Welcome to Tesla Motors Club
Discuss Tesla's Model S, Model 3, Model X, Model Y, Cybertruck, Roadster and More.
Register

Has anyone returned their Tesla?

Mikeoneuk85

Member
Oct 13, 2019
57
12
Droitwich Spa
I have the SR+ and absolutely love it.

My only problem is the range as i’m doing about 70 miles commute every day and its costing me 140 miles in range, believe this is mainly because of the weather, i have the heating on auto set to 25 and heated seats on low. my concern with this is that at the moment its manageable but in the future with degradation this could be an issue and i’m looking to keep the car for 10+ years.

I’m now considering getting a refund within the next couple of days and saving up for the long range model.

I’m just wondering of the returns process is simple enough as i read the conditions online but it talked about if you have an incentive then you cant have a refund, is that correct? Surely most tesla have the ev incentive.

Any help would be much appreciated
 

Adopado

Active Member
Aug 19, 2019
3,296
2,464
Scotland
My only problem is the range as i’m doing about 70 miles commute every day and its costing me 140 miles in range, believe this is mainly because of the weather, I have the heating on auto set to 25 and heated seats on low.

Blimey that's high consumption ... mind you I'm in a colder climate and tend to only set the temp at 20c OR have heated seats on (not both). What's that consumption in battery percentage? I would have thought you would only use 50% even in cold weather, which would give a good margin.
 

Adopado

Active Member
Aug 19, 2019
3,296
2,464
Scotland
I’m now considering getting a refund within the next couple of days and saving up for the long range model.

I’m just wondering of the returns process is simple enough as i read the conditions online but it talked about if you have an incentive then you cant have a refund, is that correct? Surely most tesla have the ev incentive.

Any help would be much appreciated

Sorry, I only referred to the consumption issue in my reply. I'm afraid I would be as much in the dark as you with respect to refunds. I would be surprised about the incentive aspect, but I don't know.
 

ewoodrick

Well-Known Member
Apr 13, 2018
5,285
3,723
Buford, GA
The cold will reduce range by about 30%. Battery degradation over 10% for 8 years is what probably should be expected.
Driving at 75 mph will kill your range, try slowing it down, and see what happens.

A 70 mile commute should be easily achievable. (but not at 80 mph)
 

Jason71

Active Member
May 8, 2019
2,441
2,186
Shropshire
I'm sure there are some people who have decided on a refund but I'm also guessing they are probably not regulars on this forum. That would seem a tad masochistic. :D
 
  • Like
Reactions: drewpost

Jason71

Active Member
May 8, 2019
2,441
2,186
Shropshire
people have kind of said to this above in pieces but I'll put it together. Apart from speed what people are starting to realise on here about now in the cold weather is that the cabin heater is an absolute battery killer.
The seat heaters are much much more efficient so a cabin temperature of 18-20 with fan set to low and seat heaters on max will be way better than a cabin temp of 25 with seats on low.
 

pgkevet

Active Member
Jul 1, 2019
1,134
972
mid wales
There's a number of points that haven't been mentioned. Personally I see no reason to be uncomfortable in a car and I do set my temp to 22C (2018 S 100D) and usually take it off auto in cold weather so I can set it to give me heat on feet as well +/- seat as an extra. That and window demisters indeed can eat into range. Also i like to be prepared with reserves in case taffic gets stuck in snow/ice and we all end up sitting for an hour while it's sorted - and yes an extra blanket in the boot for a long trip/commute from home is worthy. I;d rather have a contingency for a splash and dash somewhere than rough it - but then I'm knocking on in years.
The other point about owning the car for 10yrs. It's a computer on wheels and will be obsolete well before then as well as Tesla's high workshop and parts prices so keeping it out of warranty may not be such a good idea.
At the moment the actual cost of the extra leccy for the heaters isn't too bad and you can cook the car up before you leave. There's also consideration that in time your works or local authroities may/may not provide some charging facilities but you can't bank on it.
No one can tell you whether or not to swap the car - a personal decision. Whether you contract with Tesla allows you to is something you have to check with them.
 

Rooster6655

Active Member
May 3, 2019
1,518
525
UK
Well Teslafi is predicting a 180 real world miles based on a full charge with my LR but I think that is due to my last few trip being shorter and the heater probably taking up more range than the actual driving.

If consumption is double in winter then so is the cost so any charges on the public network are likely to end up being more costly per mile in the winter by quite a lot considering many of the fast chargers are already pricey enough.

If you charge at home then pre heat the car there and reduce the temp down to say 21 may help with your range!
 

