Help saving a friend from buying a Porsche Taycan in Raleigh, NC

[ucmndd]

It still doesn't explain, how an independent, non biased government body determines the EPA rate as it does.

You're right. The other article I provided in post #34 does.

The Secret Adjustment Factor Tesla Uses to Get Its Big EPA Range Numbers

How Tesla puts distance between itself and the competition while still playing by the EPA's rules.

www.caranddriver.com

To cut to the chase, the "independent, non biased government body" does almost no testing directly. The automakers do it themselves. And the regs include a big "adjustment" factor that automakers can apply to make the numbers look like they want.

 

[orlando-model-s]

This explains the situation well. Note that it’s currently perfectly legal, but leads to wildly divergent and unrealistic results.

The Secret Adjustment Factor Tesla Uses to Get Its Big EPA Range Numbers

How Tesla puts distance between itself and the competition while still playing by the EPA's rules.

www.caranddriver.com

Oops, I missed the attached article, just read it, pretty dope, though, I am still confused.
It seems in last paragraph, it equits Tesla from fraud or any wrong doing.

I am baffled though, why would other brands not do the exact same thing Tesla does legally, and by doing that, they might improve there standing?

Definitely not good conscious and fairness.

 

[orlando-model-s]

I've given lots of strangers a ride in my cars and have let friends drive my cars.

I have not let strangers or stranger's friends drive my car. (Well I have in college and regretted it).

You have the Tesla experience to share with your friend. Convince him to test drive one at a used car dealership, he is intending to buy a high performance EV, not some random forum member's car.

Thx for clarifying,
However, scientifically, and I can prove it... A strangers friend is as stranger as a stranger himself.
But thx for clarifying.

I did send my "Friend" to Lexus and Porsche dealers to test drive the plaid, as a member here and you suggested.

I hope Those dealers don't read this forum, though...

 

[FlatSix911]

You may want to give your friend my latest article

Porsche Whistleblower: “60% of all delivered Taycan have battery issues that caused replacements, damages and fires”

“Six out of ten Porsche Taycan” ever delivered have a problem with battery management that affects and damages battery cells, requires replacement of cells and batteries, and is causing vehicle fires, according to a source working at Porsche’s headquarters in Zuffenhausen, Germany. Porsche is...

www.teslarati.com

Wow, there are some serious issues alleged in the article... thanks for sharing.

“Six out of ten Porsche Taycan” ever delivered have a problem with battery management that affects and damages battery cells, requires replacement of cells and batteries, and is causing vehicle fires, according to a source working at Porsche’s headquarters in Zuffenhausen, Germany. Porsche is reportedly hiding the problem from customers and authorities and quietly replacing damaged battery cell modules without informing customers to cover up the problem. Tesla offered to help Porsche with battery management through Audi contacts years ago, but Porsche management at the time rejected any external help, saying it could handle everything internally, the source noted.

“The problem affects six of ten delivered vehicles,” the source, who could be described as a whistleblower, said."

 

[orlando-model-s]

Thank you for indeed a thoughtful response.
I have absolutely zero experience with the Taycan or even Porsche.
I am sure for some people there is no comparison with Porsche undefeated qualities.

My "Friend" indeed is considering the Porsche for those reasons, however, he is ignoring some undoubtful figures like range, warranty, supercharger network, FSD and OTA updates.
Can't argue about early model S depreciation, especially since Tesla has been dropping prices drastically and improving specs at the same time from 2012-2020.
Heck, the $69,420 model S long range of 2020 has far better performance, range and specs of 2012 performance model S at $115k, and perhaps more than $135k 2015, P85D ludicrous fully loaded.

Of course the last year is no long lasting proof of depreciation for any brand.

However, the circumstances here are for daily driver, 200 + miles per day, access to as many reliable chargers, not to "Save Money" on depreciation, although, I guess moving forward, all Teslas would keep more of their value, also due to FSD, but not only.

Good talk.

 

[shamoo]

I have a Porsche and I'm also a Tesla fan (although I'm not getting a Plaid, I'm getting a Long Range S). Outside of the speed (I think even the Long Range beats the Taycan 0-60?) I feel the Porsche is better in every way.

If I had the funds to buy a Plaid, I'd be getting a Sport Turismo Taycan for sure.

If you're trying to convince someone that the Plaid and its performance/tech is superior, that's one thing. But for someone who's into Porsche or knows the brand, overall it is a much better vehicle.

 

[SO16]

If the friend wants a Taycan, let them get a Taycan. No car purchase needs to be permanent.

 

[orlando-model-s]

I have a Porsche and I'm also a Tesla fan (although I'm not getting a Plaid, I'm getting a Long Range S). Outside of the speed (I think even the Long Range beats the Taycan 0-60?) I feel the Porsche is better in every way.

If I had the funds to buy a Plaid, I'd be getting a Sport Turismo Taycan for sure.

If you're trying to convince someone that the Plaid and its performance/tech is superior, that's one thing. But for someone who's into Porsche or knows the brand, overall it is a much better vehicle.

Yes, I could see your point, this is not the case as I explained. Daily driver.

 

[orlando-model-s]

If the friend wants a Taycan, let them get a Taycan. No car purchase is permanent.

I agree, we should have the write to do what ever we want, a good friend is there to educate, not to prevent choice.

