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High power wall charger

Discussion in 'Roadster' started by simonog, Feb 16, 2017.

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  1. simonog

    simonog Member

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    I am a UK owner of a late Roadster. I have just acquired a HPWC (second hand) which came from the US. Will this work in the UK - i.e. are there any differences in the UK and US specifications of these devices?

    Secondly, are there any issues to be aware of on installation? I realise it's a 70A device and will need appropriate RCB etc; are there any jumpers or links to change inside the charger?
     
  2. supersnoop

    supersnoop Tesla Roadster #334

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    There are two different Roadster HPWC's. One has a dial inside that you use the set the amperage. The other has to be sent to the manufacturer and programmed for different amperage.
     
  3. hcsharp

    hcsharp Active Member

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    supersnoop is correct. It depends on which version you have. I assume it's a Roadster HPWC and not a Model S version that you're trying to use with an adapter. The original Roadster wall charger (had a dial to set amps) does not work very well with the late model Roadsters (v 2.0 and later).
     
  4. simonog

    simonog Member

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    Correct: it's a 70A Roadster charger (with the right plug on) but I can see no dial outside or inside to set amperage.

    I assume I limit the amps I let it draw in the car rather than on the charger?

    Key question: is there any difference in the European version of the devices? Inside it refers to the two lives and the earthed neutral (i.e. the US supply voltage) whereas I would connect it to a single live and neutral UK 240V with a separate earth (UK neutral isn't earth).
     
  5. hcsharp

    hcsharp Active Member

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    There's no difference between North American and EU version. You connect to Neutral and one of the three live (usually line 1) and Ground goes to PE. Do you know how many amps your HPC is programmed for? Is it 70A?

    Ultimately it's the car that decides how many amps to pull. But it's not supposed to pull more than the charging equipment tells it to via the pilot signal. That means the car will draw the lesser of how many amps it's designed for (70A for the Roadster) or the number of amps signaled by the pilot.

    Does the code in UK limit how many amps you can pull from one phase at a residential building?
     
  6. supersnoop

    supersnoop Tesla Roadster #334

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    There are two Roadster HPC:
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  7. simonog

    simonog Member

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    It's your second picture. Does that have any key advantages/disadvantages from the other type?

    Henry: I don't know what it's programmed for. Is there a way to find out? I assume 70A as that's what the label says on the side.

    Most U.K. houses have a single phase supply with every third house on the same phase' the house main fuse is usually 100A. It's a good idea to check for a max draw from one device from code and I'll do it.
     
  8. supersnoop

    supersnoop Tesla Roadster #334

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    The second one was made by Clipper Creek and has to be sent to them if you want to limit the amperage.

    The first one was originally built by Tesla, if I'm not mistaken. It has a dial (or jumpers?) to set the installed amperage.
     
  9. DaveD

    DaveD EVs Kick Gas!

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    The Clipper Creek is generally acknowledged to be the more reliable/bulletproof of the two, and it can survive just fine mounted outside, exposed to the elements.

    I've got the Clipper Creek unit, and it has been working flawlessly since I installed it coming on to eight years ago.
     
  10. simonog

    simonog Member

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    Thank you everyone. I really appreciate the advice.

    My unit is indeed a Clipper Creek one. As I managed to carry it back from the US to the UK (literally - it's heavy!) I think getting it reprogrammed isn't an option.

    I'll hope it's not been limited, and get it wired up.
     
  11. hcsharp

    hcsharp Active Member

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    It's definitely "limited." Its only a question of what it's limited to. Can you ask the previous owner? Where was it installed? Most of the public locations for those were 70A. If you need to have it reprogrammed you could probably send just the circuit board to ClipperCreek for reasonable postage.
     
  12. simonog

    simonog Member

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    Henry: that's a good idea - I'll have a look at the board for ease of removal.

    Unfortunately the previous owner acquired it with the car and never installed it....

    Presumably if I plug the car into it the car will show what the maximum charge rate is. If it's less than 70A I can then consider getting the board reprogrammed, if indeed Clipper Creek still have the ability to do it.
     
  13. DaveD

    DaveD EVs Kick Gas!

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    I don't have the document in front of me, but I clearly recall that the instructions that came with my Clipper Creek unit stated that the unit was designed for, and needed, a 70A(@240VAC) supply. I don't recall there even being a mention in that document that the unit could be changed to signal less than the standard 70A. This was for a unit sent to me, a soon-to-be Roadster owner, as the EVSE I needed to have installed in my private residence. So, I'm highly confident that you'll find that your pristine Clipper Creek is programmed signal a 70A source.
     
  14. simonog

    simonog Member

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    Out of interest, how does the charger indicate the maximum current it can supply to the car? Is it one of the pins with a resistance or a voltage, and is it by any chance the same as a Type 2 charger would use?
     
  15. Stuart

    Stuart Roadster#326, ModelS#1409

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    The HPC (high power connector) is rated for up to 70A continuous, but your house wiring might not be.

    The HPC has internal settings to tell the car how much it can safely draw. You can rely on remembering to manually set your car to a safe current, but’s safer to have the HPC tell it the safe maximum too. The thread “Installing the HPC” has instructions.

    The Tesla signalling protocol is a superset of the J1772 signalling protocol, extended by Tesla, because the standard J1772 protocol only goes up to 30A maximum, and Tesla wanted additional signals for 32A, 40A, 48A, 60A, and 70A.
     
  16. sethr

    sethr CPO Roadster #1089

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    I have a Clipper Creek HPC, (which is called the TS-70). Mine is programmed to only put out a 40 amp max. However, I have upgraded my circuits, and Clipper Creek is sending me a unit to re-program it to the full 70 amps. You do need to do two things: one you must have at least 90 amp service/breaker, and two, you should check inside the unit to see that your wiring is for 70 amps, it looks like this.

    Screen Shot 2017-02-20 at 5.08.35 PM.png

    The very nice folks at Clipper Creek will help you through the process.
     
  17. hcsharp

    hcsharp Active Member

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    Actually that's fortunate because it probably never got changed from 70A to something else. DaveD's comment is spot-on, especially this one:
    I'm always impressed by long-time Roadster owners because they remember things from way back then. The SAE J1772 standard was later modified to go up to 80A. simonog, the J1772 signal is virtually identical to the IEC 62196 (Type 2) signal in the UK, Europe, and many other places. Type 2 is generally 3-phase so the standard only allows a signal up to 63A 3-ph, with a special exception to allow 70A when charging single phase. The exception is odd considering many countries require cutting the amps in half when only drawing from one phase in order to help balance the load.
     
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  18. simonog

    simonog Member

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    I am impressed with the brilliant expertise on this forum.

    My thanks to everyone. I will report how I get on!

    @sethr: I'm please to hear that clipper Creek are being so helpful on an old device. If the label in mine says anything except 70A I might need to contact the folks there too to see if I can reprogram mine. Do let us know how you get on please.
     
  19. DaveD

    DaveD EVs Kick Gas!

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    Having a huge chunk of money ($75K, in my case) that was completely at-risk of disappearing if Tesla didn't deliver, helped me focus intensely on any scrap of information about it that came my way! :)
     
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  20. sethr

    sethr CPO Roadster #1089

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    Just a quick update: I got the programmer from Clipper Creek, it's an easy process, they sent very precise instructions (with photos of what's what). It only took a few minutes to do the reprogramming, and I'm now charging at 70 amps. Super people - plus, they didn't charge me a cent, not even shipping!
     
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