NorfolkMustard

Active Member
Apr 18, 2019
2,149
2,093
M3P w/FSD
Sounds like you haven’t found the hidden game Teslas have built in called “Energy” ;)

careful, it can get quite addictive.

the aim of the game is to try and keep the orange line below the Rated line. Masters of the game can even turn the orange line green. It’s mad.

It’s a bit like a scrolling arcade game, you control it with your right foot and the heating controls

have a play and let us know your score :)



 
  • Like
  • Funny
Reactions: tess19 and Keeper

VanillaAir_UK

Supporting Member
Jun 17, 2019
7,192
4,695
Surrey, UK
The other point about owning the car for 10yrs. It's a computer on wheels and will be obsolete well before then as well as Tesla's high workshop and parts prices so keeping it out of warranty may not be such a good idea.

The vast majority of cars on the roads are obsolete. Hopefully, third party solutions will become more prevalent in the same way that solutions are available for the other 'obsolete' vehicles on the road.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Yev000

d.c.palmer

8 years of EV driving
Feb 17, 2017
153
147
Oxford, England
Another piece of advice that hasn't been mentioned:

- Preheat your car!

Assuming you have a charger at home (if not, why not?) just use the app to pre-heat - and pre-condition - your car.

In cold weather it's possible to drive like a saint, with no heating, no heated seat, no heated steering wheel - freezing your butt and mitts - and still get pitiful energy consumption.

Why? It's because of something outside your control: battery heating. In cold weather, the car warms up the battery to ensure better performance (and longevity). This can seriously impact your energy consumption. The solution? Use the app to pre-warm the car - assuming your are plugged in and using "shore power":-

  1. You'll get a nice warm car to start with (I find that after just 10 mins of preheating, the car is good enough for me).
  2. You're not wasting your battery power on the pre-heat.
  3. You will be able to have your battery pre-conditioned, so it's at an optimum temperature for your journey.
(It's also more efficient to power the systems directly from mains, rather than having to charge up the battery, then discharge it into the heating system.)

When the battery is being "pre-conditioned" by the app, you'll see a little battery icon appear in the "Climate" pane of the app - with a snowflake icon on it. Note that this only happens when the temperature is low ~4°C or lower in my experience.

Believe me: after 6 years driving the Model S I've tried pretty much everything - and used to regularly try to get the lowest-possible Wh/mile on my morning commute (in my wife's Model S P85 I was able to regularly get around 250 Wh/mile in summer time; more like 300 Wh/mile in winter time. Energy consumption is about 20% worse in my P100D - which is heavier, has two motors - and also some real energy hogs in the "safety" systems (Autopilot camera, radar, etc.).

I hope this helps - and don't forget that most EV drivers tend to rely on their heated seats for primary warmth; then turn down the climate control and save a few kWh.
 

pgkevet

Active Member
Jul 1, 2019
1,134
972
mid wales
I hope this helps - and don't forget that most EV drivers tend to rely on their heated seats for primary warmth; then turn down the climate control and save a few kWh.

You see them all the time...leather cap and goggles, handlebar moustache, fur trimmed jacket and white scarf fluttering out of the window while pulled over at the side of thr road trying to warm their hands on a cup of soup....
 

Ant M3

Member
Oct 13, 2019
343
149
Solihull, UK
I have the SR+ and absolutely love it.

My only problem is the range as i’m doing about 70 miles commute every day and its costing me 140 miles in range, believe this is mainly because of the weather, i have the heating on auto set to 25 and heated seats on low. my concern with this is that at the moment its manageable but in the future with degradation this could be an issue and i’m looking to keep the car for 10+ years.

I’m now considering getting a refund within the next couple of days and saving up for the long range model.

I’m just wondering of the returns process is simple enough as i read the conditions online but it talked about if you have an incentive then you cant have a refund, is that correct? Surely most tesla have the ev incentive.

Any help would be much appreciated

25! what on earth are you growing inside the car ?
 

Roy W.

Battery running low...
Jun 3, 2019
2,288
2,274
Derby, UK
I have the SR+ and absolutely love it.

My only problem is the range as i’m doing about 70 miles commute every day and its costing me 140 miles in range, believe this is mainly because of the weather, i have the heating on auto set to 25 and heated seats on low. my concern with this is that at the moment its manageable but in the future with degradation this could be an issue and i’m looking to keep the car for 10+ years.

I’m now considering getting a refund within the next couple of days and saving up for the long range model.

I’m just wondering of the returns process is simple enough as i read the conditions online but it talked about if you have an incentive then you cant have a refund, is that correct? Surely most tesla have the ev incentive.

