Have Tesla's new video recording rules changed your mind about signing up for FSD Beta

[bjrosen]

I've read that Tesla is now requiring you to consent to their storing the in car video along with your VIN number. Tesla is doing it to limit their legal jeopardy but it will increase the legal jeopardy of the driver. In the case of an accident there will be video of the Tesla driver and not the other vehicles driver so even if both driver's did something stupid there will only be evidence against the Tesla driver.

I haven't received FSD Beta yet, I'm at 98, but I'm thinking that it isn't worth the added legal risk vs no practical benefit from FSD. I'm interested in FSD from a scientific standpoint, I only bought it so that I could watch their progress. But until they reach at least Level 4 there is no value to FSD, it's more work monitoring a Level 2 system than just driving the car yourself.

 

[alee]

I would not be surprised to see it be required with standard AP sooner than later.

What use case are you afraid of where "if both driver's did something stupid there will only be evidence against the Tesla driver"? What possible piece of incriminating evidence is this camera going to produce? Think about it. If you are seated, hands on the wheel, and paying attention, the interior camera is, if anything, one more piece of evidence in your favor that you were alert and in-control.

If you're using a weight to defeat AP, looking at your phone, eating while driving, playing with the screen, turning around to talk to your passenger, etc. when an accident occurs, well... yeah going to be your own fault and the camera will support that action.

There is no legal jeopardy from the camera if you are paying attention and in control. There's a reason why dashcams with interior cameras are now being added as compliance tools for truck drivers already. Insurance always wants to know who's making bad choices.

 

[Tam]

...There is no legal jeopardy from the camera if you are paying attention and in control. There's a reason why dashcams with interior cameras are now being added as compliance tools for truck drivers already. Insurance always wants to know who's making bad choices.

It's easy for us to be high on morality until we got caught in a weak moment that's captured by Tesla camera.

In a perfect world, we would all be angels with no mistakes.

However, since we are not, that's why the U.S. has the Fifth Amendment to protect faulty humans from self-incrimination.

 

[ATPMSD]

I don’t remember agreeing to all these requirements when I bought FSD, which of course I have yet to be provided with.

 

[alee]

It's easy for us to be high on morality until we got caught in a weak moment that's captured by Tesla camera.

In a perfect world, we would all be angels with no mistakes.

However, since we are not, that's why the U.S. has the Fifth Amendment to protect faulty humans from self-incrimination.

What you're suggesting here is "good thing nobody saw what I was actually doing when I killed the pedestrian".

Again, I ask what will that camera capture that isn't going to be something that we should truly be liable for? There are a million reasons you'll get away with something without it, but with it, the only thing it will do is keep you honest.

 

[jebinc]

Glad I’m out.

 

[boonedocks]

A

Glad I’m out.

Any updates with the “latest & greatest” Refresh Software updates for your car since opting out?

 

[jebinc]

A

Any updates with the “latest & greatest” Refresh Software updates for your car since opting out?

Yes, still running a neutered 10.4 firmware, but the car has been in the SC since Monday morning, when 10.5 came out. Won’t update until it’s out of service mode. I figure it will get 2021.40.6.

 

[nvx1977]

I've read that Tesla is now requiring you to consent to their storing the in car video along with your VIN number. Tesla is doing it to limit their legal jeopardy but it will increase the legal jeopardy of the driver. In the case of an accident there will be video of the Tesla driver and not the other vehicles driver so even if both driver's did something stupid there will only be evidence against the Tesla driver.

I haven't received FSD Beta yet, I'm at 98, but I'm thinking that it isn't worth the added legal risk vs no practical benefit from FSD. I'm interested in FSD from a scientific standpoint, I only bought it so that I could watch their progress. But until they reach at least Level 4 there is no value to FSD, it's more work monitoring a Level 2 system than just driving the car yourself.

This video evidence would only come to light if the owner decided to blame Tesla/FSD for the accident. I personally hate that frequently the party at fault of an accident lies to the police when they come on scene. I am grateful my Tesla can record footage and be used to determine the truth. I think all cars should be doing this. We should all strive to take responsibility when we make a mistake. If I f*cked up by not paying attention while on FSD, I don't plan on blaming Tesla, regardless of whether the cabin footage is in their possession or not.

 

[Dan D.]

I've read that Tesla is now requiring you to consent to their storing the in car video along with your VIN number. Tesla is doing it to limit their legal jeopardy but it will increase the legal jeopardy of the driver. In the case of an accident there will be video of the Tesla driver and not the other vehicles driver so even if both driver's did something stupid there will only be evidence against the Tesla driver.

