Home charging advice

[Idk_what2eat]

So one of the things that was really surprising to me is that Pepco (services DC & MD) will give a $300 rebate on the Tesla HPWC. To qualify for the rebate you have to 1) purchase it new from an actual retailer (Just buy it directly from Tesla.. not from Ebay or reseller marketplaces like this forum), 2) Install it within a certain amount of time (I installed mine within about 6 months of purchase and still qualified), 3) provide pictures, serial numbers, receipts AND allow Pepco to monitoring your charging via 3rd party access to your Tesla account.

Its important to note this $300 rebate ONLY applies to the HPWC and not the mobile connector (which can also charge at L2 rates). I found this out as I already had the mobile charger with a 14-30R adapter and was using it to charge at L2 off 30A plug from my dryer. Pepco specifically wanted pictures and receipts of the HPWC installed and activated before issuing the $300 rebate. As I pointed out to the other poster, many of these programs required a dedicated L2 wall charger.. and its worth checking as there might be enough rebates, credits and incentives to make the HPWC as cheap as 14-50.

Since I have the wife's ID.4 plugged into the 14-50R outlet and now using the Chargepoint Home Flex, I'm going to see if I can get the $300 rebate again as I have now have a second L2 EVSE wall mounted charger.. specifically of the purpose of charging a second EV.

Details about Pepco's $300 rebate on a L2 EVSE wall mounted charger can be found here:

https://www.pepco.com/SmartEnergy/InnovationTechnology/Documents/Pepco_Residential_Rebate_Application.pdf

Oh and speaking of savings from installing a wall mounted L2 charger. Once I completed the forms above with Pepco, received the $300 rebate for the Tesla HPWC.. I was THEN invited to save even more money by receiving an invitation into Pepco's "off-peak, off-bill" plan which allows me to charge up using rates that cheaper from 8pm to 12noon M-F and all day on Saturdays, Sundays and holidays. Its important to point out this is a credit program, which means you will still get billed at the full rate for electricity 24/7, however ever quarter Pepco will calculate how much of your EV charging occurring during the off-peak and provides the credit in the form of a Amazon gift card.

Details about the "off-peak, off-bill" credit available from Pepco can be found here:

https://www.pepco.com/SiteCollectionDocuments/Pepco%20OPOB%20CPA.pdf

Its important to note that the Rebate + Off-Peak,Off-Bill credit programs are tied together. You must participate in one, to be invited to participate in the other. Here is the explanation:

How to Participate ​

This program is paired with Pepco's $300 Residential Rebate offering. Customers who have purchased and installed an eligible EV charger from July 2019 and on, can apply for the $300 rebate as well. In order to participate in the OPOB program, customers must first apply for the rebate to determine eligibility. Since charger data is used to calculate the credit amount, Pepco must ensure that the data is obtainable from the charger in addition to giving customers $300! Customers can indicate their interest in participating in the OPOB program by checking the bottom of the rebate application and submitting the signed customer participation agreement to [email protected].

If you have already applied for a charger rebate, you can let us know you're interested in the OPOB program by completing the customer participation agreement and emailing it to [email protected].

Thanks for the information!

Just a detail I noticed on the application form:
"Open to Pepco Maryland residential customers* who are installing a Pepco-recommended smart Level 2 EVSE. I understand that not all EV chargers are eligible for this rebate and that a list of qualifed EV chargers may be found at pepco.com/ElectricVehicles"

Did you submit the application and were approved even though you're a DC resident? I don't see anything on Pepco's site that mentions DC. Regardless, I'll be applying!

Thanks again!

 

[Tha_Ape]

Sadly, neither my state, county, city or local power company offered any rebates for charging. Only federal which is now gone as of 12/31/21.

Please, keep EVsplaining your justifications for why I shouldnt have purchased a Tesla because I couldnt justify the cost of an over priced Tesla charging solution. Maybe... I have other fun toys that are common to 14-50, and vacation property with a 14-50 for a trailer. My MYLR will be the downpayment for a non-Tesla going forward, which wont use a Tesla proprietary charging solution. 60A charging won't cut it in 5 years with 500+ mile range vehicles.

Penny wise, pound poor.

While I agree with much of your sentiment, I don't think amperage will be an issue in the future. Range of the vehicle doesnt matter, its how much you drive per day that does. I have a PHEV that I plug in after every trip (25mi range) and a MYLR that I plug in once a week or so. Whether my MYLR could go 25mi or 2500mi on a single charge I wouldnt need a larger circuit.

