Haters gonna hate

[vfx]

...The big difference is Fisker...Their next step is build a lower cost, less luxurious more practical model. Tesla needs to move from an amazing sports car but probably the antonym of luxury to a real luxury sedan.

Interesting that both Tesla and Fisker have changed their stated program here. Both promised to first build a luxury sedan and then a low cost car for the masses. Fisker even got government funding based on this claim.

Now both have renegged on this promise. It became obvious to both that to repurpose the existing platform they already had in front of them they could amortize the costs if they dropped the low cost vehicle idea. So we get a Surf and a Model X and a Sunset and a "Model R" All before the Blue Star and Nina are even discussed.

Tesla is the worse offender here. I was invited by Fisker to a showing of the Nina so presumably the have something built but Tesla does not even know what the platform car after the Model X will be (I just called it a "Model R" assuming it will be a next gen Roadster) so the BlueStar is looking like a MY 2020. Disappointing because that's what excited me more.

 

[AnOutsider]

Interesting that both Tesla and Fisker have changed their stated program here. Both promised to first build a luxury sedan and then a low cost car for the masses. Fisker even got government funding based on this claim.

Now both have renegged on this promise. It became obvious to both that to repurpose the existing platform they already had in front of them they could amortize the costs if they dropped the low cost vehicle idea. So we get a Surf and a Model X and a Sunset and a "Model R" All before the Blue Star and Nina are even discussed.

Tesla is the worse offender here. I was invited by Fisker to a showing of the Nina so presumably the have something built but Tesla does not even know what the platform car after the Model X will be (I just called it a "Model R" assuming it will be a next gen Roadster) so the BlueStar is looking like a MY 2020. Disappointing because that's what excited me more.

You have good points there. It does seem Fisker is ahead on its low-cost car thing, but it's also possible Tesla is just keeping their plans closer to the vest while pushing S, X and the variants. If Bluestar is set for say 2014, then it makes sense to fill in the gaps with additional models that they can bring to market quicker.

 

[rolosrevenge]

With the Leaf filling the EV for the masses space right now, I think both Tesla and Fisker are doing the right thing. Tesla can't compete for low cost mass manufacturing yet, but if they go a luxury track, they get more established, become profitable, and then add the lower cost EVs.

 

[vfx]

... but it's also possible Tesla is just keeping their plans closer to the vest while pushing S, X and the variants.....

My Tesla inside info says it's like i wrote above. Unless "close to the vest" means liying to me, they don't even have the "Model R" figured out let alone the next platform.

 

[rabar10]

Unless "close to the vest" means liying to me, they don't even have the "Model R" figured out let alone the next platform.

Concept or design work for either of those would be wasted anyways if they don't get Model S right. May as well focus efforts on the project that will sustain the company, and learn some lessons related to mass-manufacturing etc., before going too far down the design path.

Elon has this issue at both of his companies - his stated long-term goals for either company (or industry) are nowhere within immediate range, so best to make sure the company still exists while working to close the gap. My two cents.

 

[rolosrevenge]

We need to get this thread back on topic. I really hate the Volt, and everything it stands for :tongue:

 

[bonnie]

I really hate overcooked peas. I know. That makes me a hater. I can live with that. I cannot live with overcooked peas, however.

 

[vfx]

I hate that I use the word hate.

 

[rabar10]

We don't take kindly to folks that don't take kindly.. 'round here.

 

[AnOutsider]

My Tesla inside info says it's like i wrote above. Unless "close to the vest" means liying to me, they don't even have the "Model R" figured out let alone the next platform.

I was under the impression that Model R (next roadster) was after Bluestar? Unless you mean a cabrio/spyder version of Model S, which I suppose is possible since it's just a variant.

 

[vfx]

I was under the impression that Model R (next roadster) was after Bluestar? Unless you mean a cabrio/spyder version of Model S, which I suppose is possible since it's just a variant.

That's just it. They do not even know what that next one after Model X is, but it's not the third platform Bluestar.

 

[AnOutsider]

That's just it. They do not even know what that next one after Model X is, but it's not the third platform Bluestar.

Gotcha. Perhaps they're waiting to see the reception to S and X. I guess if it does really well, they'll have that brand recognition and can push for Bluestar. If not so hot, may need to push S, X and variants a while longer.

 

[vfx]

...If not so hot, may need to push S, X and variants a while longer.

Good theory.

 

[Norbert]

Surely a lot depends on the success of Model S, but aside from that, I think the most recent plan was to bring out something new about every year.

 

[Norbert]

Tesla is the worse offender here. I was invited by Fisker to a showing of the Nina so presumably the have something built but Tesla does not even know what the platform car after the Model X will be (I just called it a "Model R" assuming it will be a next gen Roadster) so the BlueStar is looking like a MY 2020. Disappointing because that's what excited me more.

Earlier this year, the timeframe for Bluestar was still 2015/2016.

My Tesla inside info says it's like i wrote above. Unless "close to the vest" means liying to me, they don't even have the "Model R" figured out let alone the next platform.

Doesn't sound very convincing to me, there don't seem to be any other signs that plans have changed, except for what was said about contracts with Toyota (as a positive). However there was the statement that *more* things are happening than are being announced, so I'll probably reduce my level of re-iterating old announcements. Just hate to see you giving up confidence for apparently no good reason. Besides, any uncertainty about Model "R" (info about which so far has been much more vague in any case) doesn't necessarily reflect on Bluestar.

 

[bonnie]

I'd never want to make definitive statements for too far out into the future - markets change, plans adjust - and if you're on record announcing a future vehicle and change those plans, it can impact credibility. I'm not saying that's the reason, but I'd be very careful with information I shared publicly, especially far reaching.

Apple, for instance, saves the big 'ta daaaaa' for the moment they can bring it out on stage. Intel doesn't talk specifically about what the next new product will be. Anytime you change what you introduce from what you announced, it doesn't matter if it's cooler/faster/cheaper - someone, somewhere will see that as a negative.

 

[vfx]

... Anytime you change what you introduce from what you announced, it doesn't matter if it's cooler/faster/cheaper - someone, somewhere will see that as a negative.

Also, if you tell your competitor what you are doing they can build a competing product.

 

[doug]

Then there's also the Osborne effect.

 

[Tempus]

Then there's also the Osborne effect.

trying to figure out how the Green Goblin fits into this and failing. (i think i missed this reference)

 

[doug]

Sorry. Wikipedia seems to have a resonable enough explanation:
Osborne effect - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia