Also, they cannot reuse any old parts, so unless you take them back they just junk them. I sold my old wheels and tires and donated the suspension parts to lolachampcar for his experiments.
     
  17. Brightonuk

    Brightonuk Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2014
    Messages:
    377
    Location:
    Plantation
    Anyone have a parts list with sku#s for the P85 to P85+ upgrade (minus wheels and tires)?
    Thanks
     

Share This Page