The only thing I could see requiring a larger circuit is if I bought a BIG EV, like a camper or a semi where 8kW charging wouldnt cut it.

 

[Jjrss]

While I agree with much of your sentiment, I don't think amperage will be an issue in the future. Range of the vehicle doesnt matter, its how much you drive per day that does. I have a PHEV that I plug in after every trip (25mi range) and a MYLR that I plug in once a week or so. Whether my MYLR could go 25mi or 2500mi on a single charge I wouldnt need a larger circuit.

The only thing I could see requiring a larger circuit is if I bought a BIG EV, like a camper or a semi where 8kW charging wouldnt cut it.

Im looking into the future for a usable EV truck for occasional hauling/towing. Ford Lightning is 80A bi-directional, it'll only go up from there. The 14-50 50A will take a lot longer to recharge the Lightning and may become an issue if I do a long weekend of towing and need to turn around and commute 80 miles the next day.

Lightning is a 1/2 ton towing capacity... I'm going to venture a guess that a 3/4 ton will need 100A for a decent recharge rate (miles/hour). No one wants a truck that takes a day and a half to recharge 300 miles of range.

⚡ 2022 Atlis XT Electric Pickup Truck First Look: 500-Mile Range, 15-Minute Charge

Atlis is targeting contractors and industrial customers with the XT, which offers plug-and-play powertrain and suspension bits for quick swaps.

www.motortrend.com

 

[dogmodes]

I've got both a 14-50 on a 40 amp breaker and a Tesla wall charger outside my house. The 14-50 was installed by me, using a really thick 50 foot cable from Home Despot, easy install. Wiring the 14-50 is not easy. I should have wired that first, with the box sitting on the bench, then run the cable back to the subpanel. Instead I wired the outlet, standing on a chair, as it is connected to an overhead beam. Not terribly difficult if you're handy, but the wire is super thick and getting all four wires in just the right place is not trivial. I had cleaned out that garage bay, (i have 3), so now i can keep the car indoors and charge it. Next year we'll replace my wife's aging Subaru with a Model Y, so two chargers makes life a bit easier.

I get that you probably won‘t go back and pull 6AWG, I wouldn’t since it’s already done. But you should probably tag the outlet so someone in the future doesn’t plug in expecting it to be a 50A charge plug. Yeah the current tesla mobile is limited to 32A so you’re good, but other chargers aren’t, including the tesla corded connector.

 

[Daekwan]

Thanks for the information!

Just a detail I noticed on the application form:
"Open to Pepco Maryland residential customers* who are installing a Pepco-recommended smart Level 2 EVSE. I understand that not all EV chargers are eligible for this rebate and that a list of qualifed EV chargers may be found at pepco.com/ElectricVehicles"

Did you submit the application and were approved even though you're a DC resident? I don't see anything on Pepco's site that mentions DC. Regardless, I'll be applying!

Thanks again!

Pepco has separate programs for DC & MD. I technically live in MD (albeit right on the DC border), so I went through the MD program.

Im not sure if the exact same rebates & off peak plans apply to DC residents, but more information about Pepco's DC program is here: Electric Vehicle Program DC | Pepco - An Exelon Company

 

[TIppy]

There is an adapter available that converts the Tesla proprietary wall connector to the standard J1772 connector. With this you can use the Tesla wall connector to charge other evs.

This is not the adapter that Tesla sells to convert level 2 chargers to the Tesla connector on the car.

 

[Geech72]

Thank you for your thorough answer. Believe it or not, I do want the Gen 3 Wall Connector but wanted to see if I can get by with a cheaper option since I am not sure how long I will be living at that home for. I'll live there for a year or two then rent it out. Looks like I'll just install the Gen 3 Wall Connector and try to find a tenant with a Tesla.

Once the electrical wire is run, and connected at the circuit box, it takes like 10 minutes to finish installing the wall charger. You could use the wall charger while you live there, very easily replace it with a 14-50 plug when you move out, and then take the wall charger with you.

 

[DayTrippin]

At our first house we went with a Nema 14-50 and the mobile charger for our MY LR. It worked pretty well and we could charge either of our electric cars but just left it normally for our Tesla. I found someone who did the install for $350 including the wire, conduit and receptacle. I had bought the Gen3 wall charger but weren't sure how long we'd still be living in that house so just went with the Nema.