Any help would be much appreciated
You need to wear a vest ;)

Seriously though, I think you can return the car within the first two week or so, as long as you’ve done less than 1000 miles. Ask Tesla!
 

adsheff

Member
Sep 9, 2019
237
197
UK
I think going from a Leaf to a Model 3 helped me realise that the quoted miles and the actual miles vary wildly. In the winter, you won't get anywhere near your quoted range - and rain / wind play a massive part too. Also when you go over 60mph the amount of energy consumed goes up dramatically, even with small speed increases (Which is why The Netherlands' recently announced lower speed limit makes so much sense).

I beat the rated miles in my 30Kwh Leaf on a 25 C day, driving extremely smoothly and not exceeding 60 on the motorway, with the aircon turned off. I was very hot. But if you want to drive 'normally', use the AC to your heart's content and have a safety buffer in the battery, you can easily take a third off the rated miles. That's just how it is.

That said, if you don't do long trips that often, it is not a problem. Once you learn how far the car will actually go, (and for this I'd advise switching the battery icon from 'miles' to 'energy %'), you can do trips without any planning.
 

Glan gluaisne

Supporting Member
Sep 11, 2019
2,782
2,688
UK
My view is that people seem to be very focussed on the change in car efficiency when driving an EV in cold weather, but don't seem to be anywhere near as focussed on the pretty similar change in efficiency in an ICE car in cold weather. No idea why, as all cars perform less efficiently in cold weather. Just air temperature (or more accurately density, which is a function of temperature) makes a difference of around 8% or so between winter and summer, and then when the use of heaters, deicing, demisting etc is factored in that adds another big efficiency hit.

Poorer efficiency in cold weather is just something we have to live with, no matter what we drive. By the same token, how many ICE cars always deliver their stated MPG, either in summer or winter? My experience is that none I've owned have come close to being able to perform as advertised in terms of economy. Might be to do with the way I drive not matching the driving pattern used for the testing, or it may just be that the testing pattern of use can be tweaked by the manufacturers to give the best possible figures.
 

Battpower

Supporting Member
Oct 10, 2019
1,958
1,938
Uk
Slightly off topic, but following the discussion:

We all need to re-do a basic physics class. You can't trick or by-pass the rules of physics. 5 years of running house and car (Zoe) from solar PV has reminded me of this. I see more tyres having a very specific energy rating stating how much 'energy' (heat loss) a particular tyre has per distance. The Zoe uses a heat pump to reduce energy use for heating. Not sure why Tesla didn't do this. Also, Zoe has blended breaking so when you brake with the brake pedal, the car tries to use regen braking before applying the friction brakes. In a Tesla, every time you use the brake pedal, you are wasting energy as heat in the brakes. Friction due to wind resistance (and more waste heat being generated in the ambient air) goes up masively and non-linearly as you speed up. Having a decently low cd helps reduce those losses. The higher current you pull through electric circuits through fast acceleration, the more heat is generated through electrical resistance. More waste.

Then you have charging, discharging, life expectancy and capacity factors in the batteries, all of which have various pros and cons going on.

Once you take physics into account, there is no mystrey about range and performance. Of course you don't have to be a physisist to drive an EV, but understanding what's going on will surely help you get the most from your car. I think that's part of the fun of responsible ownership.
 
  • Like
Reactions: LEE3

khizrs

Member
Oct 27, 2019
33
9
United Kingdom
My view is that people seem to be very focussed on the change in car efficiency when driving an EV in cold weather, but don't seem to be anywhere near as focussed on the pretty similar change in efficiency in an ICE car in cold weather. No idea why, as all cars perform less efficiently in cold weather. Just air temperature (or more accurately density, which is a function of temperature) makes a difference of around 8% or so between winter and summer, and then when the use of heaters, deicing, demisting etc is factored in that adds another big efficiency hit.

Poorer efficiency in cold weather is just something we have to live with, no matter what we drive. By the same token, how many ICE cars always deliver their stated MPG, either in summer or winter? My experience is that none I've owned have come close to being able to perform as advertised in terms of economy. Might be to do with the way I drive not matching the driving pattern used for the testing, or it may just be that the testing pattern of use can be tweaked by the manufacturers to give the best possible figures.
I have never owned a car that had a 50% difference in efficiency between summer and winter or any time of the year actually.
 

About Us

Formed in 2006, Tesla Motors Club (TMC) was the first independent online Tesla community. Today it remains the largest and most dynamic community of Tesla enthusiasts. Learn more.

Do you value your experience at TMC? Consider becoming a Supporting Member of Tesla Motors Club. As a thank you for your contribution, you'll get nearly no ads in the Community and Groups sections. Additional perks are available depending on the level of contribution. Please visit the Account Upgrades page for more details.


SUPPORT TMC
Top