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Hey, y'all, Toyota believes BEVs are impossible...

Discussion in 'Cars and Transportation' started by JohnSnowNW, Jul 22, 2015.

  1. JohnSnowNW

    JohnSnowNW Active Member

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  2. Johan

    Johan Took a TSLA bear test. Came back negative.

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    NiMh is state of the art, right?
     
  3. mwulff

    mwulff Member

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    That's funny. Apparently my car is impossible. Hmm I'll just order a mirai instead... Oh wait I can't.... Because there are no hydrogen gas stations.
     
  4. Grendal

    Grendal Active Member

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  5. gavine

    gavine Petrol Head turned EV Enthusiast

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    Can someone explain why anyone would buy a hydrogen car? It basically equals a gas car, only much more expensive and no place to fill it. Other than zero emissions, is there any other reason for them? I can see them being viable if lithium-ion was never invented and petroleum ran-out, but right now I see no reason for them. Please shed some light, if there is any.

    If you just want to be green, then electric seems to make more sense, especially since you can charge at home and publicly on the rare occasion that you need to.
     
  6. yobigd20

    yobigd20 Well-Known Member

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    because there's nothing better than an OEM suicide car bomb.
     
  7. gordo

    gordo Member

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    Maybe you have a retro 80s thing going on? The Mirai does 0-60 in around 9 seconds -- so that's 80s-era acceleration for you... plus it features a "touchscreen" from the 80s as well:

    2016_toyota_fuel_cell_vehicle_012.jpg
     
  8. SmartElectric

    SmartElectric Active Member

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    The irony is that fuel cell cars require a battery for regenerative braking anyway...
     
  9. Grendal

    Grendal Active Member

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    Here is a rant I posted when some commenter (as they always seem to do) flatly said that HFCV were the future:

    In what way is a HFCV better? Saying it is means nothing. Show how it is better. What specifications does it have to show that it is better? Let me reiterate the important questions for future sales to customers:

    Is it faster? Nope.
    Is it quicker? Nope.
    Is it easier to fuel? It takes twice as long as a gas car.
    Does the fuel cost less? Nope.
    Is the car less expensive? Definitely not. It's quite a bit more expensive.
    Is it more efficient? Questionable.
    Is it so clean that an environmentalist would want to own one? Very questionable. Evidence seems to indicate it is worse than a gas car.
    Does it look amazing? Nope.

    Let me add the question of where you get your fuel? Almost no where on the planet. There are something like 20 hydrogen stations in the USA. That means you only have to build about 10,000 more of them to service the possible needs. Care to know how much building 10,000 new hydrogen stations will cost? Think many billions and you'd be about right.

    So I am in the same camp as you. I just can't see any reason for someone to want to own an HFCV. What do you gain? Water coming out of a tailpipe? That's just a fancy magician's trick.
     
  10. JimmyAZ

    JimmyAZ Member

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    Wow. Complaining about energy density while only using NiMh batteries is comical. Best of luck with your hydrogen option. I'll keep my Tesla.
     
  11. JohnSnowNW

    JohnSnowNW Active Member

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    Not just regenerative braking, but for acceleration performance also.
     
  12. mkspeedr

    mkspeedr Member

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    Toyota is probably working with the gas companies. That way they can change the gas infrastructure over to a hydrogen infrastructure and still protect their billions of dollars.

    PS - that is the most awful dash!
     
  13. ggies07

    ggies07 Active Member

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    I'm really confused by Toyota's ongoing actions towards BEVs...are they really that butt-hurt over what happened with Tesla? From what I remember Toyota and Telsa engineers had differences, but Toyota was trying to go the BEV direction. Then Tesla told them they didn't have enough batteries for them to use and that's when the contract was not renewed. FROM THEN ON, Toyota has been all about slamming BEVs for their fuel cell project. Sad really.......
     
  14. gavine

    gavine Petrol Head turned EV Enthusiast

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    #15 gavine, Jul 22, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 13, 2016
    Toyota's CEO was high on electric cars back in 2010.



    2:00 mark for his speech.
     
  15. ZachShahan

    ZachShahan Member

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    After people kept sending me this, I finally wrote up a response... but one I've been planning to write about Toyota for years. I think this really explains why it is so reluctant to wake up (or tell the truth, whichever it is): Is The Toyota Prius Why Toyota Is Really So Anti-EV?

    Edit: arguments about Toyota being butt-hurt also seem viable.
     
  16. MsElectric

    MsElectric Active Member

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    Don't forget the green LEDs, also from the 80s. When the LED lights up that means it is on :)

    - - - Updated - - -

    I saw this on the Tesla Motors forum...

    Here are some of Toyota's finest engineers working quite hard at building an EV like Tesla but they are completely stumped by the "physics" of it :) According to them, hydrogen is the way to go as that's the technology that will most prolong their existing gasoline car sales.

    monkey_process[1].jpg
     
  17. ItsNotAboutTheMoney

    ItsNotAboutTheMoney Active Member

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    Think of it as using natural gas but a smoother ride because your car doesn't need lots of explosion to make it run. With an HFCV you can guarantee no more than one explosion during the life of the car.
     
  18. CliffG

    CliffG Member

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    no, no, no. you've got it backwards... HFCVs are for selling, not for buying. Toyota won't buy any of these POSs and they can't see past that. You wouldn't. I wouldn't (okay, I used to think HFCVs were a cool idea, until the reality sank in). Hell, I doubt all those gasoline addicts would.
     
  19. nwdiver

    nwdiver Active Member

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    You forgot the most important one...

    Does it serve as FUD for dimwitted consumers? Yup.

    AND unlike EVs... EVERY FCV MUST fill-up at a H2 station...
     

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