We bought a house in Dallas and ended up wiring in the Gen3 and also another Nema 14-50. Both were pretty close to the breaker box but it was pretty full. Had to have a few tandem breakers to make it work. Total install for both, including wire, outlet and 6 breakers was about $750.

You might not think the extra current makes a difference over the 14-50 (32a) but I am already glad I did that. I still have a good charging rate while pre-conditioning the batteries or heating it up. Tonight it was the first day in the 20's and it was still charging pretty quickly and heating the car up as well. Also means I can top off more quickly even if just home for a little bit.

With just charging, it adds about 44 mile of range per hour. I think on the 14-50 it was about 30 miles or range per hour. That is quite an improvement. I can go from 20% to 80% charge in about 4 1/2 hours. I think with the 14-50 and mobile connector it was closer to about 6 3/4 hours.

The good thing is now I can keep the mobile connector in the car at all times in case of emergency. We have a model S coming soon so the faster charge times will be helpful for it and if we share the charger, it will be easier to keep them both charged.

 

[Daekwan]

At our first house we went with a Nema 14-50 and the mobile charger for our MY LR. It worked pretty well and we could charge either of our electric cars but just left it normally for our Tesla. I found someone who did the install for $350 including the wire, conduit and receptacle. I had bought the Gen3 wall charger but weren't sure how long we'd still be living in that house so just went with the Nema.

We bought a house in Dallas and ended up wiring in the Gen3 and also another Nema 14-50. Both were pretty close to the breaker box but it was pretty full. Had to have a few tandem breakers to make it work. Total install for both, including wire, outlet and 6 breakers was about $750.

You might not think the extra current makes a difference over the 14-50 (32a) but I am already glad I did that. I still have a good charging rate while pre-conditioning the batteries or heating it up. Tonight it was the first day in the 20's and it was still charging pretty quickly and heating the car up as well. Also means I can top off more quickly even if just home for a little bit.

With just charging, it adds about 44 mile of range per hour. I think on the 14-50 it was about 30 miles or range per hour. That is quite an improvement. I can go from 20% to 80% charge in about 4 1/2 hours. I think with the 14-50 and mobile connector it was closer to about 6 3/4 hours.

The good thing is now I can keep the mobile connector in the car at all times in case of emergency. We have a model S coming soon so the faster charge times will be helpful for it and if we share the charger, it will be easier to keep them both charged.

Generally speaking the HPWC with a 60A breaker should charge about 50% faster versus the mobile connector with the 14-50 adapter. So your experience of 44mor/ph vs 30mor/ph sound exactly right. That is a pretty significant difference. Unless the difference was outrageously more expensive, why wouldn't you want the option that gives you 50% faster charging?

You also never never know when you might need the extra charging speed. Could be coming home from a trip with an unexpected quick turnaround, or you woke up and forgot to plug in one night, or needto charge two EV's and are sharing a single charger, or you end up purchasing a future EV with a bigger (100+ kWH) battery. Even towing a trailer. Hell as you pointed out.. even the freezing cold affects charging rate/speed.

I understand why people go for the 14-50, its cheaper & more flexible. But the HPWC accepts the same wire as the 14-50.. and most people I know with a Tesla, aren't changing brands anytime soon. If anything it seems like most people with a Tesla, are more likely to get a second Tesla in the near future.. which means sharing a charger or power sharing a circuit with the HPWC. All things being equal.. give me the fastest home charging solution. I can always turn down the amperage if I need it to charge slower for some reason. With the 14-50 + mobile connector + adapter.. the only way to get it charge faster is to find a Supercharger lol.

One thing is for sure. There is no way I would be blowing money on tint, PPF, ceramic coatings and other cosmetic stuff people tend to do with their Tesla.. before I would spend the extra bucks to get the fastest home charging solution possible. Its an EV.. the most important part of the entire EV ownership process is making sure you keep the vehicle properly charged up. Life is already unpredictable enough.

 

[Plug Me In]

I’ve been using the mobile connector to 14-50 outlet with my Model S for almost 9 years now. When I got the car the only alternate charging option from Tesla was the $1500 HPWC and my choice was one of several made to keep the total cost below $100k . I keep it plugged in unsupported outdoors 24/7 and bring it along for longer road trips, 6 times/year or thereabouts, less during these pandemic end times.

I’ve had I think three cable failures over the years, first two replaced free under extended warranty, and the most recent this past summer costing $250. I’m more than likely going to get a MY this summer and I see the newer wall charger available and will likely get one of these for the convenience but I have no regrets about the 14-50 choice. Maybe one time over the years I had a quick turnaround on an empty battery but wasn’t a big issue and Superchargers everywhere now make it even less of a problem.

 

[plumazul]

I'll probably get another EV soon. Most likely will be a Tesla. But that's a good point. Thanks.

Why not just get an EVSE with a J-plug?? I bought one from Clipper Creek. Don't Teslas still come with the adapter?
I almost bought the Tesla EVSE since I thought I would only buy Teslas in the future. But if you deal with Tesla service long enough, your mind might change.

 

[DayTrippin]

You can get an adapter to use the Tesla wall charger with other EVs too. So that is an option if I have friends over with a BEV who don't have a Tesla. Most of them don't have 14-50 adapters for their portable chargers. This gives you Tesla to J1772.

https://www.amazon.com/Lectron-Adapter-Compatible-Connector-Destination/dp/B07YFY768S/ref=sr_1_1?crid=17VXRGDN5EJVQ&keywords=Lectron+-+Tesla+to+J1772+Adapter%2C+Max+40A+%26+250V+-+Compatible+with+Tesla+High+Powered+Connector&qid=1641224828&s=automotive&sprefix=lectron+-+tesla+to+j1772+adapter%2C+max+40a+%26+250v+-+compatible+with+tesla+high+powered+connector%2Cautomotive%2C254&sr=1-1

 

[roblab]

You don't want to regularly plug and unplug the NEMA 14-50 power plug from the receptacle as the connection will not remain tight over repeated plug and unplug operations. If you go this route plug in and leave it.

On the other hand, the plug was made to plug and unplug. I've had mine for years, from charging my RAV4EV until now., and it's been unplugged lots of times, like to go on vacations, with no looseness. If you need to unplug it just do it and don't worry about it.

I've had nothing but the 14-50 outlet for years and years, and it has always worked well. Buying a "charger" is a huge waste of money in my opinion, as the car charges at night. There is no need for a quick charger because you're asleep, and you won't know if the car finishes at 1 AM or 5 AM. Charging at night uses the cheaper rates for electricity, too. You DO NOT NEED a big, fast, expensive charger.

It's also possible to tighten the receptacle, but it's also a cheap part to replace. You can get a new outlet at The Home Depot for ten bucks or so. Unless you have to hire an electrician to unscrew 3 wires, you save big.

 

[LoudMusic]

I will be setting up home charging around February by getting a NEMA 14-50 outlet installed in my garage. I have already purchased a NEMA 14-50 adapter from Tesla.

I read here that NEMA 15-5 will suffice if I don’t drive much so I am thinking about setting up both NEMA 15-5 and 14-50 like this guy so that everday charging will be coming from the 15-5.

Should I buy another $275 Gen 2 Mobile Connector Bundle (which I believe came with my 2022 MY) or return the NEMA 14-50 adapter and buy the $400 Corded Mobile Connector (when in stock) that comes with the NEMA 14-50 adapter?

I purchased a second mobile connector and NEMA 14-50 adapter. I don't think it's necessary. One mobile connector should be fine. But I'm also a long time computer systems administrator and having redundant systems especially for critical infrastructure has always been important to me. The mobile connector is cheap and critical for the operation of the vehicle. It doesn't hurt to have two. For me one stays in the car and the other stays in the garage.

 

[Daekwan]

On the other hand, the plug was made to plug and unplug. I've had mine for years, from charging my RAV4EV until now., and it's been unplugged lots of times, like to go on vacations, with no looseness. If you need to unplug it just do it and don't worry about it.

I've had nothing but the 14-50 outlet for years and years, and it has always worked well. Buying a "charger" is a huge waste of money in my opinion, as the car charges at night. There is no need for a quick charger because you're asleep, and you won't know if the car finishes at 1 AM or 5 AM. Charging at night uses the cheaper rates for electricity, too. You DO NOT NEED a big, fast, expensive charger.

It's also possible to tighten the receptacle, but it's also a cheap part to replace. You can get a new outlet at The Home Depot for ten bucks or so. Unless you have to hire an electrician to unscrew 3 wires, you save big.

