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Has buying a Tesla changed your mind about Climate Change?

Discussion in 'Tesla Motors' started by Chopr147, Aug 3, 2016.

  1. Chopr147

    Chopr147 Active Member

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    I ask this because I am kinda coming over to the CC side in the last few months. I do keep informed and have read more CC or GW information in the last few years than I care to admit. I have been VERY skeptical about CC and for good reason. Without getting into politics (IK, too late) I have been turned away from the CC crowd by watching crooks like Al Gore and his friends line their pockets while pushing gov't programs that enrich them. It also hurts the mission when VERY annoying people are the biggest backers. For example: I like John Travolta as an actor but when he lectures about global warming, CO2 etc....and then walks to his personal airplane which he flies right to his driveway, it is hard to take him seriously. Leo Dicap, Pelosi, Obama etc...... All seem to be getting wealthy by passing laws for CC and IMHO are not trustworthy people.
    Now to the other side :) I used to agree with many deniers due to facts being changed when they don't support CC etc....
    I can see why it is happening. You're a scientist, the stats don't match to the previous prediction and you can potentially lose millions of grants if you do not follow the money.

    This thought never occurred to me until recently: Oil/gas industry is intentionally muddling the waters, or oil fields :) because it has a huge impact on their profits. Sure call me an ass for not seeing that. Maybe being a "glass half full" person blinded me to this fact. Or being right leaning politically.
    I ordered an S for the performance of the car, the beauty of it, and yes for the zero emissions. Not to save the world but even as a GW denier, I had to agree lower CO2 can only be a good thing.
    I have had solar panels on my house for 5 years now. As a money saver, also not to save the world.
    I have read articles how the 97% is BS, "proof" of statistical funny business, and how predictions have not been fulfilled.
    Books have been written for all of that and some are very convincing. Some of which is true.
    Why am I now moving to the CC side? And why does it have to be a side? Politics should have nothing to do with it but we live in the real world, certainly not perfect.
    Elon Musk is by far more intelligent than me and I trust he is not pushing CC to enrich his companies. Just call it a hunch. :) I believe I am a good judge of character with many years experience dealing with the public.
    He seems to be so sure about it that he has risked his whole life's savings more than once to continue his quest. So, I did some more digging and came away even more confused. Just Google "climate change" and you know what I mean. At some point one needs to read between the lines and it appears to be a "thing" :)
    I have to get past my prejudices about the spokespersons and get into the science of it. I do not believe I can deny any longer. The evidence is there. I am especially fascinated at how scientists can read C02 levels by drilling into air bubbles in the ice core . I'm sure the science of it sounds better, i'm typing here from the top of my head :)
    I'm just spit-balling but, looking into getting my Tesla has energized me into absorbing all I can about CC and how my grand-kids need this generation to do something about it NOW!
    So, I guess I can say i'm somewhat doing my part even though it is not the reason I bought a Tesla.
    I will be driving a Tesla in the near future and am excited to become part of the Tesla world.
    With solar powering my house, charging will be close to free!
     
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  2. James Anders

    James Anders Member

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    Nope. Still skeptical. Bought my Tesla for the performance and technology.
     
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  3. DFibRL8R

    DFibRL8R Member

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    For me, owning the Tesla did increase my awareness of energy consumption, sourcing of electricity as well as realizing that getting from point A to point B doesn't have to involve burning gas (and can still by done in style:cool:). Energy production and consumption is a very important issue and should get more attention in my opinion. The science behind climate change certainly is compelling and it seems more people (even Exxon-Mobil) are being candid about the issue and the need to address it.
     
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  4. Chopr147

    Chopr147 Active Member

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    Yes. I was surprised by Exxon-Mobil agreeing with carbon taxes and am trying to figure out their angle :)
    Hey, I love my Yukon XL but am looking forward to "point A to point B doesn't have to involve burning gas"
    And doing it in style will be awesome!
     
  5. Evbwcaer

    Evbwcaer Member

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    To the OP:

    What a well written and revealing post. As people who are aware of CC sometimes villainize deniers, it is very neat to hear someone's personal story as they came to realize reality, even if it meant wading through a political swamp.

    I'm happy to hear about your personal change and I hope it can be something that helps others to put politics and culture aside and instead look squarely at science.

    You'll love the Tesla and thanks for sharing.
     
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  6. kort677

    kort677 Active Member

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    ^^^ this ^^^
     
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  7. Drivin

    Drivin Member

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    Not sure what it means to "change your mind about Climate Change"
    Isn't the relevant question about the impact of Climate Change.

    Of course there is climate change. The climate is not a constant - the 1600s was not the same as the 1700s nor the same as the 1800s.

    Now, the question is, is today's climate the ideal climate for humans on earth? If so, why? If not, what changes in the climate would make it better or make it worse? IIRC, during the Renaissance Age the prosperity in part was attributed to the generally warmer climate at the time.
    So would we be better off with a change to that type of climate?


    BTW, how much solar power do you have on your roof in NY that you can power your car and house for free? We have both solar panels and solar heating for water (pool) and we are no where near break-even.
     
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  8. Xenius

    Xenius Member

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    Nope.

    It's really very simple, would you want to run an ICE car in an enclosed space with you in it? No? Why not?

    Now just take that and multiply it by a very large number and you have the number of cars on this planet, and the planet's atmosphere (an enclosed space).

    No thank you.

    Whether or not humans are changing the climate of the earth you'd have to be an idiot to think reducing CO2 emissions is a bad thing.
     
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  9. Zythryn

    Zythryn MS 70D, MX 90D

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    I don't think buying/owning/driving a Tesla would change anyone's opinion on CC.
    Awareness of the science may well make one change their minds, but owning a car certainly won't.

    If someone looks into the science more BECAUSE they bought a Tesla and become more curious about energy, I suppose you could say the Tesla indirectly changed their mind.
     
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  10. ABCCBA

    ABCCBA Member

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    Nope. The planet started warming many hundreds of thousands of years and the glaciers have been retreating ever since. My ownership of a Telsa Motor vehicle has NOTHING to do with saving the planet. I just like accelerating really quickly!
     
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  11. Chopr147

    Chopr147 Active Member

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    If I gave it some more thought maybe I would have phrased it differently.
    "Has buying a Tesla made you more aware about CC."

    I have a10kwh system and pay about $12 a month for electricity which is a basic service charge. In January and February when the "energy bank" has been depleted and winter weather is in full freeze mode, I may pay around $50 each month.
    I am now looking into getting about a 5kwh system for a smaller upstate vacation home.
    Solarcity will be coming by next week :)
     
  12. Petra

    Petra Member

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    The Leaf that my wife and I leased in 2012 as an experiment sold us on the potential for electric cars to, in general, offer a significantly better overall ownership experience than ICE vehicles. The Model S delivered on that potential. Yes, she's an electrical engineer and I'm one of those self-taught engineer-lite tech people who has done engineering work and, yes, that's what caused us to gravitate toward BEVs (I've also been following BEVs since the launch of the EV-1, when I was in middle school)... but we're also car people.

    On the subject of AGW or climate change, I take a practical approach: I am not a climatologist and I do not have the time to go through the necessary foundation material and then go through the piles of peer reviewed studies necessary to arrive at what I would consider an informed opinion about the potential for anthropogenic or non-anthropogenic global climate change (aside from us not living in a static system, of course). What I will say, however, is that we should be working toward maximizing our usage of clean and renewable sources of energy and minimizing emission of pollutants (nitrogen oxides, particulate matter, oxocarbons, etc.). Why? Because pollution, local or otherwise, sucks and negatively impacts all of us in one way or another (this is coming from someone who has lived in both the SF Bay Area and So Cal and has minor respiratory issues). To put it crudely, there are a lot of things we don't yet fully understand, but you'd think that we'd have a handle on not sh*tting in our own pool just because it's easy and convenient in the immediate.
     
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  13. Drivin

    Drivin Member

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    #13 Drivin, Aug 3, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2016
    Using that same silly argument, one wouldn't want to be in a room filled with 9 supermodels because of all the CO2 they give off (9 supermodels=same CO2 as burning 1 gallon of gas. I don't know how long a car would run idling on one gallon of gas, but that is probably longer than I can entertain 9 supermodels).

    And never mind getting physical with several of them since that would accelerate the amount of CO2 production.
     
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  14. Eclectic

    Eclectic Member

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    Short answer: Nope.