I haven't received FSD Beta yet, I'm at 98, but I'm thinking that it isn't worth the added legal risk vs no practical benefit from FSD. I'm interested in FSD from a scientific standpoint, I only bought it so that I could watch their progress. But until they reach at least Level 4 there is no value to FSD, it's more work monitoring a Level 2 system than just driving the car yourself.

What you're suggesting here is "good thing nobody saw what I was actually doing when I killed the pedestrian".

Again, I ask what will that camera capture that isn't going to be something that we should truly be liable for? There are a million reasons you'll get away with something without it, but with it, the only thing it will do is keep you honest.

Two drivers drive beside each other, both texting on their lap. For whatever reason both cars change lanes into each other and collide, could even be FSD and BlueCruise's fault, but neither driver was paying attention. Of course they both deny using a cellphone.

Only the FSD driver has in-cabin video of him not paying attention.

I guess the posters are suggesting the FSD driver may be at a disadvantage when that video is in evidence.

 

[PDX-Y]

In the case of an accident there will be video of the Tesla driver and not the other vehicles driver so even if both driver's did something stupid there will only be evidence against the Tesla driver.

It's not recoverable by anyone but Tesla. I mean, this is true, but it's only relevant in the context of an accident that results in a court case big enough to produce a subpoena to Tesla, which they would surely fight, etc... This is plausible if a billionaire is involved in a fatal collision I guess, but not for any kind of normal accident process.

 

[Tam]

...What you're suggesting here is "good thing nobody saw what I was actually doing when I killed the pedestrian"...

I respect your high morale but I will continue to keep my U.S. Fifth Amendment to protect faulty humans from self-incrimination.

 

[alee]

Two drivers drive beside each other, both texting on their lap. For whatever reason both cars change lanes into each other and collide, could even be FSD and BlueCruise's fault, but neither driver was paying attention. Of course they both deny using a cellphone.

Only the FSD driver has in-cabin video of him not paying attention.

I guess the posters are suggesting the FSD driver may be at a disadvantage when that video is in evidence.

Yeah the thing is both sides would have their phone records subpoenaed long before the cabin cameras is subpoenaed. It would really have to go to court before someone goes through a lengthy discovery.

 

[EVNow]

I respect your high morale but I will continue to keep my U.S. Fifth Amendment to protect faulty humans from self-incrimination.

Note to self : Stay away from Visalia, CA

 

[Tam]

Note to self : Stay away from Visalia, CA

Yes, we are law abiding citizens: Just hours before the Covid-19 California ban on bars in March last year, we would beat the deadline because "Alcohol is a disinfectant, too,"

 

[PDX-Y]

It's easy for us to be high on morality until we got caught in a weak moment that's captured by Tesla camera.

In a perfect world, we would all be angels with no mistakes.

However, since we are not, that's why the U.S. has the Fifth Amendment to protect faulty humans from self-incrimination.

So... I get what you're saying here. But as a matter of legal pedantry this is wrong. The fifth amendment is a protection against compelled self-incriminating testimony. It says nothing about the ability of others (like Tesla) to testify to what they know about your behavior. The sort of protection you're thinking about is provided by the **fourth** amendment, which constrains the ability of the government to search and seize your (also Tesla's) person/house/papers/effects (which obviously includes data) without a proper warrant from a court.

Clearly Tesla isn't going to be handing random parties to a traffic accident access to their internal data. But courts can absolutely compel them to do so, and the constitution doesn't prevent that.

Basically: there's no constitutional provision for destruction of evidence. If you don't want someone to have incriminating evidence about you, you need to see that they don't get it. Which means not driving the FSD beta, yeah.

 

[Phlier]

"Have Tesla's new video recording rules changed your mind about signing up for FSD Beta?"

No.

 

[juliusa]

No. I'm all for having the video - the more the better. If something goes wrong, I want the truth to come out to ensure a fair and equitable outcome of any legal proceedings. I'm disappointed my car does not have an in-car camera.

 

[hellocar]

Yup, I have absolutely no concern about the recording or VIN association. Seems very reasonable to me.

 

[Unclepaul]

Similar concerns about the Tesla Safety Score they maintain to determine the good or bad qualities of the driver.

If you drive in a safe manner, you will be rewarded with lower insurance quotes. Eratic drivers will pay more.