There are plenty of people who use 120V charging daily only and it 'works well' for them, after all, it can add about 50-60 miles of range if plugged in every night. While I certainly agree with you *DO NOT NEED a big, fast charger*. Reality is a bit different depending on your actual driving, usage, location scenario. For example in my state (MD).. you do NOT get access to those cheaper off-peak rates for electricity unless you have a big, fast charger. As I pointed out above, Pepco ties discounted EV off-peak energy rates to the use of a "smart" L2 Home Charger. And by smart = they want to monitor the device. It's also why Pepco wants people to use specific smart chargers because they know they can monitor them. Pepco is not the only company to do this as many energy providers want to monitor EV charging because it puts so much demand on their power grid.

While there is no need for a quick charger while you are sleeping, charging isn't something that absolutely everyone does while they are sleeping. I've had quite a few occasions where I've been running around, gotten home, and need to do a quick turnaround hours later.. all unplanned. Especially with the holidays. I just recently did over 600 miles of driving in a single weekend after Thanksgiving. Granted I could always hunt for a Supercharger to charge up faster, but that means additional time & effort away from my destination, paying much more expensive commercial rates per kWh, and possibly waiting in line or sharing a V2 charger. Why add extra headaches when a $500 charger hardwired to a 60A breaker is a very affordable way to have the fastest charging solution at home?

Also, let's be realistic about the price. The HPWC is $500. In comparison to the current price of my Tesla.. or a new 2022 MYP I'm currently debating buying (which will be $70,000 out-the-door including all taxes & fees). I would say it's pretty freaking hilarious to consider the $500 wall charger as a "huge waste of money".

 

[squidnozzle]

Also, let's be realistic about the price. The HPWC is $500. In comparison to the current price of my Tesla.. or a new 2022 MYP I'm currently debating buying (which will be $70,000 out-the-door including all taxes & fees). I would say it's pretty freaking hilarious to consider the $500 wall charger as a "huge waste of money".

There's a fallacy to think that once you've spent a large amount of money on something you should no longer bother weighing the cost/benefit of further purchases. To take it to an extreme, now you've spent all that money on your shiny new Tesla why not just start your fireplace with $100 bills?

 

[Midnightsun]

I've had quite a few occasions where I've been running around, gotten home, and need to do a quick turnaround hours later.. all unplanned. Especially with the holidays. I just recently did over 600 miles of driving in a single weekend after Thanksgiving. Granted I could always hunt for a Supercharger to charge up faster, but that means additional time & effort away from my destination, paying much more expensive commercial rates per kWh, and possibly waiting in line or sharing a V2 charger. Why add extra headaches when a $500 charger hardwired to a 60A breaker is a very affordable way to have the fastest charging solution at home?

Exactly. Been there, done that. When you only have 110v you are very limited, especially in cold weather where 110v cannot keep up with preconditioning/heat as the demand is higher than the input. Not that you need fast charging all the time but at least it is there when needed, same as more HP in a car.

 

[Daekwan]

There's a fallacy to think that once you've spent a large amount of money on something you should no longer bother weighing the cost/benefit of further purchases. To take it to an extreme, now you've spent all that money on your shiny new Tesla why not just start your fireplace with $100 bills?

I certainly agree with that. But I think paying $400 for the ability to infinitely charge my electrical vehicle 50% faster at home.. is a pretty damn good trade-off. And notice I said $400, while the price of the HPWC is actually $500. This is because you would still need to pay about $100 to purchase both the 14-50 receptacle and the 14-50 adapter for the mobile connector.

 

[jcanoe]

The Gen3 Wall Connector has features and capabilities that may be of benefit. The charging cable on the Gen3 Wall Connector is now 24 ft. in length versus 18.5 ft. for the Mobile Connector. The Gen3 Wall Connector is fully weather rated for outdoor installation. The Gen3 Wall Connector supports automatic load balancing.

This has been covered; when you add up all of the costs of installing a 14-50 receptacle, today, the additional cost of installing the Gen3 Wall Connector is around $200. If someone is installing a new circuit for charging a Tesla vehicle at home the Gen3 Wall Connector is the better option.

 

[Midnightsun]

Off topic but none the less. Wonder when they will implement specific car charging on the Wall Connector as promised. I have one at our office outdoors and would like to lock it in to only charge certain vehicles in our fleet. This is an option Tesla promised will be coming. My understanding is it can be told to only allow charging on selected serial numbers. Can't remember where I read this though.