 

[orlando-model-s]

You may want to give your friend my latest article

Porsche Whistleblower: “60% of all delivered Taycan have battery issues that caused replacements, damages and fires”

“Six out of ten Porsche Taycan” ever delivered have a problem with battery management that affects and damages battery cells, requires replacement of cells and batteries, and is causing vehicle fires, according to a source working at Porsche’s headquarters in Zuffenhausen, Germany. Porsche is...

www.teslarati.com

Wow, I did not notice you wrote it.
Please keep updating.
I personally hate to quote rumors, whistleblowers and general opinions, but if this is half true, this is bad.

 

[SO16]

Wow, I did not notice you wrote it.
Please keep updating.
I personally hate to quote rumors, whistleblowers and general opinions, but if this is half true, this is bad.

I have followed the author of that article for years. I’d be surprised if that article is wrong. (Although I hope it is incorrect because that will make many more people skeptical about EVs).

Even if the article is true, I think this potential Taycan owner can buy the car and be fine for quite a while.

 

[SmokyPeat]

I have a Porsche and I'm also a Tesla fan (although I'm not getting a Plaid, I'm getting a Long Range S). Outside of the speed (I think even the Long Range beats the Taycan 0-60?) I feel the Porsche is better in every way.

If I had the funds to buy a Plaid, I'd be getting a Sport Turismo Taycan for sure.

If you're trying to convince someone that the Plaid and its performance/tech is superior, that's one thing. But for someone who's into Porsche or knows the brand, overall it is a much better vehicle.

In every way besides performance? What about available charging network?

 

[AndreP]

Oops, I missed the attached article, just read it, pretty dope, though, I am still confused.
It seems in last paragraph, it equits Tesla from fraud or any wrong doing.

I am baffled though, why would other brands not do the exact same thing Tesla does legally, and by doing that, they might improve there standing?

Definitely not good conscious and fairness.

It’s not like the real number changes, what they’re selling is perception. Would you want customers thinking you’re over promising and underdelivering or vice versa?

I know which angle I’d play. Not like it matters anymore since any informed buyer now knows the numbers are much closer in reality.

 

[montanaco]

Thank you for indeed a thoughtful response.
I have absolutely zero experience with the Taycan or even Porsche.
I am sure for some people there is no comparison with Porsche undefeated qualities.

My "Friend" indeed is considering the Porsche for those reasons, however, he is ignoring some undoubtful figures like range, warranty, supercharger network, FSD and OTA updates.
Can't argue about early model S depreciation, especially since Tesla has been dropping prices drastically and improving specs at the same time from 2012-2020.
Heck, the $69,420 model S long range of 2020 has far better performance, range and specs of 2012 performance model S at $115k, and perhaps more than $135k 2015, P85D ludicrous fully loaded.

Of course the last year is no long lasting proof of depreciation for any brand.

However, the circumstances here are for daily driver, 200 + miles per day, access to as many reliable chargers, not to "Save Money" on depreciation, although, I guess moving forward, all Teslas would keep more of their value, also due to FSD, but not only.

Good talk.

I mean, just because he doesn’t want a tesla doesn’t mean he’s uneducated. Specs and stats don’t really matter to car enthusiasts, especially if their priorities are driving feel, design, and quality. No one can touch Porsche on that.

Also Porsche models have a history of appreciating in value. Their EVs are too new to predict if they will follow that trend but it’s not unheard of, and I have close friends that have made money when they’ve sold their Porsche.

 

[orlando-model-s]

It’s not like the real number changes, what they’re selling is perception. Would you want customers thinking you’re over promising and underdelivering or vice versa?

I know which angle I’d play. Not like it matters anymore since any informed buyer now knows the numbers are much closer in reality.

Perfection?
Hyundai, kia, chevy, Nissan, Audi, VW, basically all companies are selling perfection, and Tesla is selling an realistic dream?
If it was only Porsche, I might have agreed, but it's not...
Need to come up with a different explanation.

 

[orlando-model-s]

I mean, just because he doesn’t want a tesla doesn’t mean he’s uneducated. Specs and stats don’t really matter to car enthusiasts, especially if their priorities are driving feel, design, and quality. No one can touch Porsche on that.

Also Porsche models have a history of appreciating in value. Their EVs are too new to predict if they will follow that trend but it’s not unheard of, and I have close friends that have made money when they’ve sold their Porsche.

No one said he doesn't want Tesla, I did say, he is uneducated with Specs, ranges, driving and experiencing Tesla, neither about some of Taycan limited specs.
The dealer told him 227(or maybe 199, could not confirm the actual range) on Porsche is closer to 300.
And that 2 year unlimited warranty is an addition to remaining, 23 month original warranty.
Both claims are terribly false.

If he did not want a Tesla, this whole conversation is mute.

 

[SO16]

Perfection?
Hyundai, kia, chevy, Nissan, Audi, VW, basically all companies are selling perfection, and Tesla is selling an realistic dream?
If it was only Porsche, I might have agreed, but it's not...
Need to come up with a different explanation.

He said Perception….not perfection.

 

[cucubits]

One more vote to let your friend buy the Taycan.

I'm about to trade in my Model S for a Porsche and I couldn't be more excited.

 

[orlando-model-s]

He said Perception….not perfection.

Oops

 

[SmokyPeat]

He said Perception….not perfection.

Also, moot and mute are two distinctly different things.