    Longer answer: If my P85D was no better than average in performance and if it was a pain to recharge and if it was unreliable, I wouldn't think any different about anything other than Tesla. The fact that is is fun to drive, easy to charge and reliable changes my opinion about only one thing: Tesla. They make damn great vehicles. They have made cars a lot smarter in design and function.

    The only tangential opinion it may have affected is whether I think that EVs are ready for prime time. Before owning a Tesla I would have said no. After, I say yes, in certain situations.

    I also think it's pretty neat to consider that I could, with a proper capital outlay, have an exhilarating performance vehicle that is literally powered by sunshine from my roof.

    As for climate change, like @Petra, I am not a climatologist and I have not studied the issue enough to have an opinion, but the idea of not "sh*tting in our own pool" resonates with me. So while I wouldn't support policies that shut down fossil fuel use or that penalize people for using fossil fuels, I definitely think it's a good idea to use technology, when financially prudent, to make the world a cleaner and healthier place.
     
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  15. Drivin

    Drivin Member

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  16. Saghost

    Saghost Active Member

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    I've been convinced for some time that our climate is changing, and reasonably convinced that humans are at least contributing to it - and I'm not getting my Tesla for a couple more weeks (but it's replacing a Volt...)

    How much of an impact on us or the rest of the life on the planet these changes will have, how far they will go - those are open questions in my mind.

    I've had solar panels for several years now. It wasn't the climate change that drove me to the EVs or the panels. I like the independence, reliability, and redundancy aspects. A gas or diesel car is pretty much dependant on the availability of those specific fuels where you are.

    An electric car isn't - between grid power, solar panels, and various types of generators, you can charge and run one under pretty much any circumstances. You could even hook a gassifier to a gas powered generator and run it off of wood chips or grass clippings...

    (I also love the driving experience - silence, instant torque, the usual things. :) But I didn't know that going in.)

    Solar panels have already reached the point where they become an investment with payoffs not far off of Wall Street levels and well ahead of most bonds/savings accounts, and prices continue to fall. Combined with a suitable battery system, they can make power outages irrelevant (I'm still waiting for a good Lithium system at a reasonable price. I looked at the Powerwall, but since I have microinverters it isn't ideal. I'm watching to see how this "AC battery" concept works out in practice.)

    But there's another whole side to this - all of the pollution from ICE cars and the oil industry aside from CO2. Here's an article full of other things to worry about that seems well written but I haven't fact checked...

    Air Pollution & Water Pollution – Top 10 Toxic Fossil Fuel Ingredients
     
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  17. erthquake

    erthquake Member

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    I'm buying a Tesla because of human induced climate change. I'm trying to do the best I can for the future of my and everyone else's kids and grandkids. My 17 year old 4-banger Mazda is getting long in the tooth and last year I started looking at hybrids. I've wanted a Tesla ever since the Roadster, but could never afford one. The Model 3 will finally allow me to own a fully electric car.

    I have an MS in Geophysics and got halfway done toward a PhD, and I still have many friends in the earth sciences. So I trust the research backing up our role in climate change.

    It really bothers me that there's a perception that climate and other scientists "do it for the money." Most of the science is done by professors and their graduate students. The professors don't live off the grant money. They're salaried. The grant money goes to pay for the costs of research which include equipment, lab costs, experiment costs, grad student stipends, etc.

    I can tell you that few in academia do it for the money. The hours are long and the pay is relatively low, especially if you're not tenured. If they want money, they go into the private sector. But scientists love what they do. They like solving puzzles. It can be just as exciting if results don't match previous predictions because now there are new problems to solve and knowledge to be gained.

    They're not perfect. They can be susceptible to dogmatic thinking. But in the long run, the truth wins out.

    I wish there were more open-minded people like you, chopr. Enjoy your exploration. It can be fascinating and scary, but as long as we have people willing to recognize the problem, we can the figure out how to fix it :)
     
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  18. S'toon

    S'toon Knows where his towel is

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  19. deonb

    deonb Active Member

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    Elon Musk and his friends became far richer off climate change policies than Al Gore and his friends.

    If you're going to shape your thoughts based on whether other people make money off it or not, there won't be a lot of things left for you to take a stand on.
     
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  20. 182RG

    182RG Free The Service Manuals From Tyranny

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    Climate what? Never heard of it.

    Technology and performance. The polar bears are on their own.....
     
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